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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
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    Hosting company refuses to allow domain transfer

    I have a problem with a client's hosting company. They refuse to permit the transfer because the client still owes them money.

    I know that holding back a domain transfer in order to enforce payments is not legal according to the ICANN terms but I can't find the ICANN terms and especially I do not find that paragraph that says it is not allowed.

    Can someone help ??

    They also refuse to enter the client's email address as admin-C

  2. #2
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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    India
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    A domain transfer can be refused if it is too near the expiry date.
    Chris, Developer/Programmer,
    https://www.chrisranjana.com/
    Php laravel developers, Node Python developers,
    AWS Certified | Python developers | Nodejs Developers | Devops

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Greece
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    2,211
    Why the client doesn't pay them? If I would that customer and didn't pay the webhost then I wouldn't have the demand the webhosting transfer the domain.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
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    Sorry, it was wrong link, the right is http://www.icann.org/udrp/udrp-schedule.htm

  6. #6
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    Aug 2004
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    I am going to host them for free against traffic so I don't mind wether they pay. They have been promoting my stuff before and I was happy with the results...

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
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    1,461
    Originally posted by NickTooms
    Sorry, it was wrong link, the right is http://www.icann.org/udrp/udrp-schedule.htm
    Can't find it there...

  8. #8
    Here you go. This is the relevant section from the document, assuming that your client has in fact paid the domain registration/renewal fees for the domain.

    http://www.icann.org/transfers/policy-12jul04.htm

    3. Obligations of the Registrar of Record
    ...
    Instances when the requested change of Registrar may not be denied include, but are not limited to:

    * Nonpayment for a pending or future registration period
    * No response from the Registered Name Holder or Administrative Contact.
    * Domain name in Registrar Lock Status, unless the Registered Name Holder is provided with the reasonable opportunity and ability to unlock the domain name prior to the Transfer Request.
    * Domain name registration period time constraints, other than during the first 60 days of initial registration or during the first 60 days after a registrar transfer.
    * General payment defaults between Registrar and business partners / affiliates in cases where the Registered Name Holder for the domain in question has paid for the registration. (emphasis added)
    Annette
    Hosting Matters, Inc.
    Superior service. Sensible price.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    489
    I wouldn't take a host which owe someone else money. It's tacky. They agreeded to pay the current host for services and they should.

    We always ask when someone is moving thier site to us "why". They ask why are you asking why, I tell them because i want to make sure the issues you have with your current host isn't something you would find here. Most business people understand the question and answer.

    Why take a host that doesn't pay thier current hosting company on time?
    Hosting and Web design.
    OnLineMedia, Inc.

  10. #10
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    Greece
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    I 100% agree with tonyolm.

  11. #11
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    I don't care since I will host them for free. They will send me visitors. They did this before and it was no problem. If they stop sending me traffic I can shut it down at any time so I have nothing to lose but a lot to win.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    489
    You know what i LIKE the best?! And it's not coffee. I like when a disfunctional client leaves to go to a "Better" host.

    One that never pays thier bills on time.

    One whos credit card seems to decline all the time.

    One that has issues which are not related to us but calls us because we know what we are talking about.

    One that calls for tech support for everything but acutal hosting.

    One that calls as if you are a web hosting tutoring company.


    If you are going to lose a client you want to lose the client which cost you the most to host service wise. We don't really have tech support issues so it's more like web consulting issues.
    Hosting and Web design.
    OnLineMedia, Inc.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2003
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    489
    Originally posted by thomas.smith
    I don't care since I will host them for free. They will send me visitors. They did this before and it was no problem. If they stop sending me traffic I can shut it down at any time so I have nothing to lose but a lot to win.
    THink about the company that is owed the money. Let them pay the bill then host them for free.

    I wouldn't release the domain either acutally if money was truely owed. You pay me on what we agreeded on and if I deliverred you owe the bill. It's the principle of the matter.

    I dont mean a "refund" for bad service or something. I mean an acutal unpaid bill for services rendered.
    Hosting and Web design.
    OnLineMedia, Inc.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Orlando FL
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    I agree with you tonyolm.
    Jorge Campos | WBpro
    Web Building Professionals
    www.wbpro.com

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
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    >THink about the company that is owed the money. Let them pay
    >the bill then host them for free.

    They are not my problem. If they need their money it is no problem to sue the client and the client will have to pay for the lawsuit so what's the problem ? I want that site to be transferred as soon as possible because once they are transferred I will get traffic for them. The sooner the better. I'm not a wellfare organisation looking for hosting companies to get their payments. I'm busy enough to collect my own clients payments.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    489
    wbpro...

