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  1. #1

    LeaseWeb Deutschland takes my case to court in Amsterdam. Advise is needed.

    Hi,

    The problem started in 2019 when they redesigned their admin interface. We started having problems with not being able to see current invoices, we received multiple invoices for the same servers, and invoices which did not specify which equipment they was for.

    Since after several calls and emails we still could not get an answer on which invoices were correct and which were incorrect, our servers were deactivated.

    We then chose to end our collaboration with LeaseWeb. The last contact we had with LeaseWeb was 2019-08-19 when we sent the following email:
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Dear Leaseweb,

    As a customer we are very unhappy with your lack of responses to our questions, emails, and customer service. We have had nothing but problems since you upgraded / migrated / modified the customer portal as of April 8th.

    We will not pay any of the invoices below, (amount of ~€530) and we do not want to do any more business with you. It has taken too much of our time and effort to sort out your problems.

    We recently paid €613.69 for a 12 month contract for the our DE server. You are free to cancel/disconnect this server and use the €613.69 to pay any due invoices, even those that does not specify which equipment they refer to, and even those who have arisen because you do not answer the questions we have.

    We no longer have any confidence in you as a company, and we will not spend any more time solving problems for continued collaboration with your company.

    Regards
    xxx xxxx
    xxxxxxxx
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    The time goes any we are very happy with the other hosting provided that se moved to.



    But, In December 2020, I received a letter from Leaseweb's debt collection company TKB INCASSO regarding an invoice that was created at the end of 2020 for the amount of € 676.19 and applies to a new advance-payment for a new period for the server we had in DE which was cancelled.

    We dispute the invoice to both TKB and Leaseweb, but neither of these has responded.


    Yesterday I received a second letter (via regular post) from TKB INCASSO. They will bring the amount to court in Amsterdam if I don't wire the amount before 2021-01-27.

    Following url is a PDF of this letter: docdro.id/r1KYA4N (Add http if needed)


    I'm in desperate need for help. From what I understand, the court in Amsterdam will rule in LeaseWeb's favor if I cannot be present in person to dispute the invoice.

    What should/can I do?
    Last edited by rotkiv; 01-23-2021 at 12:49 PM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    Just ignore them. They are threatening to squeeze out your money. If you don't make payment, it is their responsibility to cancel the service with you, not to run after you like that.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by globalhostxyz View Post
    Just ignore them. They are threatening to squeeze out your money. If you don't make payment, it is their responsibility to cancel the service with you, not to run after you like that.
    Risky! You could be blacklisted by a whole host of hosts if you ignore them!

    My own instinct, and it is only that as I am not legally trained nor am I competent to offer legal advice, would be to write to the court explaining where you are and why it is impossible for you to attend, even more so given such short notice, and enclosing a copy of your cancellation letter. Send copies to Leaseweb Deutchland and TKB INCASSO.

    If the court case is a threat and there are no hearing details, simply write to TKB INCASSO explaining that you owe no such debt and enclosing a copy of your original cancellation letter. Point out that you have already given them this information and that they must inform you of the date, time and address of any court hearing they arrange in good time, minimum, say, 7 days if your are in Holland, 21 days if elsewhere. That's to give you time to write to the court, but don't tell them that.

    Be warned that Leaseweb Deutchland may well try to flog this case to another agency or even repeat more than once before they give up on it.

    The alternative is to consult a solicitor. Can you fix an appointment in time and still get that letter out? If it is merely a threat at this stage you have plenty of time because the debt agency cannot simply walk into court and demand a hearing on 27th Jan. They have to book just like anybody else and that can take weeks before a hearing happens.

    The important takeaway, though, is to respond decisively. Not to do so risks your good name with other providers. The final thing to do once the immediate threat is sorted out is to write to Leaseweb Deutchland's CEO or other highly ranked board member (no way it can get overlooked) pointing out their error and that you will take court action should they attempt to blacken your good name in any way whatsoever.

