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  1. #1

    Angry Ripped off by Totallyhosted.net??

    When is a 30 day refund not a refund?

    When your Totally Toasted!

    Totallyhosted.net owes me a refund under their 30 day money-back guarantee, which they have assiduously ignored. Paypal has (of course) said they can't (won't) get my money back, but I've initiated a chargeback, which should P**s everybody off right quick.

    There was a thread awhile back started by (I believe) DesignNYC about not getting paid by a predecessor of Totallyhosted for some work. In the course of this thread there was some issue about whether Ben Hawker was actually a man named Samuel Barr, a fellow from whom Mr. Hawker said he bought Totallyhosted (or something).

    I have been dealing with Ben Hawker. I should note that when Paypal sent me a note saying tough luck Charlie, they noted that the ultimate payee was a gentleman named Samuel Barr...

    Now, as I've gone through two hosting companies on this forum, a brief note on how to run a hosting service folks! All of this is not necessarily related to my dispute with Mr. Hawker, which is a separate issue.

    1. Service is more important than a low price. Of course everybody wants a low price, but getting things done when you want it is more important than the size of the hard disk space. The problem with Cpanel and such is that they are systems that are so automated it ignores the fact that you often need real people behind the systems, and the problems that are encountered in setting up sites often can't come out of a paint by numbers answer book.

    2. When you are having trouble with your service talk to your customers but more importantly ask them what they want and see if some reasonable accommodation can be brought about. Don't slap around your employees in public, however. And don't fire your tech people until you have new ones lined up.

    3. When you are in financial trouble, NEVER ignore your creditors. It destroys any good will you could have played upon and ends up compounding the problem, in you having to make up stupid lies. Often your creditors embarass you on forums like this, the very lifeblood of new su--, er, customers.

    Johnny


  2. #2
    I have a question. After this, do you feel that you should fork out a little bit more money for service and quality or are you still going to try providers who offer the world to you for 50 cents?

    I'm only asking out of curiosity.
    YourCheapHost.com - Low cost multi domain hosting solutions. [Legal adult content friendly]
    Reliable web site hosting is our motto. We have Alertra stats to back that up.
    Proven provider of high quality shared and reseller accounts since 2002.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
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    USA
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    5,779
    There are quite a few frims here that know how to run a hosting company. Maybe your point 1, should be to customers looking for hosting.

    You get what you pay for.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Downunder..
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    2,612
    Totallyhosted.net also ripped off the webdesigner i use.......

  5. #5
    Look, he posts here about their good order form script:

    http://www.totallyhosted.net/forums/...php?threadid=6

    The problem is Ben has not even paid for it.

    http://www.virgil.ca/thosted/order.php

    He is using my script illegally and WHT has not blocked him down yet.

  6. #6

    quality v. money

    Net-trend--

    Your reply implies that there may be a correlation between paying more money and getting better service. I would contend that the two are not necessarily linked, or that the difference of a few dollars per month might not make the necessary difference. Yes, there is a probably a quantum leap going from say totallyhosted to Verio and a steep difference in price accompanies this.

    However, most people on this forum are probably using Cpanel, are relatively small operations, and therefore its entirely unclear that paying a bit more will make any difference in the service quality.

    One of the biggest mistakes new companies make is to tryt o compete on price. This is because existing competitors with an established base will have a natural advantage. The problem is that where there is little to differentiate services then there is not much else to compete on. The issue then is really getting the name out there and reeling in customers, and then retaining them.

    CE

  7. #7
    Virgil and edude--

    How much money does he owe everybody? I wonder what the sums are?

    CE

  8. #8

    Re: quality v. money

    Originally posted by CaveatEmptor

    One of the biggest mistakes new companies make is to tryt o compete on price. This is because existing competitors with an established base will have a natural advantage. The problem is that where there is little to differentiate services then there is not much else to compete on. The issue then is really getting the name out there and reeling in customers, and then retaining them.

    CE
    Yes you are absolutely right. But how many small or medium sized hosts that are SUCESSFUL and have a good running record actually price their plans within the lower end of the market?

