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  1. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
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    Amsterdam
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    499
    hello,

    please provide me the ticket ID in PM.
    In the meantime we have nullrouted customers ip. thank you.

  2. #27
    BKL-944450

    Thanks for your quick response on this matter, its a shame email is not quicker.

  3. #28
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    1,635
    Quote Originally Posted by swiftnoc View Post
    The first serious and motivated response from Ecatel in a very long time.
    I approve this message.

  4. #29
    Website in question remains to be online (WHT mods removed the URL however).

  5. #30
    The site mentioned is now hosted at WorldStream.

    Selling peoples banks/paypals/SPAM LISTS/password stealers:
    *REMOVED LINKS*

    Hopefully they follow Ecatel. After having my PC infected etc, found my accounts showing up on this board with a Google search 8-)

  6. #31
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
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    Europe
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    Quote Originally Posted by M_Ridges View Post
    The site mentioned is now hosted at WorldStream.
    Send them a abuse message abuse@worldstream.nl and keep us up to date here how they handle it.
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  7. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Netherlands
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    Hi,

    Ok, we also dealt with it!

    Regards,

    Dirk

  8. #33
    Matthew, I'm the owner of the site in question.

    We're not the "scum of the earth" as you so affectionately describe.
    You will not be taking us offline anytime soon.

    Kind Regards,
    UltimA

  9. #34
    Pretty close to it? I consider myself quite computer literate, obviously not enough... but, I download a file and there goes all my passwords.

    Where do my passwords end up? posted on your forum. Do you know how much hassle it is getting all this stuff cancelled/remade?

    Your forum is a breeding ground for phishers and nothing but phished information is traded on the website. That's about as close to the scum of the net as it gets buddy. I'd like to see if you'd be pissed off if we were in each others shoes.

  10. #35
    It seems you're mistaken.

    The content in the violating section (regarding PayPal's and such) have been removed completely. Your issue with "stolen credit cards" don't exist, we don't permit this in the first place; these are VCC's (Virtual Credit Cards) that are sold legitimately, in the purchasers name (reloadable cards).

    I personally detest stolen cards/bank being sold.. hence I don't and never have allowed it.

    If you've had an issue with a certain aspect of the site directly, please contact me through PM here, and I can assist you.. as again, I never allowed cc's to be sold, and also, I've now removed PayPal's and such.

  11. #36
    Seems PM's are disabled for newer members here, so I'll clarify here;

    - No credit or debit cards are sold on the site, along with bank accounts. We're not a site who partakes in fraud, and I personally don't allow it.
    - The said "VCC's" you may have mistaken for stolen numbers.. these are simply prepaid cards that are purchased by people generally in countries where these can't be found, in exchange for their payment method. It's in their own names, own addresses, and are used for their own private purchases.
    - The said section of which you complained "Financial Accounts" (ie; PayPal's) has been deleted. This was in the works anyway, prior to the move.
    - We simply link to downloads, along with thousands of other sites.. small and large.
    - We have a dedicated contact system in the footer that's been updated tonight, where you can contact us to have content removed -- we gladly comply to requests from either individuals or companies.
    - Other sections such as Accounts have been restricted to certain individuals, and aren't available to the general public any longer.

    Certain aspects of our site have "blown up" over the past few months, so we'll be adding restrictions and such to contain it, to ensure it's as legal as possible.


    I can understand how aggravated you must be (I would be too), due to an infected download.. these are deleted if found, our Moderators assist us in doing this (we will be taking on more to prevent this). Infected downloads are not permitted, as this is not in the best interest of our users -- again, in your situation, please contact me direct (scenesupportws@gmail.com) and I will assist and help you.

    To others, yes, we are a downloads site, something which is generally hated here, but we are not a site that partakes in financial scams.. that's a totally different ballpark, something which I won't touch; jail isn't something I wish to visit.

