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  1. #1

    * Metro Ethernet vs. SONET

    Dear all,

    if I need a T1 line between 2 location in NY Metro area, then which is "better" - Metro Ethernet or SONET?

    I googled the subject, found lots of things to read, but still did not quite figure out what is better for me. What is cheaper?

    What is faster (in terms of latency), what is more reliable (in terms of not sharing resources with other users/congestions/etc)?

  2. #2
    My research so far suggests that Metro Ethernet is both much cheaper and slightly faster than SONET.

    After looking at Verizon web-site I got a bit lost in the options there:
    Ethernet Virtual Private Line
    Metro Private Line Digital Service
    Metro Private Line SONET Service

    Which of them is "metro ethernet" - is it the first one? which of them has best latency guarantees?

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneLittleBird View Post
    My research so far suggests that Metro Ethernet is both much cheaper and slightly faster than SONET.

    After looking at Verizon web-site I got a bit lost in the options there:
    Ethernet Virtual Private Line
    Metro Private Line Digital Service
    Metro Private Line SONET Service

    Which of them is "metro ethernet" - is it the first one? which of them has best latency guarantees?
    Very confusing,

    Ethernet Virtual Private Line
    Metro Private Line Digital Service
    Metro Private Line SONET Service


    Can i have the link to this verizon info?

  4. #4

  5. #5
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    Seems, this is what your looking for Ethernet.

    http://mediumbusiness.verizon.com/pr.../ethernet.aspx

    Ethernet LAN Service (E-LAN)
    Ethernet Virtual Private Line (EVPL)
    Ethernet Private Line (EPL)

    I recommend Metro-E over SONET
    Last edited by TheServerExperts; 11-16-2009 at 10:41 AM.

  6. #6
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    I would recommend MetroE. Its easier to work with than SONET and usually cheaper as well. MetroE seems to be more popular as I don't know many people still using SONET.

  7. #7
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    AT&T came around and switched everyone from SONET -> Metro-E in this area. Saved a few hundred bucks and shortened our contract.

  8. #8
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    Metro-E for sure. Becoming more accepted (especially in tier 2-3 cities) and cost effective (less expensive monthly and total cost of ownership)

  9. #9
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    SONET equipment is far more expensive than MetroE also, not counting that the limits of each SONET OCx connection are nowadays far beyond reality for a granular operation. With Metro-E there are "less upgrades" to do when you need to expand and you won't be left with useless router blades...

  10. #10
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  11. #11
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    I haven't even seen, much less used a SONET connection in almost 5 years. Go Ethernet.
    --chuck goolsbee, Prineville, Oregon, USA
    Please note: I no longer work for digital.forest in Seattle, WA, as I left them in early 2010 to pursue an amazing opportunity at an amazing datacenter project elsewhere... I do not speak for digital.forest here. However I still know they provide the best colocation in the Pacific Northwest.

  12. #12
    by unanimous vote, Metro Ethernet wins over SONET (in round 1, by the way of TKO). Hurra! :-)

    Thanks all for being so helpful.

    -------
    Now I've got one more question regarding Metro Ethernet.

    Say, I've subscribed to two different lines: one is 1Mbps, another is 10Mbps, all quality of service guarantees are the same for both line. And they are both virtual lines, i.e. they are ultimately delivered over, say, 1Gbps ethernet transport. Both lines go to the same destination, say, 10-20km away.

    Then my question is: which of the two lines would deliver a 400-byte udp (or tcp) packet faster?

    The naive answer is: 10Mbps will deliver this packet 10 times faster.

    But I suspect, that it is not as easy. And possibly they will both take exactly the same time to deliver the packet.

    Please, could you speculate on this question? And try to guess whether the two latencies will be different, and by approximately how much? Please give a very rough guess.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneLittleBird View Post
    by unanimous vote, Metro Ethernet wins over SONET (in round 1, by the way of TKO). Hurra! :-)

    Thanks all for being so helpful.