  4. #4
    That's put me off Leaseweb. If they changed their system which made managing billing difficult, then that's their problem, not yours. Then they have the check to chase you up for money afterwards. That is bad business.

    I was with RapidSwitch for several years which were excellent, i.e. I had some IPs using cPanel license that I wasn't using, and they didn't charge me for it. And when I stopped services with them, they didn't do the usual 30-day cancellation policy, and instead actually credited my money. I only stopped using them as no longer needed a VPS node that I had with them.

    Back to OP, it could affect credit score if you leave it. It is best to try to reach out to someone higher up at Leaseweb to work things out.

    Maybe you're dealing with someone new or who doesn't properly understand the issues you had with them.

    Good luck.
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  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by rotkiv View Post
    Hi,

    The problem started in 2019 when they redesigned their admin interface. We started having problems with not being able to see current invoices, we received multiple invoices for the same servers, and invoices which did not specify which equipment they was for.

    Since after several calls and emails we still could not get an answer on which invoices were correct and which were incorrect, our servers were deactivated.

    We then chose to end our collaboration with LeaseWeb. The last contact we had with LeaseWeb was 2019-08-19 when we sent the following email:
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Dear Leaseweb,

    As a customer we are very unhappy with your lack of responses to our questions, emails, and customer service. We have had nothing but problems since you upgraded / migrated / modified the customer portal as of April 8th.

    We will not pay any of the invoices below, (amount of ~€530) and we do not want to do any more business with you. It has taken too much of our time and effort to sort out your problems.

    We recently paid €613.69 for a 12 month contract for the our DE server. You are free to cancel/disconnect this server and use the €613.69 to pay any due invoices, even those that does not specify which equipment they refer to, and even those who have arisen because you do not answer the questions we have.

    We no longer have any confidence in you as a company, and we will not spend any more time solving problems for continued collaboration with your company.

    Regards
    xxx xxxx
    xxxxxxxx
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    The time goes any we are very happy with the other hosting provided that se moved to.



    But, In December 2020, I received a letter from Leaseweb's debt collection company TKB INCASSO regarding an invoice that was created at the end of 2020 for the amount of € 676.19 and applies to a new advance-payment for a new period for the server we had in DE which was cancelled.

    We dispute the invoice to both TKB and Leaseweb, but neither of these has responded.


    Yesterday I received a second letter (via regular post) from TKB INCASSO. They will bring the amount to court in Amsterdam if I don't wire the amount before 2021-01-27.

    Following url is a PDF of this letter: docdro.id/r1KYA4N (Add http if needed)


    I'm in desperate need for help. From what I understand, the court in Amsterdam will rule in LeaseWeb's favor if I cannot be present in person to dispute the invoice.

    What should/can I do?
    Do you live in (or company located in) the Netherlands? Or the EU more generally?

    If no, I don't see how this impacts you.
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  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by dominame View Post
    Risky! You could be blacklisted by a whole host of hosts if you ignore them!

    My own instinct, and it is only that as I am not legally trained nor am I competent to offer legal advice, would be to write to the court explaining where you are and why it is impossible for you to attend, even more so given such short notice, and enclosing a copy of your cancellation letter. Send copies to Leaseweb Deutchland and TKB INCASSO.

    If the court case is a threat and there are no hearing details, simply write to TKB INCASSO explaining that you owe no such debt and enclosing a copy of your original cancellation letter. Point out that you have already given them this information and that they must inform you of the date, time and address of any court hearing they arrange in good time, minimum, say, 7 days if your are in Holland, 21 days if elsewhere. That's to give you time to write to the court, but don't tell them that.

    Be warned that Leaseweb Deutchland may well try to flog this case to another agency or even repeat more than once before they give up on it.

    The alternative is to consult a solicitor. Can you fix an appointment in time and still get that letter out? If it is merely a threat at this stage you have plenty of time because the debt agency cannot simply walk into court and demand a hearing on 27th Jan. They have to book just like anybody else and that can take weeks before a hearing happens.