    Of course there is the particular host that will offer great service with the lowest of prices (and being honest at the same time). But tell me this, how long will they be able to go on providing plans at that price before they mark it up? Or how long can they stay in business?

    So the old saying "you pay for what you get" definately makes for something, especially in the web hosting industry.
    YourCheapHost.com - Low cost multi domain hosting solutions. [Legal adult content friendly]
    Reliable web site hosting is our motto. We have Alertra stats to back that up.
    Proven provider of high quality shared and reseller accounts since 2002.

  9. #9
    Then the reality is that 85 percent of the hosting companies on this forum are doomed to failure. Probably the smartest thing is to start with some sort of consolidation move, where each company is owned bya central authority but franchised out to the local hosting agent. Then you could share resources.

    Sharing resources could be an interesting way to retrieve money from the subject of this topic as well, if enough people are out of pocket. Are there any other people out there who have a beef with totallyhosted.net?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    USA
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    5,779

    Re: quality v. money

    Originally posted by CaveatEmptor
    Net-trend--

    Your reply implies that there may be a correlation between paying more money and getting better service. I would contend that the two are not necessarily linked, or that the difference of a few dollars per month might not make the necessary difference.
    However, most people on this forum are probably using Cpanel, are relatively small operations, and therefore its entirely unclear that paying a bit more will make any difference in the service quality.

    One of the biggest mistakes new companies make is to tryt o compete on price. This is because existing competitors with an established base will have a natural advantage
    CE

    I do not get the correlation you are making on Cpanel to good service and small host.

    The few dollars a month can make a big difference in quality of service. If most consumers would educate themselves a bit they would clearly see that so many of the deals offered here and elsewhere are impossible. Take the cheapest dedicated server at RackShack cost $99.00 a month with 400 gig of transfer and a 40 Gig hard drive. Now how many plans that have 2 gig of space and 50 Gig of transfer do you really think a host can sell for $10.95 a month and stay in business?

    Yet day after day people ask for that and more, for even less and yet complain when the host shuts down or does not deliver.
    I see day after day host that have people post complaints against them for cheating customers etc and the host refuses to do anything about it. People read about them and think oh well the price is so cheap I will take a shot anyway, they sign up and then complain later when they get cheated.

    As for your last point I agree new host should not compete on price alone, but they do, you are wrong about one thing tho, the established host rarely cut prices that low, they do not have to. They have a client base that allows them to sell at prices that make money that is why they are still in business 6 months later.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Louisiana
    Posts
    396
    I COMPETELY agree with Monte!

    It is so hard to advertise on Web hosting index sites when there is a banner next to your advertising hosting plans starting @ $4.95 a month.

    Not to mention the people in the web hosting request forum

  12. #12
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Scotland, UK
    Posts
    34
    Over the last week, I've noticed a slight price increase on quotes in the Hosting Request forum.

    Unfortunately it is from hosts that were offering silly deals before, so it doesn't inspire much confidence.

    - Omar

  13. #13
    Join Date
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    Location
    Tasmania, Australia.
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    Re: Re: quality v. money

    Originally posted by net-trend
    But tell me this, how long will they be able to go on providing plans at that price before they mark it up? Or how long can they stay in business?
    3 years, 10 months...give or take a few days.

    Cheers

    Gary

  14. #14
    Gary, your a genius....
    YourCheapHost.com - Low cost multi domain hosting solutions. [Legal adult content friendly]
    Reliable web site hosting is our motto. We have Alertra stats to back that up.
    Proven provider of high quality shared and reseller accounts since 2002.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Posts
    256
    This doesn't suprise me at all. Considering -
    - Ben Hawker claims to have purchased Totallyhosted from Samual Barr
    - He used this as a reason not to pay web designers for thier work (He claims it was the liability of samual barr).
    - Samual barr (previously eshorehosting.com) stole from many people with their "rapidisupport" scam.
    -Both Ben Hawker and Samual Barr seem to have a pattern of telling people they will pay them what is owed, and then never actually doing it.

