Web Hosting Talk : Web Hosting Main Forums : Web Hosting : hassles with sprintserve

[gorme]

I was wondering if I can publish here the email correspondence I had with sprintserve, to back up what I am saying. Maybe people here can say who they think is in the right.

Basically I have been with sprintserve for 5 1.2 years. I serve a lot of files, about 3.5 gig of them but only use about 1.2 gig of bandwidth a month. I signed onto them through this forum after getting ripped off by another hosting company. I supported them at first, for example:

http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showth...05#post1484905

For the last 4 years or so my total usage has been around 3.5 gig, occasionally I would get a complaint it had gone over 50 meg or so and I would remove some files. About a year ago cpanel was upgraded and the forums I had all stopped working, but I didn't worry about fixing them because they weren't being used.

A week ago I decided to get them fixed up and also to remove a domain and add another one and contacted sprintserve support. They referred me to a billing section and said that I had been using 3.5 gig of space on a 1.2 gig account for the last 5 years and I needed to get under the limit within a week. I said my limit had been the same for 5 1/2 years. CM there said they had merely been turning a blind eye to my extra usage and had changed their minds, and were giving me a week to get under the new limit.

I replied that I had paid for a full year and had only used 6 months, I expected them to honor the 3.5 gig I had always been using or give me my money back. They said that they would not give me my money back and would raise the limit to 2 gig, which is no good to me. So I told them I would move elsewhere for hosting.

I believe I have been ripped off by sprintserve. It was easy for them to see I had hosted all these files for so long from the dates of the files on their server. To allege this was an oversight by them for 5 years was nonsense. It was the deal I signed up for from featureprice. What do other people think of this?

[040Hosting]

Would love to see the other side of the story; but basically you have to pay what you use, and you should be glad your hosting company did host you till now, while they should have known you where over quota for such a long time.

Most hosting companies will (automatically) suspend your sites when you get over quota, at least it seems your site has been online up till now, even while your where over your limits.

[gorme]

Originally Posted by 040Hosting

Would love to see the other side of the story; but basically you have to pay what you use, and you should be glad your hosting company did host you till now, while they should have known you where over quota for such a long time.

Most hosting companies will (automatically) suspend your sites when you get over quota, at least it seems your site has been online up till now, even while your where over your limits.

I think you are missing the point, I was never over quota. Not for a day. They made the deal with me for that amount and never told me the deal was anything other than a standard agreement. If I had known they regarded it as anything else, like turning a blind eye, I would have left them the day after I signed up. There are plenty of hosting companies out there, I don't need people telling me they are doing me a favor to take my money with a week's notice if they change their mind.

[040Hosting]

Originally Posted by gorme

I think you are missing the point, I was never over quota. Not for a day. They made the deal with me for that amount and never told me the deal was anything other than a standard agreement. If I had known they regarded it as anything else, like turning a blind eye, I would have left them the day after I signed up. There are plenty of hosting companies out there, I don't need people telling me they are doing me a favor to take my money with a week's notice if they change their mind.

I understand, but i might have read your post wrong; i believe you wrote you had 3.5GB but did go over this limit by 50MB, if this is a wrong assumption on my side i do apologize. If not my previous statement stands, other hosts would have suspended you as soon you go over this limit.

[gorme]

Originally Posted by 040Hosting

I understand, but i might have read your post wrong; i believe you wrote you had 3.5GB but did go over this limit by 50MB, if this is a wrong assumption on my side i do apologize. If not my previous statement stands, other hosts would have suspended you as soon you go over this limit.

No ,what happened is a few times over the years I went over the limit, the most recent is probably over a year ago. Whether they would have suspended me or not is their policy, they now have in place a system that warns you if you go near the limit.

The problem is I signed up with the understanding I had this large number of files with very small traffic, there was no debate about how many files because the contents of the sites have changed little in this time. The problem is they now deny I ever had an agreement to host 3.5 gig at all, that this was merely a 5 year accounting error on their part, which is all lies.

