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Thread: Questions

  1. #1
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    Questions

    Hi,

    Im new to game servers I have never used one but have played on one there pretty cool and I would love to get into selling them. I have a few questions.

    Is there some type of company or thing that you can sell game servers but off a cheap reseller? More like reseller web hosting is what I mean.

    Also how dose it work do you need a shared hosting account or do you need a server just to have one game server up? What's needed how dose it work out files etc...

    Also if I where to reseller game servers what would I need to look into doing befor I start do I need to get a dedi server or could I get a vps and sell off theom..

    Please do not post in this thread just 1 or 2 line sentence answer my questions and don't get off topic...


    Thanks, Greg

  2. #2
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    You can't host a game server on a shared hosting account, but you can certainly host one on a VPS or Dedicated Server.

    Look for a managed VPS or Dedi provider and ask their support team if they'll configure everything for you; be sure to tell them exactly what game you want to host to ensure that they'll be able/willing to do it.

    I don't know of any reseller scheme that offers what you've described.
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  3. #3
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    I know I can easly ask the support team, but I want to learn how to set it up my self.

  4. #4
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    What game are you wanting to host? There isn't a universal game server that works with all games like, say, apache does with all web-pages. Most games have their own proprietary servers/tools.

    The good news is that for the most part these proprietary servers will work in any linux or windows environment.
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  5. #5
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    See just got in the biggest twist ever, now what's the diffrence, setting up my own game server on a vps but then if I go to a site where they sell game servers do they give me a vps or do I need to buy the game server then put it on a vps? Or could I code it and make a vps into a game server lets say for example we use the game counter strike source.. Now lets say I made the game server off my vps do I go threw steam and go on my server or do I go to my url and play the game?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by PerfectedHosting View Post
    See just got in the biggest twist ever, now what's the diffrence, setting up my own game server on a vps but then if I go to a site where they sell game servers do they give me a vps or do I need to buy the game server then put it on a vps? Or could I code it and make a vps into a game server lets say for example we use the game counter strike source.. Now lets say I made the game server off my vps do I go threw steam and go on my server or do I go to my url and play the game?
    Good news is the server is free for source-based (Counter-strike, TF2, etc) games.

    You access your game server just like you would any other game server -- through the game's built in menu. Anyone will be able to join if you make it public.

    I actually set up a TF2 (source-based, just like counter-strike) server a while back on my home connection for me and a couple of friends to play on It's really pretty easy to do -- excellent choice if you're looking to get some experience with game-servers, IMHO.

    I would NOT recommend just doing it from home, though, if you want to make a business out of it; latency will make it less than enjoyable for your customers/players.

    SO a quick overview --

    - Buy a VPS
    - Install the source server
    - Simple configuration
    - Voila!

    Obviously there are some nitty gritty details, but devote a day or so to it and you'll have A. Done It Yourself, and B. a functioning game server.
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  7. #7
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    Thanks for all the informaton, im going to purchase a VPS, dose the VPS need to be sertant specs? What would it be for just a server that no one will be in just about 6 people like a 3v3.

  8. #8
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    I would say go with at least 386 MB RAM (preferably on a Xen-based VPS so you know it's not oversold). If it's in your budget, choose someone who provides premium bandwidth as well -- this will help a lot.
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  9. #9
    VPS is not something you want to sell game servers off of. Go with a Dual Core or a Quad Core with 4GB of memory and go from there.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by XFactorServers View Post
    VPS is not something you want to sell game servers off of. Go with a Dual Core or a Quad Core with 4GB of memory and go from there.
    OP said he just wants 6 players at a time . . . a Dedi for that would be extreme overkill.
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  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by e-Sensibility View Post
    OP said he just wants 6 players at a time . . . a Dedi for that would be extreme overkill.
    Where did he say that ?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by PerfectedHosting View Post
    What would it be for just a server that no one will be in just about 6 people like a 3v3.
    He said that right here
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  13. #13
    I see, I still do not suggest a VPS rather than a cheap P4 dedicated.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by XFactorServers View Post
    I see, I still do not suggest a VPS rather than a cheap P4 dedicated.
    ???

    A vps on a non-oversold Xeon 5300 or < node will easily outperform a p4.

    All pentium 4's are good for at this point is sucking massive amounts of power.
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  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by e-Sensibility View Post
    ???

    A vps on a non-oversold Xeon 5300 or < node will easily outperform a p4.

    All pentium 4's are good for at this point is sucking massive amounts of power.
    It has nothing to do with what will out perform the other. I guess I will leave it to you as you seem to run a reputable game server provider

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by XFactorServers View Post
    It has nothing to do with what will out perform the other. I guess I will leave it to you as you seem to run a reputable game server provider
    Haha -- what does it have to do with, then? How one will make the OP feel?
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  17. #17
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    I have run plenty of game servers on virtual servers. We actually have a client right now running a 12-man Counter-strike source server on a 512MB VPS without issues. As said by e-Sensibility, you have to be sure you go with a company that is non-oversold because if you go with some of the overselling host you'll find it will either not be able to use the CPU or you'll be suspended because of high cpu usage.