    The important takeaway, though, is to respond decisively. Not to do so risks your good name with other providers. The final thing to do once the immediate threat is sorted out is to write to Leaseweb Deutchland's CEO or other highly ranked board member (no way it can get overlooked) pointing out their error and that you will take court action should they attempt to blacken your good name in any way whatsoever.
    Also good advice if you have the wherewithal.
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  7. #7
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    Going to court cost a lot of money, lawyers are expensive and I really doubt they would really go to court for €676.19.

    Usually they are sending these letters to scare you in the hope you will pay but it's rarely going to court at least in canada but I guess it's pretty much the same in europe.

    In canada you are not required to comply with these letters you can safely ignore this unless it is a real court order.
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  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by funkywizard View Post
    Do you live in (or company located in) the Netherlands? Or the EU more generally?

    If no, I don't see how this impacts you.
    The company is located in Sweden, EU. But after spending some hours reading it seems like TBK can lock the funds on our bank-account in Sweden if they win the case in court in Amsterdam. This is done via European Account Preservation Order.

    Not sure if this applies to smaller amounts.

    What is sad about this is that I am a person who worries and only today I have had to spend 6 hours reading about law instead of spending time with the family. And every time there has been a letter in the mailbox from LeaseWeb / TKB, I have been reminded of all the problems we had with them and been pissed so that the rest of that day has been ruined.

    It becomes extra unpleasant as neither LeaseWeb / TKB responds to e-mails regarding this matter. It feels like you are dealing with a really rotten company that can resort to brutal methods to get money even if it were morally wrong.


    It will probably end up with me paying and putting everything behind me.

    The funny thing is that according to Leaseweb's terms, they will not reactivate the service once it has gone to debt collection, even if it is paid.

    In concrete terms, I will pay an advance payment for another 12-month (or 9 depending how you count) for a service, which will never be activated.

    From the beginning we had a monthly contract of € 55 per month, but the month during thier migration it consumed 67% more data than what was included in 100TB, so we got an extra invoice of € 3000 for that month. We disputed this fee as the admin interface did not show any data at all due to the problems of their migration. So LeaseWeb agreed to cancel this in exchange for us signing a 12-month contract for the server instead of a monthly contract. It was one month after this we had to leave LeaseWeb due to all other problems with thier migration.

    And so it ends up that we will pay 23 months more than we would have if we had kept the 1 month contract. Everything because of problems caused by thier migration and we being more kind than we should have been and accepted thier 12-month offer instead of disputing the €3000 amount in court and move to another provider right away.
    Last edited by rotkiv; 01-23-2021 at 05:40 PM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by dominame View Post
    Risky! You could be blacklisted by a whole host of hosts if you ignore them!

    Wait, are providers sharing data about customers with one another? -_-
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by rotkiv View Post
    It will probably end up with me paying and putting everything behind me.
    Save your money. Put the worries behind you by writing to a top board member, e.g. Chief Exec, CFO, MD, with a copy of your letter and the one to you from the credit agency, telling them you owe them nothing and they have no right to be sending anybody after you, you are not prepared to tolerate any further harassment.

    Any officer of the company receiving such a letter is obliged to act upon it. As they have no case the activity will be to call off the hounds. You need do nothing more unless and until you hear from them again. Which is more likely to be an apology than a sanction. Most likely nothing at all.

    That's my suggestion. I wouldn't pay them a penny.

  11. #11
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    For many of these companies, they have a lawyer on retainer to fight these battles or just turn it over to a collection agency. At that point, they are more about destroying your credit for the next 10 years (U.S.) and helping to warn/blacklist you from getting web hosting elsewhere to teach you a lesson. So as long as you are not looking to purchase a vehicle, house or get approved for credit in 10 years, do what you must.

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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by dominame View Post
    Risky! You could be blacklisted by a whole host of hosts if you ignore them!
    BS.

    write to the court
    No, never.

