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  1. #1
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    Aug 2002
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    new to colocation - suggestions?

    I am looking to colocate my server. I don't know much about it. I am interested in colocating with this datacenter that is closest to me and I don't know what to do next.

    What kind of questions should I ask them?
    What should I look for?
    Is there any average price that all places go with?
    Can I/Should I try to negotiate pricing with them?

    Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

  2. #2
    Greetings:

    "What kind of questions should I ask them?"

    http://www.colosource.com/checklist.asp for starters.

    "What should I look for? "

    If you are seeking local, then get a tour.

    "Is there any average price that all places go with? "

    Price varies greatly depending on the type of facility, how well it is run, services included, bandwidth providers, etc.

    "Can I/Should I try to negotiate pricing with them?"

    Yes.

    Thank you.
    ---
    Peter M. Abraham
    LinkedIn Profile

  3. #3
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    What kind of questions should I ask them?
    - Is the data center staffed (onsite) 24/7, or do they have to be dispatched when you have problem.
    - Standard equipment such as HVAC, UPS, generator, fire suppression, etc.
    - IP address provisioning

    What should I look for?
    - Remote reboot (convenience)
    - Great support
    - As high uptime as possible
    - Who's the backbone provider
    - Is it burstable? BGP?
    - etc

    Is there any average price that all places go with?
    For this one, some providers offer better bandwith or more expensive bandwidth than others. In general, Cogent bandwith is probably the least expensive one.

    Can I/Should I try to negotiate pricing with them?
    Yes, definitely.
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  4. #4
    Greetings:

    "In general, Cogent bandwith is probably the least expensive one."

    And generally on a scale of -100 to +100 is towards the -100 in terms of quality, latency, packet loss, etc. when top providers of bandwidth are towards the +100 end.

    Thank you.
    ---
    Peter M. Abraham
    LinkedIn Profile

  5. #5
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    "And generally on a scale of -100 to +100 is towards the -100 in terms of quality, latency, packet loss, etc. when top providers of bandwidth are towards the +100 end. "

    That's what I thought at first. However, after I tried it myself, Cogent is not as bad as people thought. Some people choose Cogent, because the affordability matters and the quality is good enough for them. The latency maybe longer, but Cogent can definitely satisfy the needs of many people.
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  6. #6
    Join Date
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    St. Louis
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    Cogent

    Cogent bw can be a good solution, especially if price is the only consideration. They often have latency issues but the price is right. It depends upon your application.

    We have some customers who wouldn't use Cogent if it were free (it practically is) and others who prefer it. If you have a mission critical site, an ecommerce business, or a situation where speed and reliability ARE relevant, stay away from Cogent. If you have a small site, not mission critical, and a low budget, it may be a good consideration.

    The rule in life is "You get what you pay for!" If it is too good to be true, it probably is. Know your needs before you choose a provider. Don't just look at price, look at all the factors and compare them with your needs.

    ******

    As for choosing a colocation provider, get references and check them!

    Good luck.
    Brad @ Xiolink
    XIOLINK. Your data...always within reach.
    http://www.xiolink.com
    1-877-4-XIOLINK [+01 314 621 5500]

  7. #7
    Greetings:

    "Cogent is not as bad as people thought."

    Not as bad? <smile>

    See http://www.verio.com/company/newsroo...rldREPRINT.pdf

    Geometic mean - Cogent is ranked #32 out of 34 companies.

    Performance under stress -- Cogent is ranked 30th out of 34 companies.

    Thank you.
    ---
    Peter M. Abraham
    LinkedIn Profile

  8. #8
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    "Geometic mean - Cogent is ranked #32 out of 34 companies. "

    Interesting, that Cogent who's on the third lowest, peers with NetRail who's on the third highest

    "Performance under stress -- Cogent is ranked 30th out of 34 companies. "

    Right below the WorldCom, which is the largest backbone. Also, I believe Cogent's 1.41 second is still bearable for some (that's how long I blink when I'm sleepy).

    I may sound like defending Cogent (or maybe I am), but in real life, Cogent serves part of the market as well, and I know that some subscribe to Cogent for the price. I think it's a balance between the price and performance. The way I value the bandwidth is not only the performance, but also the economic side of it.

    I like the way Brad put it:
    "Cogent bw can be a good solution, especially if price is the only consideration. ... "

    Best Regards,
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  9. #9
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    Originally posted by rey
    Interesting, that Cogent who's on the third lowest, peers with NetRail who's on the third highest
    Not only peers, but Cogent is NetRail. Cogent bought out NetRail almost a year ago...

  10. #10
    Greetings:

    "The way I value the bandwidth is not only the performance, but also the economic side of it."

    And if you can only afford among the worst, then Cogent would be within that economical picture ;-)

    Thank you.
    ---
    Peter M. Abraham
    LinkedIn Profile

  11. #11
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    "And if you can only afford among the worst, then Cogent would be within that economical picture ;-)"

    I woud say ... "if you can only afford among the cheapest ..."

    311 ... thanks for correcting me. I totally forgot about that!
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  12. #12
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    Aug 2002
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    Thanks for your replies. I'm looking to colo with Q9 (www.q9.com). Does anyone here have any experience with them or heard anything about their services?

