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  1. #1

    Angry Tektonic screwing me over...

    I have been a happy customer of Tektonic for 2 years now. If you search my posts on WHT you will see that I have recommended them many times. That's all different now.

    I use my VPS just for my personal email and a few *very* low traffic web sites that get only a few dozen hits a day at most. I am very experienced with Linux, and I know that for a barely used server w/o any control panel you really don't need much hardware: I have a 128MB plan and usually my memory usage was around 50-60MB. I never had any alerts in Virtuozzo about resources, and I was happy.

    Earlier this week Tektonic sent me an email saying that my VPS would be migrated to a new server, and this would switch my virtualization method from Virtuozzo to OpenVZ. I have had OpenVZ VPSs before, and was not happy with their performance for small systems such as mine (which is one of the reasons I chose Tektonic). A few hours later my migration was complete and then the problems started.

    My webmail kept giving me IMAP server errors. I logged in with SSH and couldn't even execute a single command because my VPS had reached its maximum process limit. I rebooted via the HyperVM control panel, and logged in again. My /proc/user_beancounters file lists the maximum number of processes as 50, which obviously isn't enough. So I disabled my Apache and MySQL servers, and now I can only use the VPS for email by logging in and using Pine.

    I sent an email to support. In the past their support has responded within an hour, maybe 2. But this response took maybe 8 hours or more. They responded that I am trying to do too much with my plan, and I needed an upgrade...even though I have been using the same plan for 2 years with no problems! The problem is not me trying to do too much, it is them imposing artificial limits on my number of processes.

    I replied and said I wanted to be moved back to a Virtuozzo server, since I never had any problems with it in 2 years, plus I NEVER ASKED TO BE MOVED TO OPENVZ ANYWAYS! It's been 36 hours since that email to support, and there has been no response. I sent a follow up about 18 hours ago, and no response to that either.

    Sad to say that I will probably be leaving Tektonic. I have always had good things to say about them, but right now my VPS is practically unusable and they really don't seem to care one bit.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    939
    We will move anyone who asks back to Virtuozzo. We are simply swamped with the migrations and have no intentions of causing problems for our customers. If you PM me your ticket ID I'll make sure you're back on Virtuozzo in an hour. Also, I will look into why you were never moved as our entire plan during this migration was if anyone was not happy with OpenVZ we would simply move them back to a Virtuozzo server.
    Matt Ayres - togglebox.com
    Linux and Windows Cloud Virtual Datacenters powered by Onapp / Xen
    Instant Setup, Instant Scalability, Full Lifecycle Hosting Solutions

    www.togglebox.com

  3. #3
    Thanks for the quick response Matt. It's a shame that I had to post on WHT to get an answer, but it is appreciated.

    My ticket # is ENU-62975-424.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    939
    As an addendum to why process limits are now in effect:

    We have noticed over the years that most of the time when we have performance issues over the years it is related to a VPS having a large amount of processes (CGI scripts, httpd, etc). With SLM there is no per-process limit which sounds really, really nice at first. Just set a MB limit and forget it.

    We learned something: We were wrong. VPS hosting is still a shared environment. It is not good for someone who purchases 256MB of RAM to be able to run 600 processes and it drives the host servers load up and like I said before is related to 90%+ of performance issues our customers see. Going into this we knew not everyone would be happy with the changes, but our thought process was that if we can eliminate almost all performance issues then the users who are not upset over the new limits will be even happier customers. It was fully expected some customers would NOT like the limits, hence the "migrate back to Virtuozzo" part of the plan. We will be implementing process limits on our Virtuozzo nodes also though using a SLM/UBC hybrid configuration.

    While this new method ours obviously upsets you and a few other customers, we are doing this for the betterment of the vast majority of our customers -- not to try to screw people over.
    Matt Ayres - togglebox.com
    Linux and Windows Cloud Virtual Datacenters powered by Onapp / Xen
    Instant Setup, Instant Scalability, Full Lifecycle Hosting Solutions

    www.togglebox.com

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    939
    Quote Originally Posted by nicedream View Post
    Thanks for the quick response Matt. It's a shame that I had to post on WHT to get an answer, but it is appreciated.
    Quick question, did you try LiveChat to get in contact with someone?
    Matt Ayres - togglebox.com
    Linux and Windows Cloud Virtual Datacenters powered by Onapp / Xen
    Instant Setup, Instant Scalability, Full Lifecycle Hosting Solutions

    www.togglebox.com

  6. #6
    No, I didn't try live chat. I already had a ticket in, so I stuck to that. I never had a problem with ticket times in the past.

