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  1. #1
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    Many Reasons not to use GMail

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  2. #2
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    Shouldn't this be "A reason not to use Google Groups/Blogger some other services" but not Gmail?

    I like my GMail account. There's a nice hack for it so you can upload stuff into your Gmail account and have it act as a backup storage on the internet. Quite handy to be honest.
    Recommended: Stablehost, Hivelocity, Fused
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  3. #3
    I fully agree with you swizzi. Gmail is the best in email category. Just try with different addons on firefox and see its best usage. And we all know they were the first to revolutionize the email with GB's of storage. Before that yahoo & others was offering just 5MB space.

    GK
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  4. #4
    What I found most interesting was this comment.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henrik View Post
    What I found most interesting was this comment.
    Yeah I read exactly the same thing. A few comments down someone else confirmed the exact same issue. Let me know if you find any more information on that... I use Gmail religiously.
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  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by CArmstrong View Post
    Yeah I read exactly the same thing. A few comments down someone else confirmed the exact same issue. Let me know if you find any more information on that... I use Gmail religiously.
    If this really is happening, and Google is facing yet another XSS-flaw, then it will hopefully surface pretty quick. (I, as you I'd believe, am not feeling too comfortable knowing that there might be an 0-day floating around... again.)
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henrik View Post
    If this really is happening, and Google is facing yet another XSS-flaw, then it will hopefully surface pretty quick. (I, as you I'd believe, am not feeling too comfortable knowing that there might be an 0-day floating around... again.)
    Yeah I forgot about that. Didn't that exploit essentially do exactly the same thing? Allow people to access your contacts on any site as long as you were logged into Gmail? I'm going to have to do some research...
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  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by CArmstrong View Post
    Yeah I forgot about that. Didn't that exploit essentially do exactly the same thing? Allow people to access your contacts on any site as long as you were logged into Gmail? I'm going to have to do some research...
    Quoting from memory; You are correct.
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  9. #9
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    Now that I think about it, I've been getting a lot of bounce back emails. Actually all my emails sent were bounced back. Time to move away... I really liked their 'applications' especially spreadsheet!
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  10. #10
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    My main reason for not using them is the whole data mining thing. I can't imagine letting them have FULL access to ALL of your email transactions and putting together God knows what level of profile on you. Give them your SSN and bank info for adwords, all of your site info using their Webmaster Controls, your search and surfing habits, and then all of your email communications? Insanity.

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  11. #11
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    It's all to improve our online experience, dwrunyon!!!!!!
    www.DMEHosting.com - DME Hosting LLC | Servers, KVM/OpenVZ VPS's, Email Hosting, Web Hosting
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  12. #12
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    I've gradually been shying away from free email providers and moving to self-hosted solutions that I can control.
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  13. #13
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    I am still investigating the issue but I recieved the following e-mail. Thank god I did not update my bank information. I have not placed an order through google since Nov of 2007. My faith in google is fading.

    Sorry, because you still haven't updated your credit card information, your order from Synapse Global Corporation has been cancelled. If you'd like to place another order, you must review and update your credit card information in your Google Account first.

    Order Details - Apr 5, 2008 5:23 PM GMT+07:00
    Google Order #40XXXXXXXXXXX49

    Shipping Status Qty Item Price
    Not yet shipped 1 Synapse Global Corporation - Invoice XXX $179.70
    Tax (SC) : $0.00
    Total : $179.70
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by CArmstrong View Post
    Yeah I read exactly the same thing. A few comments down someone else confirmed the exact same issue. Let me know if you find any more information on that... I use Gmail religiously.
    That's an old issue - it has to do with their JavaScript libs and how it caches parts/all of your contact list in the browser. Other sites just go in and grab it.



    Regards,
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orien View Post
    I've gradually been shying away from free email providers and moving to self-hosted solutions that I can control.
    Your refreshing brand of intellect and forethought has no place on this board!





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  16. #16
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    One of the reasons I made this thread, besides being an interesting topic of conversation, is that there seems to be no shortage these days of kool-aid drinking google sheeple. I cannot speak for others, but I get concerned about something when people start to think a product or service does things others cannot do, is revolutionary when it is in fact not, or similar perspectives.

    As for some of the other posts, there are a few 0-days for Gmail and some of the other Google apps I've seen, aside from what was mentioned in the /. thread. You though those were bad. How about logging in to anyones Gmail account, provided you already have one?


    The bottom line is if you do not pay someone money or compensate them monetarily, in the US you have virtually no legal recourse against services.



