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  1. #1
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    Question Large Hadron Collider

    According to an essay in the New York Times, the scientists are trying to explain why the collider, the world’s largest particle accelerator turned on with great fanfare in September 2008 by the European Organisation for Nuclear Research (CERN), was closed down for major repairs just over a week later. The 3 billion-euro collider was supposed to track down the Higgs boson, a subatomic particle believed to have given mass to the universe milliseconds after the Big Bang created it some 15 billion years ago.

    Physicists think this minuscule speck of matter, if ever found, could explain the mysterious code at the origin of the physical world.

    I wonder what the real problem was why they shut it down? I did not see any new coverage about the shut down.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails collider-1.jpg   collider-2.jpg  

  2. #2
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    HUH?!?! So confused about this thread... haha can anyone explain this to me a little better?
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clay - Limestone View Post
    HUH?!?! So confused about this thread... haha can anyone explain this to me a little better?
    Do you know what the LHC is? if not: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Large_Hadron_Collider

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    Particle physics yay...just the thought gives me a hadron.

    owm
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  5. #5
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    okay so now I know what the LHC is

    Thank you THAMAN!!! Once again I learn something new everyday!
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  6. #6
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    I thought they were looking for Quarks.

    Isnt that what they do @ FermiLab?
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    Reading that Wikipedia article, it appears that it has had a shaky life since the construction began.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by THAMAN View Post
    I wonder what the real problem was why they shut it down? I did not see any new coverage about the shut down.
    Manufacturing defects in the magnets, for one. And it isn't as simple as climbing down into the tunnel and fixing them. You have to warm the tunnel section you need to do work in up (a few weeks process), fix the magnet, test it, and then cool the entire thing back down. Plus they found these issues in several magnets - once you find a problem in a multi-billion dollar project as big as this, you double check everything.

    Think about it this way - cars are some of the most complex machines that we mass produce. And cars break down all the time. Everyday I see a broken down car or a mechanics shop full of cars - and that's something we've been building for decades. The LHC is probably the most complex large scale machine on the planet (and definitely the most complex particle accelerator) - it's bound to break down a few times.


    Alex

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    Also there was quite some press coverage on the shut down, maybe you just missed the coverage it was not nearly as exciting as the startup itself. Everyone was expecting a big bang and all we got was bit of hot air

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    Quote Originally Posted by 040Hosting View Post
    Also there was quite some press coverage on the shut down, maybe you just missed the coverage it was not nearly as exciting as the startup itself. Everyone was expecting a big bang and all we got was bit of hot air
    lol, hot air, after how many billions of dollars? Any idea who was funding this project?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by THAMAN View Post
    Any idea who was funding this project?
    As far as i know you, me and the entire human world ? I believe about every country has scientist or observers out there.

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    There are theories that the LHC could create microscopic black holes. But they are most likely to evaporate.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aciid View Post
    There are theories that the LHC could create microscopic black holes. But they are most likely to evaporate.
    http://www.scientificamerican.com/bl...urf-2009-01-29

    Yes, the LHC destroying the world is old news, and sadly the same questions are raised about existing supercolliders. Some people just watch too much Star Trek.

    On a more serious note, I have seen one of the detectors up close and been down in the tunnels of the LHC. It's a pretty impressive machine, and the scale of the thing isn't done justice in pictures. The countryside there is also very beautiful. It's a good place to check out, if you're in the area and have a friend who can let you in.


    Alex

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    Fermilab

    If you're stateside and interested in this kind of thing, Fermilab in Batavia, IL is a great place to visit. A group of friends and I enjoyed going out there for a tour of the accelerator. Not as powerful as the LHC will be, but it's working and still producing results.

    Fermi National Accelerator Laboratory: fnal.gov

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    It's a good place to check out, if you're in the area and have a friend who can let you in.


    Alex
    That's the only way to get in?

  16. #16
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    But I alone realised that the experiment we were doing was extremely dangerous, and would trigger a chain reaction that would cause the entire planet to instantly collapse into an ultra dense particle, about the size of a pea.

    Dr. Ernst W. Longbore [Walter Borden]

    http://heliotitans.livejournal.com/178224.html

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outlaw Web Master View Post
    Particle physics yay...just the thought gives me a hadron.
    You thinking about mud would give you a hadron.