    -------
    Now I've got one more question regarding Metro Ethernet.

    Say, I've subscribed to two different lines: one is 1Mbps, another is 10Mbps, all quality of service guarantees are the same for both line. And they are both virtual lines, i.e. they are ultimately delivered over, say, 1Gbps ethernet transport. Both lines go to the same destination, say, 10-20km away.

    Then my question is: which of the two lines would deliver a 400-byte udp (or tcp) packet faster?

    The naive answer is: 10Mbps will deliver this packet 10 times faster.

    But I suspect, that it is not as easy. And possibly they will both take exactly the same time to deliver the packet.

    Please, could you speculate on this question? And try to guess whether the two latencies will be different, and by approximately how much? Please give a very rough guess.
    no, thats like saying if I drove along a 6 lane highway I would arrive 6 times faster than a 2 lane highway.
    The bandwidth does not determine the speed of a packet, thats done by the routers choosing the best/fastest route to the destination. If the route to site A via a 10mb is congested or oversubscribed it could take longer than the roue to site B via 1mb in theory.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by pdw8 View Post
    no, thats like saying if I drove along a 6 lane highway I would arrive 6 times faster than a 2 lane highway.
    That's exactly my question. Is 10Mbps like 10 x 1Mbps lanes? Or is ten times faster (this can also be the case for virtual ethernet private line - depending on how this is implemented in terms of time sharing/scheduling/...). Or is it someting in between? Various answers are theoretically possible. And I would like to know, which one is the case specifically with metro ethernet point-to-point links.

    And if it is like 10 x 1Mbps lanes (i.e., not faster at all for a small packet), then what is the maximal packet size for which it does not matter? is it 1.5Kbytes?

  15. #15
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    Packets are delivered according to the speed of light on fiber or of electricity on copper (depends on the media you are using), plus any router-generated latencies for routing and processing a packet.
    Thus, in normal conditions of temperature and pressire, they are delivered at the same speed between the two circuits, having a minimum speed that is related to the physical distance between the points. This minimum distance can be increased by: a) Routing equipment performance, b) Channel/link utilization - if one of them is oversubscribed or peaking, then the packets will be delayed on it.

  16. #16
    Another factor in determining latency - distance - is almost irrelevant here. As it takes light only 50 microseconds to travel 15km.

  17. #17
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    Forget not that Warp Drive or Hyperspace have not been discovered/invented yet, they just are theoretical models. So, if light travels at a speed X on 1Mbps channel, it can't really logically travel 10X faster. It's obvious that they are 10x1Mbps lanes. Maybe in 200 years from now this constant can be changed... ;-)

  18. #18
    Let met try and clarify my question a bit. Imagine I have a 100Mbps physical link. And I use this link to provide two virtual links: 10Mbps and 1Mbps (there is no other utilization of the 100Mbps line). And the way I do it is time-sharing. I assing each 1ms interval of time to one of the links. So, one linke gets 10ms - then another gets 1ms - then the first one gets 10ms - and so on. Then, first link would need to wait in queue at most 1ms. And the second link may have to wait in queue between 0ms and 10ms.

    This is an artificial example, but it illustrates the general principle: it is possible, that 10Mbps will have lower latency, than 1Mpbs link.

    And my question is: can this be the case with virtual point-to-point links over Metro Ethernet?

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneLittleBird View Post
    And if it is like 10 x 1Mbps lanes (i.e., not faster at all for a small packet), then what is the maximal packet size for which it does not matter? is it 1.5Kbytes?
    Unless both ends support Jumbo frames (up to 9000 bytes), the maximum packet size you will have is 1500 bytes that is the standard Ethernet MTU.

  20. #20
    Dear iptelligent, in the artificial example above, speed of light only contributes 0.05ms to both latencies (assuming 15km distance). While other factors can contribute 10ms. Thus, speed of light argument can be ignored.

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