  12. #37
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Europe
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    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    we are not a site that partakes in financial scams.. that's a totally different ballpark, something which I won't touch; jail isn't something I wish to visit.
    Well the other content you have on offer is also illegal, even linking to it is not legal, at least not in the Netherlands. And trading links to copyrighted programs also influence sales of software firms small and large.

    A lot of small software firms have to close their doors because of the fact that their software is hacked and freely distributed. Its the small guys you hit the hardest with your Warez links sites. So basicly you help to make 100s if not 1000s people jobless. Often people in developing countries that can ill afford to lose their jobs and income.

    I am sure you see it different, but above is how it is.
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  13. #38
    As said, if anyone whether an individual or company contacts us asking us to remove content, we do. I've had requests from small music producers all the way through to porn stars -- each have been complied with.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    As said, if anyone whether an individual or company contacts us asking us to remove content, we do.
    So if they find out that you illegally distribute their content, you will stop doing so. Even if you fully aware it was illegal and facilitate the illegal distribution in the first place?

    Why not stop to facilitate it, instead of removing the content when caught in the act.... ?
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  15. #40
    There's tens of thousands of websites where you can find such downloads, we're just one. Also to expand again, we don't host the said files. Shouldn't sites such as RapidShare be the ones shut down?

    I can't justify it for small companies, but the best I can do is remove content when asked.

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    There's tens of thousands of websites where you can find such downloads, we're just one.
    Thats not a valid argument. Just because there are thousands [fill occupation in here] , should not mean you have to become one.

    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    Also to expand again, we don't host the said files. Shouldn't sites such as RapidShare be the ones shut down?
    Rapidhare facilitates free uploading and downloading of files with the intention and understanding that the file is not illegal to upload, download or share. Your site facilitates linking to files that are mainly illegal to upload, download or link to. Thats the main difference.

    The intent is different altogether. They intend to offer a service that complies with the International laws, while you intend to offer a service that forbidden in most countries.

    Not to mention, that the ones who post the links on your platform, are most probably the very same people that uploaded the illegal files to rapidshare in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    I can't justify it for small companies, but the best I can do is remove content when asked.
    Its not the best you can do. You can disallow linking to software, MP3 and Movies (and actively enforce it). That would be a much larger gesture and well within the range of your possibilities.
    Last edited by swiftnoc; 10-15-2009 at 08:16 AM.
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  17. #42
    The ignorance from the website owner is laughable. His clause is that all of the accounts for sale in the sites market place are legal and there is no evidence to suggest otherwise. So it seems very common for people to have multiple Amazon accounts which just so happen to have credit cards attached? You know ... this is perfectly normal, in fact I may just sell my Amazon account with a credit card attached to make $5. And the other accounts for sale with the word "Phished" in the topic title, how blatantly obvious can you get -- those are still legal right? In fact I may just sell the 10 RapidShare accounts I have on the forum to make a few dollars, I just have too many and need to get rid! How I ended up with 10 random accounts is a mystery!

    The mods on WHT are deleting the sites URL, so here I provide a screenshot of the sort of thing the site allows.

    Example of selling of Amazon accounts:
    http://i33.tinypic.com/2d10ccg.jpg

    Oh look, a member selling phished accounts, but of course 100% legal:
    http://i33.tinypic.com/x4kled.jpg

    Hmm a member has 'carded' some Amazon gift cards and is selling them ... of course 'carded' means something totally legitimate on this forum:
    http://i34.tinypic.com/2qvwqc3.jpg

    OMG! This guy just has so many Amazon accounts that he needs to get rid of them fast 2 for $1!! I wish I had this many random Amazon accounts from various countries which just so happen to have CC's attached! All legal:
    http://i33.tinypic.com/15dw5qs.jpg

    This user has a bunch of RapidShare accounts for sale, and admits they are phished/stolen:
    http://i33.tinypic.com/iqiq1s.jpg

    Aside to the market place which allows users to sell illegal virtual goods, the forum also caters to hacking and phishing activities with members sharing advice and tutorials on how to phish websites. You can even buy botnets ...