  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by devonblzx View Post
    I have run plenty of game servers on virtual servers. We actually have a client right now running a 12-man Counter-strike source server on a 512MB VPS without issues. As said by e-Sensibility, you have to be sure you go with a company that is non-oversold because if you go with some of the overselling host you'll find it will either not be able to use the CPU or you'll be suspended because of high cpu usage.
    Just because you have someone running it doesn't mean it's optimal to run it. I can run 100 slots on a P4 doesn't mean you should.

  19. #19
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    I don't think you know the power of virtual servers. They are much better than low-end dedicated servers these days as long as you choose wisely. As I said I have a client running a 12-man server without issues meaning he doesn't experience any lag. You don't need to buy a physical server to run one small game server, that is just a waste of space and power. Move on to the modern age of smarter hosting.


  20. #20
    It's easy to find a VPS provider that doesn't oversell RAM (any Xen-based host will do). What's harder to find is a VPS provider that can truly guarantee that the _CPU_ resources are not oversold. It is easy for a VPS host to load up a physical machine with, say, 4 CPU cores and 12 GB of RAM with 20+ virtual servers. Such a machine might work just fine for webhosting, but could be terrible for game servers, if it's even moderately loaded -- you might not notice your webpage taking 30ms extra time to load when your VPS is waiting for a physical processor to run on, but you sure would notice your game server delaying 30ms.

    That lack of predictability is what makes hosting a game server on a low-end VPS something of a crap shoot, and it's part of why they have such a bad reputation for game server hosting.

    With a properly underloaded VPS, however (running on the latest hardware), performance can actually be very good, and offer better value than a low-end dedicated server would. If he's just starting out and looking to dabble, I'd recommend that the OP look for a VPS provider that is willing to work with him to make sure that the machine he's hosted on has very low CPU usage or, ideally, one that can give him his own dedicated core.

    Hearing about anyone running game servers on a P4 dedicated server makes me shudder. e-Sensibility's right -- those machines really are not good for anything any more, and I can't imagine one outperforming a Xen VPS at anything but the most overloaded host. If you don't want to take his word for it, take mine.
    John
    President, NFOservers (Nuclearfallout Enterprises, Inc.)
    High-performance (Xen) VPS hosting, game servers, Ventrilo/Murmur/Mumble/TS3 servers, and dedicated servers

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by devonblzx View Post
    I don't think you know the power of virtual servers. They are much better than low-end dedicated servers these days as long as you choose wisely. As I said I have a client running a 12-man server without issues meaning he doesn't experience any lag. You don't need to buy a physical server to run one small game server, that is just a waste of space and power. Move on to the modern age of smarter hosting.
    You are absolutely correct (you posted while I was replying there). Choosing wisely mainly comes down to renting a Xen VPS from a reputable host that doesn't heavily load its machines down (read: one that's not "too good to be true" cheap).
    John
    President, NFOservers (Nuclearfallout Enterprises, Inc.)
    High-performance (Xen) VPS hosting, game servers, Ventrilo/Murmur/Mumble/TS3 servers, and dedicated servers

  22. #22
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    John,

    I'm curious, did you try OpenVZ with game servers? I know that Xen has poor performance when it comes to context-based switching (as compared to native and openvz almost 2-3x higher latency). Just wondering as to how it performs with game servers compared to VZ.


  23. #23
    Most of our VPS customers run Windows, so I have primarily investigated KVM and Xen. The overall overhead involved with Xen HVM domUs (versus bare hardware) on the latest hardware has not proven to be very significant in my testing, but I imagine that it's going to be higher than a solution that does not involve full virtualization.

    (As a side note, KVM is terrible for game servers, at least in its current state.)
    John
    President, NFOservers (Nuclearfallout Enterprises, Inc.)
    High-performance (Xen) VPS hosting, game servers, Ventrilo/Murmur/Mumble/TS3 servers, and dedicated servers

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by edge100x View Post
    It's easy to find a VPS provider that doesn't oversell RAM (any Xen-based host will do). What's harder to find is a VPS provider that can truly guarantee that the _CPU_ resources are not oversold. It is easy for a VPS host to load up a physical machine with, say, 4 CPU cores and 12 GB of RAM with 20+ virtual servers. Such a machine might work just fine for webhosting, but could be terrible for game servers, if it's even moderately loaded -- you might not notice your webpage taking 30ms extra time to load when your VPS is waiting for a physical processor to run on, but you sure would notice your game server delaying 30ms.

    That lack of predictability is what makes hosting a game server on a low-end VPS something of a crap shoot, and it's part of why they have such a bad reputation for game server hosting.

    With a properly underloaded VPS, however (running on the latest hardware), performance can actually be very good, and offer better value than a low-end dedicated server would. If he's just starting out and looking to dabble, I'd recommend that the OP look for a VPS provider that is willing to work with him to make sure that the machine he's hosted on has very low CPU usage or, ideally, one that can give him his own dedicated core.