    I've always been a bit uneasy with what they're doing there. I think a very fitting end to our existence would be poindexter nerdy scientists trying to recreate the origins of the universe and messing around with black holes. Yeah, that's what we need forsure.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    . . . On a more serious note, I have seen one of the detectors up close and been down in the tunnels of the LHC. It's a pretty impressive machine, and the scale of the thing isn't done justice in pictures. The countryside there is also very beautiful. It's a good place to check out, if you're in the area and have a friend who can let you in.
    So you have connections in Al qaeda too?
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    Quote Originally Posted by THAMAN View Post
    That's the only way to get in?
    I assume that is due to security / practicality reasons. As far as I know, the public cannot simply enter on will (unless accompanied by an employee who invited them?).

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  20. #20
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    Now thats a big machine, amazing.

  21. #21
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    I would love to get a tour of this facility or should i say city...lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by THAMAN View Post
    That's the only way to get in?
    Unfortunately, yes. They have a visitors center at the main CERN facility, but the LHC ring comprises several sites, and each are a sight. Because much of the collider and detectors are assembled above ground, there are massive warehouses with gigantic holes at one end that lead down to the tunnel (and we're talking about 100 meters deep here...).

    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Bob View Post
    So you have connections in Al qaeda too?
    Don't tell!


    Alex

  23. #23
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    I hope them good scientists who built that facility offset their carbon emissions generated from that project. Doomsday projects must at least be carbon neutral.
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  24. #24
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    They teleported the Gordon to Xen. So they are preparing for his return:
    http://img127.imageshack.us/img127/3807/lhcoz5.jpg
    Closed for winter...

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by BurakUeda View Post
    They teleported the Gordon to Xen. So they are preparing for his return:
    http://img127.imageshack.us/img127/3807/lhcoz5.jpg
    Excellent image!


    If anybody is interested, you can see pictures of CMS (the experiment that I saw) here. There are a couple people in some of them which gives you a good idea of the scale of the thing.


    Alex

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    I've seen some TV docos on this, and the scale of the project is truly mind blowing. It's a feat of engineering and construction for sure. I just hope it's all worth it, and they don't do any real damage. Creating a black hole and sucking our solar system into oblivion would really suck for me.
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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex View Post
    [url]Some people just watch too much Star Trek.

    Alex
    I was thinking more along the lines of Blake 7.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Bob View Post
    Creating a black hole and sucking our solar system into oblivion would really suck for me.
    yupps...all that time wasted on the renewable gear for it to dissappear down a hellhole of unmeasurable proportions.

    imho...the hardon thing's a complete waste of time and money. i thing they're just trying too hard to over engineer science.


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  28. #28
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    I really don't see the point in the construction of the Hadron Collider. Although I really can't see it creating a black hole, I still think it is a complete waste of time and resources. Sure, it's science, but that's a lot of money to be spending on something that probably won't even reach its goal. I'd rather that money go to families in need.

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    I think it's a big conspiracy so they could build a bunker for the end of the world in 2012

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mekhu View Post
    I think it's a big conspiracy so they could build a bunker for the end of the world in 2012
    Haha, 2012.... only a few more years to prepare.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HivelocityJJ View Post
    I really don't see the point in the construction of the Hadron Collider. Although I really can't see it creating a black hole, I still think it is a complete waste of time and resources. Sure, it's science, but that's a lot of money to be spending on something that probably won't even reach its goal. I'd rather that money go to families in need.
    So true, and when the machine is on, it uses an insane amount of electricity, enough to power Geneva twice over. It uses 300MW when operational. Their power comes from Switzerland and France, and the Swiss mainly generate power from nuke and hydro sources and France generates power by nuke stations mainly. So the LHC's power source is mainly nuke power.
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  32. #32
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    I didn't know why the collider was out of commission for a while, but thought maybe it had something to do with so many in the media getting all worked up about the mini black hole that they were trying to create. If they really want to create black holes, then I think it's more than reasonable that they check, recheck & check again to make sure it's absolutely safe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by john2k View Post
    I didn't know why the collider was out of commission for a while . . .
    Helium leak -
    The collider was officially launched on September 10 when the first particle beam was successfully sent around the full circuit. However, it hit a major glitch last week when a mechanical failure triggered a helium leak and forced a shutdown for what was initially reported to be at least two months.
    If they really want to create black holes, then I think it's more than reasonable that they check, recheck & check again to make sure it's absolutely safe.
    I'd rather they weren't trying to recreate black holes. Seems very irresponsible and puts our planet at risk. Even if that risk is small, who has the right to expose us to any risk? These folks think they have that right. Our arrogance will be our demise.
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