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Kansas City
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    Originally posted by dynamicnet
    Greetings:

    "Cogent is not as bad as people thought."

    Not as bad? <smile>

    See http://www.verio.com/company/newsroo...rldREPRINT.pdf

    Geometic mean - Cogent is ranked #32 out of 34 companies.

    Performance under stress -- Cogent is ranked 30th out of 34 companies.

    Thank you.
    It would help of you quoted timely material. The report you cite draws conclusions from data that's 19 months old.

    [NG]Owner
    Gameservers, Colocation & Dedicated Servers
    http://www.thenetgamer.com

  14. #14
    Greetings:

    "It would help of you quoted timely material. The report you cite draws conclusions from data that's 19 months old."

    1. That was the earliest I could find. At least it is better than U.S. Census data that is often 10 years old ;-)

    2. We get to converse with a lot of data center providers in our line of work. In the last 24 months we've not heard any good news about Cogent.

    Yes, we hear it is among the cheapest; and it is what people get if they cannot afford anything better.

    But we rarely hear that it is a network one would host anything of importance on.

    Thank you.
    ---
    Peter M. Abraham
    LinkedIn Profile

  15. #15
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    "Yes, we hear it is among the cheapest; and it is what people get if they cannot afford anything better. "

    I'm afraid that it's not entirely true. I heard some companies who can afford tier-1 bandwidth use Cogent for backup in some cases.

    Best regards,
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  16. #16
    Greetings:

    "I'm afraid that it's not entirely true. I heard some companies who can afford tier-1 bandwidth use Cogent for backup in some cases. "

    Your statement is true, but doesn't override the facts that Cogent consistently ranks among the worse.

    Futhermore, why pick "among the worse" as a backup when you are using "among the best" unless you are crossing your fingers hoping the "among the best" will never fail.

    Thank you.
    ---
    Peter M. Abraham
    LinkedIn Profile

  17. #17
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    Your statement is true, but doesn't override the facts that Cogent consistently ranks among the worse.
    Compared to faster tier-1, yes, I completely agree with you.

    Futhermore, why pick "among the worse" as a backup when you are using "among the best" unless you are crossing your fingers hoping the "among the best" will never fail.
    Well, backup is not always needed. As for me, I do not want to pay a good tier-1 backup that I don't use all the time. If I have good bandwidth say 99.98% uptime (for example Level3 BGP with Genuity), it means that I will use the backup only for 0.02% of the time. I probably can get other tier-1 (like Internap), but it is not very cost effective in my opinion. But, that's just me

    Best Regards,
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  18. #18
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    Aug 2002
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    I am thinking of colocating with Worldcom. They seem big enough that they won't negotiate on pricing. Should I try anyways or are they fairly strict with their pricing?

  19. #19
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    Antipolo,

    I would definitely recommend a colo that is close to where you live.

    If price is more of your concern, there are quite a few places that will actually give you a better price, without sacrificing the quality.

    Also, worldcom doesn't seem to be a neutral data center, so you will have no options on bandwidth carriers. So, looking for backup carrier may be quite challenging.
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  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    Chicago
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    I would recommend colocation with

    www.servercentral.net

    One of the nicest datacenters in the world, and a Solid network.
    ---------------------
    "In the end you start thinking about the beginning"
    "You shouldn't take life to seriously, you will never get out alive"
    "Every Passing Minute is another chance to turn it all around"

  21. #21
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    Dec 2001
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    What would be the point in colocation that is not near your home?
    www.boxedhost.com
    COMING SOON!
    A Resellers Dream, In a Box

  22. #22
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    Originally posted by antipolo
    I am thinking of colocating with Worldcom. They seem big enough that they won't negotiate on pricing. Should I try anyways or are they fairly strict with their pricing?
    Do not colo with WorldCom.

    They are having massive financial problems (to the tune of about 7 BILLION ), and on the Internet end of things, I recently read an article on how they promised a ton of things to a DS-3 customer, never provided the promised things (which were elements of the contract), and then preceed to overbill the customer in excess of $100,000.

    In short, WorldCom is a troubled company that has a history of decietful, unlawful actions. Avoid them at all costs.
    Jay Sudowski // Handy Networks LLC // Co-Founder & CTO
    AS30475 - Level(3), HE, Telia, XO and Cogent. Noction optimized network.
    Offering Dedicated Server and Colocation Hosting from our SSAE 16 SOC 2, Type 2 Certified Data Center.
    Current specials here. Check them out.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    250

    Check out ThePlanet.com as well

    Antipolo,

    I'm doing the same thing you are. Talking with folks, trying to learn what is important what is not. In addition to the valuable comments you get here from your peers, you will learn a lot on the 800 numbers of the colo vendors.

    I've spent considerable time, and learned a considerable amount from Jeff Renis of ThePlanet.Com. Because of the way he handled my ignorance and took time with me I'll probably end up there.

    From what I can tell they are not the cheapest (but not real far from it). You can get (what I've recently learned) high quality bandwidth at one price or cogent (Hot debate around this one) for a lesser prices.

    Just listening to the vendors make their pitch, taking good notes, and asking qualifying questions will help the info gap a lot.

    Good luck.

    Bob

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Posts
    34
    Thanks to all of you who replied.

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