    Really? you wouldn't take a company that is going to bone another company to just make a buck?

    A lot of companies don't care are basic business principles and ethics. I look at issue like that as what goes around comes around
    Hosting and Web design.
    OnLineMedia, Inc.

  17. #17
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    Aug 2004
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    I don't consider my competitors as beloved friends... I'm sorry if that is against anyone's moral.

  18. #18
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    May 2003
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    489
    They are not my problem. If they need their money it is no problem to sue the client and the client will have to pay for the lawsuit so what's the problem ? I want that site to be transferred as soon as possible because once they are transferred I will get traffic for them. The sooner the better. I'm not a wellfare organisation looking for hosting companies to get their payments. I'm busy enough to collect my own clients payments.
    To each thier own. I believe in karma i guess. And it's really not the hosting company that i care about, it's the LOSER client that doesn't pay thier bills I don't like. I dont like my competition either.
    Hosting and Web design.
    OnLineMedia, Inc.

  19. #19
    Well.. in any case a person who is not paying his hosting bill is a defaulter by law and I think matter should be taken to court...

    For domain name, as per me there can be two situation... first if the customer brought domain name in question as a part of a hosting package, then I think he has to pay for it before he can get it transfered...

    But if the customer has brought domain seperately and has paid for it , then host has no reason to stop transfer..

    That's my opinion.. and truly speaking, it depend on situation..
    Wholesale Domain Prices for Retail Customers - Rushtoweb.com

  20. #20
    Originally posted by thomas.smith
    I don't consider my competitors as beloved friends... I'm sorry if that is against anyone's moral.
    I feel there should be ethics in every business or infact in everything we do...

    If I would have been there in your place, I would have asked the customer to come with domain or register a new one... and if tells me he is unable to transfer because of unclear bills, I would have suggested him that clearing the dues is best way out.. ofcourse rest depends on customer..

    And generally I wouldn't prefer entertaining a customer who doesn't believes in paying for services he has used.. he is a morally incorrect person for me and I don't want such customer even if he brings a fortune with him...

    Of course this is my personal opinion
    Wholesale Domain Prices for Retail Customers - Rushtoweb.com

  21. #21
    Originally posted by tonyolm

    I wouldn't release the domain either acutally if money was truely owed. You pay me on what we agreeded on and if I deliverred you owe the bill. It's the principle of the matter.
    That's a good way to find your account at whatever registrar you use revoked. You cannot hold a domain hostage when the domain fee has been paid, no matter what other issues you might have with the client.
    Annette
    Hosting Matters, Inc.
    Superior service. Sensible price.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    1,461
    >he is a morally incorrect person for me and I don't want such
    >customer even if he brings a fortune with him

    Well, then this is the difference between us.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,769
    Originally posted by tonyolm
    A lot of companies don't care are basic business principles and ethics. I look at issue like that as what goes around comes around
    Originally posted by tonyolm
    I believe in karma i guess.
    No offense, but right before those comments, you said....
    Originally posted by tonyolm

    I wouldn't release the domain either acutally if money was truely owed.
    Seems like a contradiction in "business principles and ethics" to me.

    If the person has paid for their domain registration fee, and they are indeed the registrant/owner, you have no right to hold their domain. It doesn't matter if they owe you money for hosting, babysitting or mowing their lawn. They are separate things. Period. Sure, you might be mad they haven't paid you for another service, but that doesn't make it ok to deny them from something else they have paid for, especially when the other product/service is not even under your jurisdiction to begin with. You are not ICANN. You have no legal rights to deny them anything regarding their domain name, if they have paid the registration fee. Sure you might have the power/access to keep their name because they made the mistake of letting you register on their behalf, but that doesn't make it right or moral.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Amarillo TX
    Posts
    33
    Gotta go with Gen-T unfortunately although I've got to say that if I were in that postion I'm not sure I wouldn't be tempted to go the blackmail route.

    But if they haven't paid it up to date, then I'm going to say all power to the previous host.
    Hosting provided by

    critterplaces.com

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    878
    I totally agree that the persons should pay the other hosting company what is owed. However, you need to listen to what Annette is actually saying. She is not disagreeing that the other hosting company should be paid, nor is she disagreeing about it being the ethical thing to do. She is, however, saying that holding a domain hostage is not an option, if funds have been paid for the domain. The regulations, which were pointed out earlier, specifically identify this act as being something that can not deny the transferral.

    Sorry, Annette, if I put words in your mouth.

    -Lamar
    Going out of business in our 10th year.

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