    Send copies to Leaseweb Deutchland and TKB INCASSO.
    If the court case is a threat and there are no hearing details, simply write to TKB INCASSO explaining that you owe no such debt and enclosing a copy of your original cancellation letter.
    Do you know how bill collectors work? Leaseweb has already charged this off, and doesn't care anymore. Whoever TKB INACCASO is (amusing name, CASO rhymes with a-hole), they surely bought the debt for pennies from Leaseweb. The bill collector doesn't care if the amount is valid or not, they want to collect, period, the end. The only time you need to bother fighting this is when it affects your credit or is taken to court (rare, unlikely for such a pittance, under $1k). Bad debtors know this, take advantage of the system. But legit persons like the OP need to know this, too.

    Feel free to try and send cancellation documents, but at best it's likely to do nothing, and at worst backfire in some way.

    Be warned that Leaseweb Deutchland may well try to flog this case to another agency or even repeat more than once before they give up on it.
    Unlikely.

    The alternative is to consult a solicitor.
    And spent $$$. That's part of the gambit of a bill collector. They want their demand to seem cheap compared to legal avenues, but you need to understand it's all BS, and shouldn't cost anything.

    Not to do so risks your good name with other providers.
    How so? I call BS.

    The final thing to do once the immediate threat is sorted out is to write to Leaseweb Deutchland's CEO or other highly ranked board member (no way it can get overlooked) pointing out their error
    That should be the first avenue, not the last, if doing anything besides chucking the letter in the trash.

    Quote Originally Posted by martin_r View Post
    Going to court cost a lot of money, lawyers are expensive and I really doubt they would really go to court for €676.19.
    Usually they are sending these letters to scare you in the hope you will pay but it's rarely going to court
    you are not required to comply with these letters you can safely ignore this unless it is a real court order.
    Yep.

    Quote Originally Posted by rotkiv View Post
    it seems like TBK can lock the funds on our bank-account in Sweden if they win the case in court in Amsterdam
    Extremely unlikely.

    Quote Originally Posted by rotkiv View Post
    What is sad about this is that I am a person who worries
    It will probably end up with me paying and putting everything behind me.
    Bill collectors are predators, and you're being weak. That's what they want: to cow you, weaken your resolve, therefore get undeserved $$$$. Any show of force, and predators generally scurry away.

    Giving in, giving them money for empty threats, also harms everybody, as it incentives bad behavior by predatory scumbags. It emboldens them to do it to others.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlazingSwitch View Post
    destroying your credit
    How so? They don't have your SSN (or comparable outside USA). I could screw over all my hosts right now, and walk away with zero problems. I'd find a new hosts without any issue. It's not something I plan to ever do, but it's an ugly reality. The same is true of many services, such as phones. Most simply do not have the info to destroy credit (nor help credit).
    Last edited by kpmedia; 01-24-2021 at 10:07 AM.
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  13. #13
    An update. Have had contact with Leaseweb daily after I got hold of a person higher up on Monday.

    After a few hours, he found the e-mail (I posted here) where we canceled/terminated the server, and was able to confirm that none of them had responded to our e-mail. He did not know why.

    However, Leaseweb continues to refuse to cancel the renewal of a new period Aug-2020 to Aug-2021 on the grounds that we incorrectly terminated the / terminated server Aug-2019 when we sent an e-mail instead of writing a ticket in their user portal.

    He has asked me to build a stronger case for the legal department. For example. by documenting all the mistakes they made in August 2019 that led us to tell them to shut down the server immediately and terminate us as a customer, even though we had 11 months left on a prepaid contract where we would not get any money back.

    And when I have been sitting here now for 8 hours today and going through everything with them from mid 2019, saved tickets, e-mail conversations, old phone logs with Leaseweb, and take screenshots, print duplicated invoices, etc, etc, I find the following ticket where I specifically ask Leaseweb in September 2018 regarding cancellations:

    -------------------------------------------------- -----------------------------------
    September 28 2018, 19:01:29
    Hi,

    How many days in advance before the next contract period (1 month) do we have to cancel a server if we wish to cancel it?

    Regards
    --- ---

    Replied byLEASEWEB
    October 1 2018, 11:20:07
    Dear Mr. -----,

    Thank you for your email.