It's like you buy a car for $30,000, and a year later the company phones you and tells you the price was really $40,000 but they were just turning a blind eye to the additional $10,000. You have to pay that within a week or they take the car back. It's an old scammer's trick, to say that they are doing you a favor by doing business with you at all, therefore changing the deal is just reducing the favors they are doing for you. I never wanted favors, and I never had the deal phrased as a favor until a week ago. I just signed up for 3.5 gig of storage and now that is withdrawn at a week's notice with no refund of the 6 month's still with Sprintserve. Since I have decided to leave Sprintserve, I just want my money back.

There is no correspondence with them at any time to indicate this deal was a favor, or subject to a blind eye being opened, or anything other than a 1 year contract for a fixed amount of storage at a fixed price. If they didn't like the deal they could have told me 6 months ago before taking my money for another year, and I would have hosted elsewhere.

[040Hosting]

I see, but if you signed up for a agreement to host 3.5 gig, you should have this black on white on your initial order, i know it is maybe to late now; but at your next provider make sure you have your deals black on white. If they changed the package in the meantime you should have gotten the chance to bail out (so they should have informed you).

To compare hosting (which usually costs only a few dollars) with large companies like car manufacturers seems to be a bit out of proportion to me, but i understand what you try to say.

In any case i wish you all the best in finding a better provider for your site; please make sure you talk to them to see if they allow file storage on their accounts as most will not allow you to do this.

[gorme]

Originally Posted by 040Hosting

I see, but if you signed up for a agreement to host 3.5 gig, you should have this black on white on your initial order, i know it is maybe to late now; but at your next provider make sure you have your deals black on white. If they changed the package in the meantime you should have gotten the chance to bail out (so they should have informed you).

To compare hosting (which usually costs only a few dollars) with large companies like car manufacturers seems to be a bit out of proportion to me, but i understand what you try to say.

In any case i wish you all the best in finding a better provider for your site; please make sure you talk to them to see if they allow file storage on their accounts as most will not allow you to do this.

When I say file storage I mean files that were part of the sites that were being hosted. They weren't just being stored. Thanks.

[sprintserve-ct]

First and foremost, thank you for sharing your case with the WHT community.

To start of, Mr. Greg is a customer of Sprintserve.net and had been hosting with us for some couples of years. Presently he is paying a nominal fee of $79/year for 1.2GB of storage space since then. As he had a couple of websites with us, we've proposed to 'group' his websites under a single owner - very similar to a reseller but w/o the reseller rights. Hence all the websites are group under his owner and since we are not sure how big his sites will grow, and being a pioneer customer, we have decided to not to limit the size of each account so that he could actually spread the 1.2GB among the accounts.

Over the years, we have briefly mentioned that he is consuming more than he's been paying (i.e. 1.2GB) and we have requested him to cut down the storage. But this was neglected over time. And it was only in our recent audit check that we've decided to clean up our servers and have made a request to him to cut down the storage to 1.2GB. One thing to note is that we did not even request for a back pay for the surplus of storage that we have been hosting over the years and we think this is fairly reasonable as a provider and in goodwill he being a pioneer customer. I am sure that if any other provider would have found out such an arrangement with any of their customers, the customers are either bound to have been suspended with a reminder for payment. But we did not. Our conversations did not work out and he refused to honour the agreement and hence decided to share this case with the hosting community. We wouldn't mind and would be kind to share this with WHT.

Following is some of the conversation we have sent it to Mr. Greg:

Hi Greg,

Thank you for writing. Our record shows that you are currently paying for 1.2GB space at $79/year. However, a check on our system reveals that you are currently using more than the allocated:

Accounts under username: gorme

gorme harmakhis.org Basic Package 1071.07 MB
gregorm greg.orme.name 96.27 MB
gregorme gregorme.com 893.59 MB
martians martianspiders.com 988.27 MB
orme inter-nets.org 131.71 MB
ultor ultor.org 504.37 MB

Total 3685.28 MB


In view of this, you are require to upgrade to our Reseller Gold that offers 4GB storage at $54.95/mo.

Alternatively, you would need to cut your storage usage to 1.2GB within this week.