    Hearing about anyone running game servers on a P4 dedicated server makes me shudder. e-Sensibility's right -- those machines really are not good for anything any more, and I can't imagine one outperforming a Xen VPS at anything but the most overloaded host. If you don't want to take his word for it, take mine.
    This was my point but John had time to write it up I rather pick a P4 than take a crap shot at an oversold VPS or a VPS with restrictions.

  25. #25
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    Alright, but my qustion is, can I sell like over 5 game servers on one vps? Like have 5 Game Servers on 1 VPS..

  26. #26
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    The answer is yes . . . what is your budget?
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    Quote Originally Posted by edge100x View Post
    Most of our VPS customers run Windows, so I have primarily investigated KVM and Xen. The overall overhead involved with Xen HVM domUs (versus bare hardware) on the latest hardware has not proven to be very significant in my testing, but I imagine that it's going to be higher than a solution that does not involve full virtualization.

    (As a side note, KVM is terrible for game servers, at least in its current state.)
    Have you found the way bind your KVM based VPS to real IP on your Linux host? I have tried to play with it but as you know, it does that own private networking thing...
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  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by GameFrame View Post
    Have you found the way bind your KVM based VPS to real IP on your Linux host? I have tried to play with it but as you know, it does that own private networking thing...
    We shouldn't hijack this thread too much with sidebars, but the networking options in KVM are similar to Xen's. You can either set it up to use bridging, or go with a locally routed solution; I tested both successfully.
    John
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    High-performance (Xen) VPS hosting, game servers, Ventrilo/Murmur/Mumble/TS3 servers, and dedicated servers

  29. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by PerfectedHosting View Post
    Alright, but my qustion is, can I sell like over 5 game servers on one vps? Like have 5 Game Servers on 1 VPS..
    Hence, comes back to my point. If you are wanting to run 5 game servers than you really should be getting a dedicated server. Core2Duo.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by XFactorServers View Post
    Hence, comes back to my point. If you are wanting to run 5 game servers than you really should be getting a dedicated server. Core2Duo.
    Or OP should just get a more powerful vps or vds. Your argument is no more or less valid than it was before -- newer/better hardware will always outperform older/lower-end hardware; a virtualized solution will also probably be cheaper from many providers.
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  31. #31
    My old take on this.. this would only work if a host gave you a full cpu not a vcpu but a fully dedicated cpu then this wouldn't matter or if you were running on OS level virtualization such as openvz as there is only one kernel and thus the scheduler issues shouldn't happen.
    Quote Originally Posted by nwmcsween View Post
    Because games are usually tick based with "world" updates happening every tick, so when person a runs a game server on a vps it creates latency between the ticks as the scheduler shares processor time with different applications / users to not allow application / user x / vps x to simply hog a full cpu and thus not creating sever -> user latency which doesn't matter to much but actually creating latency within the game which does matter a lot since "twitch" reflexes are based on estimation between ticks.
    I'll run some tests on this to prove it sometime as I noticed this with all high "interrupt" (I can't remember the scheduler terms used) low run workloads (e.g most multimedia).
    Last edited by nwmcsween; 11-16-2009 at 10:57 PM.

  32. #32
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    That's all fine and good, but the fact is that intel 55xx series processors, on most workloads, boast efficiency increases in excess of 50% over 54xx series processors -- just one generation behind the cutting edge.

    So your argument aside, provided the host isn't wildly oversold, the VPS with the 55xx series Xeon CPU is still going to vastly outperform a core2duo, which is what another poster suggested the OP should use.

    Even that aside, the OP could ask his host to prioritize his cpu cycles, or purchase that prioritization as an add-on. As I said earlier in the thread -- the only way the OP is going to get better performance than a high-end vps is by purchasing or renting a server with recent Xeon processors; this will probably cost the OP a lot more than the high-end VPS would've.
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  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by edge100x View Post
    We shouldn't hijack this thread too much with sidebars, but the networking options in KVM are similar to Xen's. You can either set it up to use bridging, or go with a locally routed solution; I tested both successfully.
    I am using QEMU, the bridging works just fine etc. I can access my VPS from my host and VPS can access host/internet.

    The issue with QEMU is just that i havenīt found out the way to get it bind on a real ip... I donīt want to start forwarding ports from host IP because that port is away from main host ports.

    I know this is a bit off-topic but tried to ask after i saw your post
    Last edited by GameFrame; 11-17-2009 at 08:09 AM.
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  34. #34
    GameFrame, if you're saying that you want to have the same IP bound to both your regular adapter and your virtual adapter at the same time, that's a very unusual configuration that I haven't tried yet. It'd probably be much easier to do traditional NAT/PAT with a private IP for the VPS, but if you really want to go the route of reusing the public IP, you might be able to do it with a some manual netfilter prerouting rules.
    John
    President, NFOservers (Nuclearfallout Enterprises, Inc.)
    High-performance (Xen) VPS hosting, game servers, Ventrilo/Murmur/Mumble/TS3 servers, and dedicated servers

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