    In order to request the cancellation of the server that has 1 month contract, the cancellation via email should be submitted at least 5 days prior to the new start date of the contract or 1 hour before it, if the ticket is submitted via your customer portal.
    -------------------------------------------------- -----------------------------------

    Damn, I'm about to explode out of anger.

    And no, please do not provoke me and say I should have read the terms again to see if the cancellation terms had changed.
    Last edited by rotkiv; 01-28-2021 at 02:44 PM.

  14. #14
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    Just ignore them. Recovering 600€ costs much more than that, it's simply not worth for anybody.
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  15. #15
    My experience with lawyers and court is quite intensive, but it will be very costly for them more than 600 euros to recovery that.

    I suggest you try to strike a deal with them offsite, if they go to court you will have a lawsuit on your tail for a long long time. Because its a Dutch court they could in theory issue a arrest warrant for the whole of Europe. Highly unlikely tho.

    I have had a bad experience the last time I ignored a court case in a foreign country.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChadTech View Post
    I suggest you try to strike a deal with them
    BS. Don't give them money. They f'd up, not you.

    they could in theory issue a arrest warrant for the whole of Europe.
    BS. Civil != criminal

    I have had a bad experience the last time I ignored a court case in a foreign country.
    What court case? They're just making the usual pissing-and-moaning bill collector threats.

    He has asked me to build a stronger case for the legal department.
    You need to realize that THEIR legal department is there for THEM, and they are NOT your friends or allies. They will do all they can to twist your words and information. So when talking to these sorts of a-holes, always be brief with answers and documents (if corresponding with them at all, which is often not suggested).

    Quote Originally Posted by rotkiv View Post
    However, Leaseweb continues to refuse to cancel the renewal of a new period Aug-2020 to Aug-2021 on the grounds that we incorrectly terminated the / terminated server Aug-2019 when we sent an e-mail instead of writing a ticket in their user portal.
    Just to confirm the timeline here:
    - you had server for year or more
    - canceled via email in 2019
    - Leaseweb decide to randomly renew a server in 2020 on your behalf, then expect you to pay for it <<< WTF?

    Quote Originally Posted by rotkiv View Post
    -------------------------------------------------- -----------------------------------
    September 28 2018, 19:01:29
    Hi,
    How many days in advance before the next contract period (1 month) do we have to cancel a server if we wish to cancel it?
    Regards
    --- ---
    Replied by LEASEWEB
    October 1 2018, 11:20:07
    Dear Mr. -----,
    Thank you for your email.
    In order to request the cancellation of the server that has 1 month contract, the cancellation via email should be submitted at least 5 days prior to the new start date of the contract or 1 hour before it, if the ticket is submitted via your customer portal.
    -------------------------------------------------- -----------------------------------
    The end.

    Quote Originally Posted by rotkiv View Post
    to see if the cancellation terms had changed.
    That's not even legal. They can't just randomly change stuff without fair warning. Furthermore, it would be petty to claim "not email, use a ticket" (especially since almost all tickets generate emails, some even allow email reply). If this was ever actually in a court (99.99999% unlikely), a judge would probably ream them for such petty nonsense.

    Feel free to piss away money on a lawyer, but it really doesn't require a lawyer to stand up to companies that are in the wrong.
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  17. #17
    Full disclosure: I have worked for many ISPs in the Netherlands and my ex-gf of 7 years owned and owns a legal firm in Amsterdam.

    In the Netherlands, you will be taken to "small claims" court. The cost for the court case and a standard legal representation fee will be added to the money the loser will have to pay. If you don't show up, you will lose. Whether you are a private person or a company, within the EU, they will find you and just take the money from you. The cost for finding you and taking the money from you will also be added to whatever the court decided you have to pay. TL;DR Don't ignore Leasweb, the Debt collecting firm or the court or you will pay probably several thousands of euros by the time they find you.