Best Regards,

--- Sprintserve.net: Simply Hosting ---

CT Ang


=======================================
From client:

CM set this account up for me himself with a limit of 4 gig, I have been on
this for many years with your company. If you check you will see most of
these files are unchanged and uploaded over 5 years ago, which proves I have
been using this much space the whole time. This is the space I pay for, and
I expect to get this space until my account comes up for renewal at least.

The whole idea is absurd, as if it is a mistake the way your whole billing
and limits are set up for the last 6 or 8 years.

If I don't I will go to the consumer affairs in your country and
webhostingtalk and tell them you are ripping me off.

=========

Hi Greg

Thank you for your reply. I confirm that all along your total account quotas are 1.2GB space and 15GB bandwidth. However as you required multiple accounts, we have set up each account with the full 1.2GB in lieu of having to split it manually without knowing for sure how you would use your allocation. Initially this worked fine. However over the years, the usage for each account has grown and it is now at the levels it is for a number of years now.

We are aware of the over usage for a number of years and I believe I have brought it up previously as well. Although we have closed one eye over the years, that do not negate our rights to impose it now. On top of that, we have not requested any back payments despite allowing your account to use over the quota over the years, and is only requesting that you either adjust your quotas to within the limits or upgrade your plan, both which are very reasonable requests.

Please let us know if this clarifies.

Thank you.


Best Regards,

--- Sprintserve.net: Simply Hosting ---

CM Ho


====================================

From the client:

You really must be joking. You know quite well the amount of data I have is
the same as it has been for many years and you accepted it as such. In fact
there is no more data there than there was when I first opened the account
with you. On a couple of occasions you said there was perhaps 50 meg too
much data and I trimmed that down, but otherwise you honored our original
agreement.

And our original agreement is what I expect you to honor now as I paid a
year in advance for that. If not I expect you to refund the amount of the
year unused and I will go to another host company. I should post these
emails up at web hosting talk to see what they think of your "closing one
eye over the years".

I don't care whether you value my business or not, I just want I paid for,
and you know quite well you agreed to, or my money back.


=====================

And our last few replies to himself:

HI Greg

Thank you for your reply.

We do not know if the data now is the same as previously. We do not in any way monitor how the clients use the disk space quota before the total space per account. As such, the claim we know and accepted your claims is mysterious as no such statement has been made nor do we have any mechanisms in place that can track if a client's usage behavior or files has changed over the years. If you wish, we can drill down for you the usage per account by directories and areas of usage and you can decide if there's any files or directories that you wish to remove.

We have honored every bit of our agreement and beyond, including hosting many extra GB of files for many years without requesting for extra charges and you can keep it that way. All that we have requested is that you reduce your disk space usage accordingly to what was originally agreed upon. As such, you have gotten what you have paid for and beyond over the years. While we do not agree to discussing private matters in public, should we need to defend ourselves, we will do what's necessary.

Naturally you can upgrade as well to host more files and I understand that our current plans will probably be a far stretch from what you are paying now and that may not be an option. As a goodwill gesture in view of your long standing support, we will provide up to 2GB space at no additional cost, and if you can reduce your usage to this level, we will consider the matter closed. As mentioned, we are happy to assist and work with you to help you determine what files can be removed. Alternatively for an additional $79/year we will double your space quota to 4GB and this will allow you to fit in your existing usage with a bit of room for growth. This is at rates that are far below anything we are offering to new clients for existing clients, and is only offered to you since you have been with us a while.

Please let us know if this clarifies.

Thank you.

Best Regards,

--- Sprintserve.net: Simply Hosting ---

CM Ho


=====
From Client:

This is completely unacceptable. You can look at the dates on the files on
all my sites and you can see how long they have been there. The amount of
files on my sites has been unchanged for at least 6 years. If you won't
honor the original deal you made then refund the rest of the year I have
paid for and I will find another hosting comapny. Since I cannot fit all my
files into 2 gig this is impossible for me.

======

Hi

Thank you for your reply.

