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  1. #1

    Question What sort of DNS Service would I need?

    Hi,

    If I have 2 shared hosting account with 2 different providers in different datacenters, how would I set it up to do the following

    Main Provider: Whole Site and Email
    Second Provider: Currently Offline Page and Email

    What sort of DNS Provider would I need, if the Main provider goes down to change to the second provider, then whent he main provider comes backup change back ?
    Thanks,
    DolphinEcho

  2. #2
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    Unless you want to pay quite a bit of money for a failover DNS setup or some sort of load-balancing setup then you're just going to want to set low TTLs and then edit the DNS zones/records during an outage.

    Others with more experience in HA environments will probably be able to give you more details/better advice.
    Michael Denney - MDDHosting LLC
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  3. #3
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    We've been looking into load-balancing over two networks and it does work out costly.
    Like Michael Advised, The Low TTL and DNS Edits are the cheapest way.
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  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by dolphinecho View Post
    Hi,
    What sort of DNS Provider would I need, if the Main provider goes down to change to the second provider, then whent he main provider comes backup change back ?
    You would need a provider that tests specifically for HTTP and SMTP protocols before they change the production dns records. Ping would not be good enough.

    If your provider provides a "automated host maintenance page" as part of the service you won't even need the second hosting provider because when your main server goes down, your dns provider's servers take over the job of returning a courtesy page.

    The benefit of using a specialty provider of course is that your users won't have to wait until you are notified, get up a 4AM, edit records, wait, make a mistake, do over, wait some more.
    Last edited by bear; 10-29-2009 at 07:08 PM.

  5. #5
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    Dnsmadeeasy.com has DNS failover for only around $50 a year.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by plumsauce View Post
    The benefit of using a specialty provider of course is that your users won't have to wait until you are notified, get up a 4AM, edit records, wait, make a mistake, do over, wait some more.
    All of which are really only downsides if you're a one-man-show and not good at editing DNS zones
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeDVB View Post
    All of which are really only downsides if you're a one-man-show and not good at editing DNS zones
    Or if you value your time? I personally utilize numerous third party services for things not because I can't do it, but the low cost of having a third party reputable company do it for me in an automated manner seems to outweigh the costs.
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  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeDVB View Post
    All of which are really only downsides if you're a one-man-show and not good at editing DNS zones
    Which applies to a lot of readers round this neck of the woods if you pay attention to the tales of woe around here.

    In the case of the OP he has two shared hosting accounts. That is hardly a round the clock NOC operation.

    Furthermore, even some multi-location, multi-staff NOC operations have to call someone in for some things. Even Verio and Equinix.

    Now, should people also be doing backups manually? That would put the kibosh on certain backup solution providers wouldn't it?

    And since everyone can do everything manually, maybe there should be no need for anything other than bare metal colocated boxes.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by CodyRo View Post
    Or if you value your time? I personally utilize numerous third party services for things not because I can't do it, but the low cost of having a third party reputable company do it for me in an automated manner seems to outweigh the costs.
    I would personally focus the funds towards keeping things online instead of automating what happens if you go offline for a single site.

    Realistically making the switch should only take a few moments and while time is money it's not enough time to justify the cost in my opinion.

    You of course always seem to have an opinion contrary to mine no matter what I say so I think I'll go ahead and agree to disagree at this point.
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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeDVB View Post
    I would personally focus the funds towards keeping things online instead of automating what happens if you go offline for a single site.
    And watching a site doesn't take funds?

    Realistically making the switch should only take a few moments and while time is money it's not enough time to justify the cost in my opinion.
    That would be "take a few moments" after discovering the outage and getting the right person out of bed.

    Look at the outages threads and you'll see that some providers don't even discover an outage until the howls of outrage start coming in.

    And *who* is going to be doing this? Certainly not provider A for provider B while provider A is fighting some other bigger problem.

    And, you can't have the dns servers at provider A and probably not at provider B either.

    There is value in third party offerings that have been designed to do the job better than a few hacked together scripts.

    Mind you, some people feel the same way about using third party backup services. Why bother when you can hack together a few lines of perl? Nah, no need for R1Soft/CDP, let's save a few dollars.
    Last edited by bear; 10-29-2009 at 07:09 PM.

  11. #11
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    Hey, let's all play "Jump on MikeDVB" today!

    I'm just posting my personal viewpoints - if you disagree with them then more power to you - I'm not telling people what to do - just what *I* would probably do.

    I mean I would never ever pay anybody to change my oil - I'd rather do it myself where as people could argue against it 100% for reasons X, Y, and Z - but then more power to them in not changing it themselves.
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  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeDVB View Post
    Hey, let's all play "Jump on MikeDVB" today!
    Didn't you hear? It's been nominated as an Olympic sport

    I'm just posting my personal viewpoints - if you disagree with them then more power to you - I'm not telling people what to do - just what *I* would probably do.

    I mean I would never ever pay anybody to change my oil - I'd rather do it myself where as people could argue against it 100% for reasons X, Y, and Z - but then more power to them in not changing it themselves.
    But, as a seller of packaged solutions, you ought to realise that there is a value add somewhere in there. Why do you think I'm harping on R1Soft/CDP? Because you are saying it's better than DIY. Same thing. Now, do people jump into R1Soft/CDP threads and start preaching the gospel according to bash+perl? According to your viewpoint, shouldn't you be posting a tutorial on do it yourself backup made simple instead of offering a packaged option? If your upstream router went down, would you want to be attending to one customer's dns edit, or would you be fixing the router?

    Now changing your oil is a good thing. Less chance of a stripped plug, missing plug, cheap oil, no oil, filter too tight, filter too loose, filter not pre-charged, low fill, overfill. But some people can't do it, some people can only do it in the summer time because they have no garage and some people are dangerous doing it.
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  13. #13
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    I never said I would do it for a customer (it's not something offered with a standard hosting package) where as if a customer wanted to do it themselves then more power to them. If I had two shared hosting plans at two providers and wanted DNS failover I wouldn't pay for it, I would set a low TTL at the Domain Registrar and host my own Zone and then make changes if one provider goes down.

    Now speaking from the provider side of things it's a bit different and I am inclined to agree with you but I was trying to speak from the customer side of things

    And yes, I've seen people almost lose fingers changing their oil... Darn oil filters in the strangest places.
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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeDVB View Post
    Now speaking from the provider side of things it's a bit different and I am inclined to agree with you but I was trying to speak from the customer side of things

    And yes, I've seen people almost lose fingers changing their oil... Darn oil filters in the strangest places.
    Well, it's pretty clear that the OP wants *womeone else* to do it. So, if the host won't do it, then the obvious alternative is ...?

    Never mind loosing fingers. Never change the oil less than a week before a big date. Too much dirt under the finger nails. Now, if you have a big date *every* week, then ... someone else will be screwing the filters.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by plumsauce View Post
    Well, it's pretty clear that the OP wants *womeone else* to do it. So, if the host won't do it, then the obvious alternative is ...?

    Never mind loosing fingers. Never change the oil less than a week before a big date. Too much dirt under the finger nails. Now, if you have a big date *every* week, then ... someone else will be screwing the filters.
    I guess I was speaking towards saving the OP some money...
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