    It appears that you have plenty of documentation that Leaseweb did things wrong in their process. As the higher up at LeaseWeb said, their legal department needs to be convinced to drop the case and possibly even pay you back. If you can convince them they will lose in court, they will pull the case from the debt collecting agency and sort it with you directly. Only CC the debt collecting agency. They will not make any decision themselves at this stage but just forward everything they get to Leaseweb to get them to decide on continuation or cancellation of the collection.
    Leaseweb will have to show due process and due care in presenting invoices and collecting their money from you. If you have written verification that e-mail cancellation is the method they want and you did that, you have written proof that they made the mistake and that your cancellation should be counted as valid. If you have written proof that you contested invoices and they did not provide the required information (as long as that is a reasonable request, like "what service and what period is this for exactly) they should not proceed with a debt collecting process.

    Usually, debts like this first go to a debt collecting agency that agree to take on the case for a minimum fee or percentage, often to be paid by the person that has to pay the debt. As I said, they only write nastygrams, bother you on your phone and such, but leave the decision of stopping collection to Leaseweb depending on what information you bring to them.
    Only when debts have been through a process, they will be sold off for pennies on the dollar. Usually, only cases that are above a certain value (100 euro or something in that range) and have not yet been to court apply. Even those debt collecting agencies routinely take the debt to court since statistically they make more money if they do.

    If this makes it to court, you usually get a court date and time. Usually, if you send your defence paperwork by registered mail to the address the court provides and it arrives in time, you do not have to appear in person. Under certain circumstances this may not be the case, verify this with the court where they have the session to make sure you do everything right. Once you get to this point, you may want to consider getting a Dutch legal representative to file your case for you. This does not have to be a registered attorney, but I would advise to get someone with a legal degree that is experienced in this field.

    I think you have a good chance of getting Leaseweb Legal to drop the process and possibly even refund you. Just stay calm, stay professional and it should work out.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhizzMan View Post
    As the higher up at LeaseWeb said, their legal department needs to be convinced to drop the case
    This sounds so f'd up ridiculous.
    Why don't Leaseweb "higher ups" control their own legal dept? Is the tail wagging the dog?
    Do they even actually have a legal dept? Or just outsourcing to some goons?
    Perhaps the "higher ups" are not high whatsoever, and you need to make some more contacts.

    And ISP != web host
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  19. #19
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    Mind if I write a couple of articles about this & share them around? This weekend we'll answer the question: What's smoother, the bike paths in Amsterdam or the brains of Leaseweb's legal team?
    Last edited by David; 02-12-2021 at 07:31 PM.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by INCOGHOST View Post
    Wait, are providers sharing data about customers with one another? -_-
    No certainly not as that would be a rather large breach of the majority of privacy laws the world over.
    Also debt collection agencies don't normally worry about small amounts like this as no money is in it for them.
    I'd write to the collection agency telling them the invoices were not authorized and that the service was canceled.
    Also mentioning that you have no money or assets gets them off your back as well. Because if you have nothing to sell they can't recover the debt and will go away.
    Its got me stuffed why they would even waste time with debt collectors over services with no contracts, just delete the server and be done with it.
    Month to months contracts aren't a contract.
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by kpmedia View Post
    This sounds so f'd up ridiculous.
    Why don't Leaseweb "higher ups" control their own legal dept? Is the tail wagging the dog?
    Do they even actually have a legal dept? Or just outsourcing to some goons?
    Perhaps the "higher ups" are not high whatsoever, and you need to make some more contacts.

    And ISP != web host
    Not always, if it was an actual ISP selling Internet connectivity then they would have more legal stuff to comply with then a standard web host.
    Standard web hosts aren't legally required to do anything really, where as most countries have strict regulations for ISPs Australia as an example have the TIO and ACMA which are government organisations that control how ISPs in Australia operate in terms of handling consumer issues etc.
    Is this Leasweb mob a subsidiary of the US company, if so I would complain to one of the heads of the US company about how the EU arm is acting and they will be legally required to Act as they will have ownership of both companies.
    As they are registered companies their are laws in both countries where they operate.
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by rotkiv View Post
    An update. Have had contact with Leaseweb daily after I got hold of a person higher up on Monday.