It is precisely that we are honoring the original agreement strictly that this becomes an issue. As such it is inaccurate to state that we are unwilling to honor the original deal. We have in fact gone way above it by providing 3.5GB instead of 1.2GB for many years. The agreement is to provide 1.2GB space and we have done so. The fact that we have closed an eye so many years did not automatically vary the quota entitled.

Whether the client have uploaded new files is irrelevant. There are many reasons usage can grow even assuming that no new files are uploaded. This includes emails received or statistics files generated daily for many years among some of them, or even the creation of new accounts. On top of that, I do see new files on the account I randomly checked.

As we have carried out end of the agreement, and the excellent rate enjoyed is due to the annual prepayment, and each cycle is 1 year, the cycle is not divisible and no pro-rated refunds is typically applicable. You can continue to use 1.2GB (now granted a goodwill increase to 2GB) as was originally contracted for the rest of your annual term. If you choose to find another host to host some of the domains instead of upgrading the diskspace under the extremely special rate offered, please proceed to cut the usage below 2GB by this week. If you need more time to do so, do feel free to let us know.

Thank you.


Best Regards,

--- Sprintserve.net: Simply Hosting ---

CM Ho

======

And last from the client:

I would like 30 days to move all my files then please close the account. If
it makes you feel better to steal 6 months of my payment then we will see
about that.

======

And finally:

I note you did not even bother to answer my last email. You can put your
side, if you have one, in this thread:

http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showth...48#post5330348

[UH-Bobby]

^^^ Nice post sprintserve. It was clear, easy to read, and you weren't rude or anything. You just laid out the facts.

To the OP, I think Sprintserve was reasonable in this case. They only offered 1.2 GB's, but allowed you to spread that over several accounts, but since they didn't know which account you would want to have the most files in, they set 1.2GB on all accounts.

So, as far as I see, you're going overquota. Now, if you can provide proof that you ordered 3.5GB, then I would post it here.

[gorme]

Originally Posted by UH-Bobby

^^^ Nice post sprintserve. It was clear, easy to read, and you weren't rude or anything. You just laid out the facts.

To the OP, I think Sprintserve was reasonable in this case. They only offered 1.2 GB's, but allowed you to spread that over several accounts, but since they didn't know which account you would want to have the most files in, they set 1.2GB on all accounts.

So, as far as I see, you're going overquota. Now, if you can provide proof that you ordered 3.5GB, then I would post it here.

None of this is true, and they prove it with their own words:

"Initially this worked fine. However over the years, the usage for each account has grown and it is now at the levels it is for a number of years now.

We are aware of the over usage for a number of years and I believe I have brought it up previously as well. Although we have closed one eye over the years, that do not negate our rights to impose it now."

So here they claim they were aware of this for a number of years, and I have only been with them for 5 years. So they admit what I am saying is true. Then they post here and claim what I am saying is not true. The simple fact is they knew all along how much data I had on the server and chose to take the money. In fact this was always the original deal anyway. I had problems with featureprice and posted here in 2003. CM offered me a custom deal here to host all my files with a limit of 3.5 gig ever since. I paid that each year and because it was a custom deal they just billed me without describing the terms of the contract. Also:

"We have in fact gone way above it by providing 3.5GB instead of 1.2GB for many years. The agreement is to provide 1.2GB space and we have done so. The fact that we have closed an eye so many years did not automatically vary the quota entitled."

In other words again they admit they knew for many years how much storage I was using and this claim they were ignorant of this is untrue. There never was any 1.2 gig limit, and if there was they would not have accepted 3.5 without complaint.

I don't want anything to do with sprintserve any more, I am moving to a hosting provider with far more storage than 3.5 gig. Since they admit they were providing me with 3.5 gig for many years and took my money for a full year, if they change the deal I want a refund for the 6 months still unused by me.

If a third party is interested I can prove their claims about the storage are untrue. On the server each file is time stamped and it is quite obvious that far more than 1.2 gig has been there from the beginning. Sprintserve weren't interested in checking when I said:

"You can look at the dates on the files on all my sites and you can see how long they have been there."

and came back with an evasive:

"Whether the client have uploaded new files is irrelevant. There are many reasons usage can grow even assuming that no new files are uploaded. This includes emails received or statistics files generated daily for many years among some of them, or even the creation of new accounts. On top of that, I do see new files on the account I randomly checked."