    ... For example a botnet for sale, only $35, bargain!
    http://i37.tinypic.com/33kdx75.jpg

    ... But this one looks even more better:
    http://i38.tinypic.com/2rvxxft.jpg

    But what do you get?

    EXE Builder - The virus which you spread.
    The Script - Fully setup and more.
    Full Configuration and Setup - No need to upload, download or edit anything.
    Security - My server has 256mbit encryption, and is secure from hackers.
    Prices ~
    Most people sell DDoS scripts for 50euros, sometimes even 100, i sell for 10 euros or £15 in a Steam Game.

    You have to laugh ...

    ############################################################

    I could be here all day, there are thousands of topics like this. I can understand a piracy forum still being online because everyone plays ignorance towards the law (while the host also profits too) but when a site like this continues to allow its members to sell stolen goods this is illegal in any country.

  18. #43
    I'll go through this YET again..

    Anything that involves finances you can freely report, and will be removed by our Staff. This rule came into effect 6 hours ago, content that violates will be removed! Again, I have no problem removing content on request, but don't expect me to check all 2.2 million posts. Oh, and nice -- the person selling Amazon accounts is actually banned, but you can't apparently see this. 8-)

    Wow, so talking about things is now an offense? You can't buy/sell phishing pages on our site, but I'm not removing free speech, sorry.
    Also, purchasing methods to create a botnet aren't illegal; operating one is.

    Finally, so you get it, financial accounts are no longer allowed, and will be removed.

    You act as if we're some huge organization that profits in selling high money accounts -- ever heard of Carder.su? You can buy someone's whole information, and their credit card for $15.. but no, someone selling a godforsaken Rapidshare account for $2.50 is the hardcore criminal.
    Last edited by qrwzzc; 10-15-2009 at 08:29 AM.

  19. #44
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hazit View Post
    I can understand a piracy forum still being online because everyone plays ignorance towards the law (while the host also profits too) but when a site like this continues to allow its members to sell stolen goods this is illegal in any country.
    Believe me when i say, that 99% of this seemingly 'innocent' warez link trade usually have a darker side as well. Once people start breaking laws and see they do not get caught (yet) they go further, and further, take more and more risks.

    One of many reasons why hosts, that also complain about the high fraud rate, should take their own responsibility by having a solid AUP that disallows hosting content against the law. They should also enforce it.

    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    You can't buy/sell phishing pages on our site, but I'm not removing free speech, sorry.
    I fail to see what linking to warez/copyrighted content have in common with free speech. Why can Webhostingtalk.com keep their forum clean of warez links and why you cannot?
    Last edited by swiftnoc; 10-15-2009 at 08:33 AM.
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  20. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    I'll go through this YET again..

    Anything that involves finances you can freely report, and will be removed by our Staff. This rule came into effect 6 hours ago, content that violates will be removed! Again, I have no problem removing content on request, but don't expect me to check all 2.2 million posts. Oh, and nice -- the person selling Amazon accounts is actually banned, but you can't apparently see this. 8-)
    Excuse me, but you have hundreds of members selling Amazon accounts, my example was one of them. Don't try to come across as if all the other members are also banned. Hell there are a lot more popular topics than the one I provided, still online and trading.
    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    Wow, so talking about things is now an offense? You can't buy/sell phishing pages on our site, but I'm not removing free speech, sorry.
    Also, purchasing methods to create a botnet aren't illegal; operating one is.
    Ok, nice to hear you are breeding a large userbase of script kiddies without a care in the world.

    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    Finally, so you get it, financial accounts are no longer allowed, and will be removed.
    Well to be fair I did get Paypal onto you, because those topics were highly illegal.

    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    You act as if we're some huge organization that profits in selling high money accounts -- ever heard of Carder.su? You can buy someone's whole information, and their credit card for $15.. but no, someone selling a godforsaken Rapidshare account for $2.50 is the hardcore criminal.
    I've never said you are some huge organization, but I tell you your site has 2 million posts and 400,000 members so you're not on the small side are you?