    I would highly suggest you avoid any dealings with these individuals (if they are in fact different people, as the pattern of fraud seems so similar) and warn others.
    Last edited by David_Kiofly; 08-26-2002 at 02:58 PM.
    Old man of the hosting world..

  16. #16
    Yeah, I was included in that rapidisupport scam. Caused the fall of earhost. But we are back up now a going good. But I still never got my $500 back.

  17. #17
    Boy this is a lot of money between people. How did this rapidsupport scam work?

  18. #18
    Result.

    the trading standards board of Glasgow has launched an investigation into Samuel Barr. If you were ripped off by Samuel Barr it would be helpful to add your details to the dossier being built against him.

    Get together
    The situation
    dates of the situation
    attempts to get payment
    your details
    and either PM to me or PM me and I'll give you the email address of the people at the TSB.

    CE

  19. #19

    Someone Stupid

    Hi Guys,
    I really don't know how to start this thread but to say I am sorry for the troubles caused by me.

    At this time I will fully admit that there is no Ben Hawker and Ben Hawker is Samuel Barr (me).

    When I started my business I never eber intended to maliciously con people (Never My Intent and Never will be) things seemed to be poplular and I was happy, heres where it all went wrong, when people paid me via paypal I would withdraw the money as as I got it and then when people where asking for a refund I didn't have the money to do that (due to my credit card being maxed out) I have come to the concusion that I will no longer accept paypal as payment and only use my merchant account.

    If I had used my merchant account in the first place every party would have been refunded.

    As for the web designer and virgil who created my signup script I guess I was impatient and went ahead and asked them to design or programme without actually having the full money (stupid me thinking I could get it before they completed the project)

    Now that things are finally going well and the business is ok (Hopefully Even After These Threads) I can pay the people who are owed their money.

    At first I have made an initial mistake and promised the money on the 15th, I should have said the 20th as my merchant account pays out on the 15th.

    Here who's on my list for payment:

    CaveatEmptor
    designNYC
    Virgil

    and i will be working something out with James at earhost.

    I am very sorry that I have sunk this low and I intend to make it right.

    Thanks for listening.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    New Orleans, LA "Nawlins"
    Posts
    1,131
    Originally posted by CaveatEmptor
    Then the reality is that 85 percent of the hosting companies on this forum are doomed to failure. Probably the smartest thing is to start with some sort of consolidation move, where each company is owned bya central authority but franchised out to the local hosting agent. Then you could share resources.

    Sharing resources could be an interesting way to retrieve money from the subject of this topic as well, if enough people are out of pocket. Are there any other people out there who have a beef with totallyhosted.net?
    Everyday in this forum there is a new host being mentioned in an alleged scam or mishap. At least half of the current web hosts should have never started their businesses. Many lack a business plan that works and several should have sat down and calculated the fixed costs and the variable costs, estimated their profit goals and priced their services accordingly. I see lots of issues with web hosts with dedicated servers. Many web host are not a legitimate business entity and and they expose the individual owners to litigation judgements should something go wrong. Many web host are just out to make a quick buck and don't give a crap about customer service. Also if a web host is going to market to the masses, they better be available full time or have some hired help. No such thing as a full time job in the office and a web hosting business on the side. For many of the web host wanna bes, it may be better for them to join an affiliate program with a large host provider.
    intellec
    ....you get what you pay for and you pay for what you get....

  21. #21

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Location
    Tasmania, Australia.
    Posts
    3,587
    Originally posted by intellec
    Many web host are just out to make a quick buck
    It's been there for the taking. Things are on the improve though, with clients taking the time now to find out more about the host and not just the cost.

    Cheers

    Gary

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    89
    THBen> Thank you for also wasting my time when you contacted ravio to do your logo design, and other images. I see now you were lying when you kept having excuses for the money. Pretty low.
    Corey Wojen
    [email protected]
    http://www.ravio.com - http://www.vbskins.com

  24. #24

    Corey

    Hi Corey,
    You actually did the work on the designs so please could you pm me with what I owe you. I have sent you my email addy ia PM.

    Thanks

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