So it is not even relevant whether I uploaded new files or not, but their whole argument is that I uploaded too many new files. Of course there are some new files, what site doesn't have some new files?

There never was any 1.2 gig per account because that wasn't their system when I signed up, they just added that later as they changed their plans over time. I don't trust they would honor this 2 gig offer any more than their honored their original contract, I just want a refund for unused time if they won't.

[040Hosting]

Reading both sites of the story, it seems that no black and white agreement was made between both parties, which sometimes happen, especially when companies start up.

I believe the provider did offer you their services and i believe you received them; now they simply need to see the money for the space you use; and you have a choice; accept it; or move on.

If you payed the company for a year of service you could either request the money back (depending on their policy you did accept when signing up) or just move on.

Next time make sure you have a clear understanding on what you did order, and make sure you have this black on white.

[sprintserve-ct]

To add on, Sprintserve shared hosting prices had not changed over the 5 years and in view of the $79/year, it actually computes to $6.58/mth. A look at our website on shared hosting is pretty obviously that none of the plan even come close to $6.58/mth for offering 1.2GB, not to mentioned a 4GB space claim by the client himself. In return, as the client had mentioned, we've not even sent a single email to back claim the over-quota that he had consumed over the years. We did not claim over the years do not constitute that the over-quota is rightful, but we are doing it for the sake of supportive customer and an effort to return some room for flexibility.

Even up till now, the site is still hosting with over 3.5GB of quota and its over a week despite our notice. As for now, we are not claiming the additional charges incurred for over-quota over the period of time but to request the client to relook at his quota and to cut it down to 1.2GB. In another email, we extended our goodwill offer to 2GB instead.

If anyone would have come across our hosting plans, will be pretty clear what $6.50/month will get you.

Last but not least, thank you for contributing.

[UH-Bobby]

The thing is, they honored their end of the agreement. They never "changed the deal" as you say. Now, they probably shouldn't have allowed you to use more than you were supposed to for so many years.

Basically, it boils down to, they let you use more than your were supposed to, and you thought that it would stay that way forever, and then they cracked down on it.

The timestamp of files is entirely irrelevant. It doesn't matter how long you've overused what you were allowed to, the fact is, you only have 1.2 GB and you are using 3.5GB, and you either have to pay more, leave, or reduce diskspace.

You've opted to leave, and so that's it.

[Keith W]

To the OP, did you give sprintserve your permission to post your private communications with them on this forum?

If not that is a serious breach of customer confidentiality.

To sprintserve, why did you not have a mechanism in place to cut off his account when he reached his storage limit thus stopping him from uploading more data and going over his limit?

One possible reason would be that the OP is telling the truth and he had a custom plan in place and never actually went over his limits

[gorme]

Originally Posted by 040Hosting

Reading both sites of the story, it seems that no black and white agreement was made between both parties, which sometimes happen, especially when companies start up.

I believe the provider did offer you their services and i believe you received them; now they simply need to see the money for the space you use; and you have a choice; accept it; or move on.

If you payed the company for a year of service you could either request the money back (depending on their policy you did accept when signing up) or just move on.

Next time make sure you have a clear understanding on what you did order, and make sure you have this black on white.

Exactly. I don't deny them the right to change our agreement with sufficient notice, I just expected them to fulfill their agreement for the year I paid for or refund me for the time they refuse to. Just like any other contract. It would be profitable to have a company policy that no refunds apply even when you change the deal after payment, but that's not legal and it's not fair.

They admit they provided 3.5 gig of space for many years, I say they did it for 5 years from the beginning. They say they turned a blind eye to it, I say that means they admit they knew. They admit they didn't demand the account get under a 1.2 gig limit, I say that proves they knew that limit was not our arrangement.

I have already moved on, I no longer trust Sprintserve and found a better deal. They refused to honor our deal and refused to answer my last email, which is why I brought the matter to this forum. I just want a refund for the time I paid for.