    No I haven't heard of that website but it has nothing to do with this. Seems to me you are pointing out a website which is even more illegal than yours, in an attempt for us to clap?

    A person who phishes website accounts and sells them for a profit (regardless if it is $2.50) is still breaking the law. So again I do not see your point here at all.

  21. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Hazim
    Excuse me, but you have hundreds of members selling Amazon accounts, my example was one of them. Don't try to come across as if all the other members are also banned. Hell there are a lot more popular topics than the one I provided, still online and trading.
    Yawn, as I said, this rule was implemented 6 hours ago.. 2.2 million posts.. you do the math.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hazit
    Ok, nice to hear you are breeding a large userbase of script kiddies without a care in the world.
    Please elaborate as to which law we're violating.. none? Alright, next.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hazit
    Well to be fair I did get Paypal onto you, because those topics were highly illegal.
    PayPal haven't contacted us.. nor has anything regarding PayPal.
    We're doing this on our own accord.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hazit
    I've never said you are some huge organization, but I tell you your site has 2 million posts and 400,000 members so you're not on the small side are you?
    You act as if this is dedicated to the Marketplace, I can assure you it's not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hazit
    No I haven't heard of that website but it has nothing to do with this. Seems to me you are pointing out a website which is even more illegal than yours, in an attempt for us to clap?
    Well.. what can I say? If you think this is one of the most illegal sites you've ever seen you're in for a lot to learn.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hazit
    A person who phishes website accounts and sells them for a profit (regardless if it is $2.50) is still breaking the law. So again I do not see your point here at all.
    I can point out many sites which sell such accounts, as their primary operation.. probably some even hosted by WorldStream, and also USA based. It's minor. You comparing RapidShare accounts on the same scale as selling major stolen credit cards is like comparing a house to the Empire State Building.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    Please elaborate as to which law we're violating.. none? Alright, next.
    Well.... your content is against the law in the Netherlands, where you host now:

    Some links:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demonoid
    http://www.slyck.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=43376
    http://www.slyck.com/story1704_Lease...ppeal_to_BREIN

    http://torrentfreak.com/brein-takes-...torrent-sites/
    http://torrentfreak.com/mininova-and...-court-090602/
    http://www.technologylawculture.com/...orrent-server/

    http://torrentfreak.com/anti-piracy-...ndexer-090517/
    http://www.dmwmedia.com/tags/zoekmp3-nl

    But by all means, stay where you are, stay put. KLPD high tech crime unit probably comes to your provider and installs a tapbox. This allows them to see all the IPs of all your site visitors and your moderators and more important, you. Then they arrange a court order for your provider to release all client info they have on file from you.

    Those are most probably false, but they simply follow the money trail. It eventually ends with something they can identify you with. If your in the USA or NL: good luck, you will need it.
    Most probably you think justice department and police units are far behind 'the scene' thats untrue. Who do you think, for example, run most of the 'anonymous proxy sites' and anonymize my IP systems ?
    Last edited by swiftnoc; 10-15-2009 at 08:52 AM.
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  23. #48
    BREIN has no interest in forums, that are linking content.

    They simply (for now) care about torrents.
    Both Demonoid and Mininova were receiving 250,000k uv/day, and were torrent trackers/indexers.

    So you're aware, in any country, whether it be USA, NL, UK.. heck, anywhere, there has been no warez forum shut down, ever.
    Sure it's only a matter of time.. but there's bigger fish to fry in the Netherlands, first.

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by qrwzzc View Post
    BREIN has no interest in forums, that are linking content.
    I know for a fact that you are wrong.
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  25. #50
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    Quite interesting discussion, but here our input: qrwzzc promised me to remove all the illegal stuff on the website within 2 hours. Otherwise I will disable the server.

    Regards,

    Dirk

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