    After a few hours, he found the e-mail (I posted here) where we canceled/terminated the server, and was able to confirm that none of them had responded to our e-mail. He did not know why.

    However, Leaseweb continues to refuse to cancel the renewal of a new period Aug-2020 to Aug-2021 on the grounds that we incorrectly terminated the / terminated server Aug-2019 when we sent an e-mail instead of writing a ticket in their user portal.

    He has asked me to build a stronger case for the legal department. For example. by documenting all the mistakes they made in August 2019 that led us to tell them to shut down the server immediately and terminate us as a customer, even though we had 11 months left on a prepaid contract where we would not get any money back.

    And when I have been sitting here now for 8 hours today and going through everything with them from mid 2019, saved tickets, e-mail conversations, old phone logs with Leaseweb, and take screenshots, print duplicated invoices, etc, etc, I find the following ticket where I specifically ask Leaseweb in September 2018 regarding cancellations:

    -------------------------------------------------- -----------------------------------
    September 28 2018, 19:01:29
    Hi,

    How many days in advance before the next contract period (1 month) do we have to cancel a server if we wish to cancel it?

    Regards
    --- ---

    Replied byLEASEWEB
    October 1 2018, 11:20:07
    Dear Mr. -----,

    Thank you for your email.

    In order to request the cancellation of the server that has 1 month contract, the cancellation via email should be submitted at least 5 days prior to the new start date of the contract or 1 hour before it, if the ticket is submitted via your customer portal.
    -------------------------------------------------- -----------------------------------

    Damn, I'm about to explode out of anger.

    And no, please do not provoke me and say I should have read the terms again to see if the cancellation terms had changed.
    None of this makes any sense what so ever.
    What contract were you on? If its month to month, then they can't make you sign up for an entire year.
    Just tell the debt collection company that all the invoices were unauthorized and that you didn't consent to being billed by them.
    Problem solved and no lawyers needed, also let the parent company in the US know what is going on as they would be very interested.
    CPK Web Services
    Multi Award winning Managed web hosting.
    Find out more. https://www.cpkws.com.au/mhosting.php

  23. #23
    LeaseWeb are a Dutch company based in Amsterdam, so getting in touch with their US or Asian subsidiaries won't do much good unfortunately.

    Debt collection agencies in the Netherlands generally will not stop following the debtor even for smaller claims. It is Leaseweb who has to drop this, unless the debt was sold to the debt collection agency.

    LeaseWeb do have a bit of a reputation to uphold when it comes to litigation due to "invoicing issues". I'd follow the advise provided by WhizzMan
    Woktron Web Hosting
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  24. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Kepler 62f
    Posts
    16,703
    Quote Originally Posted by Chaddy View Post
    Not always, if it was an actual ISP selling Internet connectivity then they would have more legal stuff to comply with then a standard web host.
    Standard web hosts aren't legally required to do anything really, where as most countries have strict regulations for ISPs Australia as an example have the TIO and ACMA which are government organisations that control how ISPs in Australia operate in terms of handling consumer issues etc.
    I know that.

    != means DOES NOT EQUAL

    ISP != host
    means host isn't the same as ISP. No more than a dog is a cat.

    Quote Originally Posted by woktron View Post
    LeaseWeb do have a bit of a reputation to uphold when it comes to litigation
    I think "uphold" is the wrong word. And they do have a reputation as a crap company to deal with, I'd known several hosts that dumped them as their datacenter in recent years for players like Equinix Amsterdam where they're having a better experience with management/billing/etc. (Leaseweb was fine at the technicals of hosting, with good uptime/etc, but the business side left much to be desired, from what I was often told.)

    I mostly find Leaseweb being used for bot spam in recent years. I've blocked huge swaths of their IP space.
    Last edited by kpmedia; 02-13-2021 at 07:02 AM.
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  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by ChadTech View Post
    I have had a bad experience the last time I ignored a court case in a foreign country.
    Please will you tell us that story?

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