    I am considering the options you gave me via email and private message. To be honest, I am not thrilled about either one, since I was very happy with what I had before and did not wish to change anything. And I was given next to no notice that this change would be happening. It was literally about 2 hours from the notification until the switch happened.

    I will get back to you sometime today.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    939
    USE LIVE CHAT! LiveChat is 24/7/365 -- other companies have 5-10 minute ticket response times, chat is instant and gives a better experience in my opinion.

    If you want to talk about the options provided by Dave and also by me please PM me. I can try to give you my best opinion.

    Honestly though, trying to run mail, sql, and httpd inside a $8/mo VPS is stretching it. The fact you could before it is why changes were made. You may want to try LxAdmin HostInABox, it uses lighttpd and only consumes 15MB of RAM for an entire hosting system -- you can get a 40-domain license from us for free and can install right from HyperVM. I'm unsure how many processes it uses by default, but if you PM me I can find out.
    Matt Ayres - togglebox.com
    Linux and Windows Cloud Virtual Datacenters powered by Onapp / Xen
    Instant Setup, Instant Scalability, Full Lifecycle Hosting Solutions

    www.togglebox.com

  8. #8
    I have never used host in a box, but as far as I see switching to lighttpd would probably be irrelevant. Even if it does use only 15MB of ram, I am pretty sure that ram is not my problem. Like I said, my total usage was always around 60MB, which is only about half of what I had allocated.

    Now if you say that the problem was the number of processes, thats fine. I never administered a VPS host, so I will take your word for it. And if you want to start to limit processes, move people to OpenVZ, move people to new plans, etc, that's fine too. I really would have liked to have more notice about this...one minute I am running fine, and the next my process limit was cut down to 50, and no one ever told me what was going on. The email about the migration just said that I was being moved to a new server, and made no mention what the implications of that move would be.

    I realize that my $8 account is probably more trouble than its worth to you, and you need to do what you need to do to keep the systems running smoothly and make a profit at the same time. It just should have been handled better. Maybe an email that explained in more detail that new limits were going to be put into place, and it should have been sent with more than 2 hours notice. Also, if you want to discontinue a plan, you should really give people who are currently subscribed to that plan advance warning too.

    I emailed Dave back, and told him to move me back to Virtuozzo with the proposed upgrade to the next higher plan + 6 month credit for the difference in price.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Greece
    Posts
    2,123
    lighttpd runs only 1 process, so if you use it instead of apache you save a lot of processes.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    939
    Ok, sounds like a plan and I'm happy Dave was able to sort things out for you. Sorry for any problems we have caused you, I really am. I will take your input into consideration in the future.
    Matt Ayres - togglebox.com
    Linux and Windows Cloud Virtual Datacenters powered by Onapp / Xen
    Instant Setup, Instant Scalability, Full Lifecycle Hosting Solutions

    www.togglebox.com

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Michigan, USA
    Posts
    3,872
    Matt,

    Just some advice to you since I've been using OpenVZ for a few years now, the process limit doesn't always add up correctly, I have seen it above 50 before when there were only ~25 processes in the VPS listed in ps. Just be sure you don't set it too low for some people.

    ** Here's a way to compare for you (inside the VE):

    # cat /proc/user_beancounters | grep numproc | awk {'print $2'}
    112
    # ps aux | grep -v USER | wc -l
    97
    Last edited by devonblzx; 04-18-2008 at 02:02 PM.


  12. #12
    OpenVZ is as good as Virtuozzo. Tektonic VPS have become quite stable these days, two of my contacts are very happy with Matta & Co.

    If NUMPROC is not set correctly for the PRIVVMPAGES value, core gets dumped randomly inside individual CTs. Make sure to ask Matta to set the NUMPROC to upset values, if not core bits will eat up disk space inside your node and CT performance will degrade over time.

    My 2c though a bit late ...
    --
    73s Ragu/VU2RGU
    A LowLie SysAd

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    canada
    Posts
    527
    Quote Originally Posted by ragubhat View Post
    My 2c though a bit late ...
    Like 2 years late? Kinda pointless, no?
    What did you expect was going to happen?
    6sync is where I've made my home ): // @tenkay

  14. #14
    Maybe little late, LOL

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    358
    Just a little.

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