    Regards,
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  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by gkdoda View Post
    .Gmail is the best in email category.
    GK

    Im also think so!
    <<< Please see Forum Guidelines for signature setup. >>>
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  18. #18
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    Until I find a better email solution, I'm sticking with Gmail.
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  19. #19
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    is there any chance gmail team reads this thread?
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by elvis1 View Post
    is there any chance gmail team reads this thread?
    Why would it matter? I'm sure they're aware of the problem.
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  21. #21
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    I'm sure they'll fix it before it comes out of beta
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by daejuanj View Post
    Why would it matter? I'm sure they're aware of the problem.
    why are you so mean ?

    why are you so confident ?? do you work @google?
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  23. #23
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    Why would anyone use Google for anything other than searches is beyond me. Do you not realize how much of your personal information Google has and stores? Ever think what would happen if that information fell into the wrong hands or Google's 'do no evil' philosophies fade?
    I trust Microsoft more and occasionally use Hotmail for what I need. And www.com
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by utropicmedia-karl View Post
    I am very certain that Gmail is not the only provider which has this problem. Gmail is one thing Google has done right - kind of sad to see it attacked like this.
    Daniel B., CEO - Bezoka.com and Ungigs.com
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Stealthy One View Post
    I am very certain that Gmail is not the only provider which has this problem. Gmail is one thing Google has done right - kind of sad to see it attacked like this.
    If this is something they did right I perish to see what they did wrong.



    Regards,
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  26. #26
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    I do not like their search engine, but their email/productivity suite is one service that allows me to be more productive than any other package I've tried. I have a personal/business Gmail account, and a Google Apps account for the company. I am very pleased with both.
    Daniel B., CEO - Bezoka.com and Ungigs.com
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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by utropicmedia-karl View Post
    If this is something they did right I perish to see what they did wrong.



    Regards,
    Touche. Can I include that in my signature?
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  28. #28
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    one reason to use gmail - its free stop moaning about a free service..
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  29. #29
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    The expert opinion in this thread and the /. comments is just staggering. Has, Gmail had issues before, of course, and so did most every other provider. I would still rather trust Google over some other private provider. I'm not really sure what instantly makes any other service suddenly immune from all the accusations that, say karl specifically, is making against it. Am I supposed to just take every other provider on their word that they won't turn around and do something shady with that very same information? Hardly seems like a tangible argument, but it does look nice to pretend to be an expert.
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  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkdoda View Post
    I fully agree with you swizzi. Gmail is the best in email category. Just try with different addons on firefox and see its best usage. And we all know they were the first to revolutionize the email with GB's of storage. Before that yahoo & others was offering just 5MB space.
    They were not the first to provide gigabytes of space to users I know people who had several gigs of email long before gmail was launched.

    and why would you need several gigs of email storage? I always thought my 1GB or so (I forget what I set it at) was overkill.

    6608.309498MB of space! what are you emailing? A movie?
    I could tell you a joke about UDP. But I'm not sure you would get it!
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  31. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by utropicmedia-karl View Post
    That's an old issue - it has to do with their JavaScript libs and how it caches parts/all of your contact list in the browser. Other sites just go in and grab it.
    The XSS-flaw quote above was fixed - however, it is entirely possible that there's a new hole, perhaps with the new version of Gmail.

    In either case, it is not good if the reports coming are accurate.


    Quote Originally Posted by LinuxGod View Post
    one reason to use gmail - its free stop moaning about a free service..
    There is a premium (read paid for) version of Google Apps, where Google Mail (Gmail) is an integral part of this service offer.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dan541 View Post
    They were not the first to provide gigabytes of space to users I know people who had several gigs of email long before gmail was launched.

    and why would you need several gigs of email storage? I always thought my 1GB or so (I forget what I set it at) was overkill.

    6608.309498MB of space! what are you emailing? A movie?
    If you use the same email-account over a period of time, the storage does build up to numbers over several GB. (And no, this doesn't have to do with "emailing movies", rather normal day to day-usage.)
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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by elvis1 View Post
    why are you so mean ?

    why are you so confident ?? do you work @google?
    The story was on Slashdot. Besides, Gmail is still in beta, so what do you expect?
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  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by mdrussell View Post
    Touche. Can I include that in my signature?
    By all means! I grant you full copyright use.



    Kind Regards,
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  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by dyna! View Post
    The expert opinion in this thread and the /. comments is just staggering. Has, Gmail had issues before, of course, and so did most every other provider. I would still rather trust Google over some other private provider. I'm not really sure what instantly makes any other service suddenly immune from all the accusations that, say karl specifically, is making against it. Am I supposed to just take every other provider on their word that they won't turn around and do something shady with that very same information? Hardly seems like a tangible argument, but it does look nice to pretend to be an expert.
    It takes some common sense and perhaps some business acumen is all. If you give someone money for something there are inherent rights you receive, along with the product or service. Google has everyone in one place: their paid services and the free services, so everyone get's the same headaches.

    You don't have to take providers "at their word" when you give them money. You take them at their policies governing such practices. At least with other providers you have recourse. With google's free services you have no legal recourse. Keep in mind google's paid services are using -identical- code to their free services.

    And yes, I am an expert at this as people pay me to be one: everything from architecting high-performance compute clusters(with real grids) to geographic CDNs, including all the legal import/export/trade/govt. coup-in-progress headaches that accompany such. They also pay my team and I to run a legitimate company with lawyers and all, so I have had experience asking counsel these questions, in fact, these exact questions.



    Regards,
    Last edited by utropicmedia-karl; 04-10-2008 at 10:29 AM. Reason: spelling! Need more red bull!
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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan541 View Post
    They were not the first to provide gigabytes of space to users I know people who had several gigs of email long before gmail was launched.

    and why would you need several gigs of email storage? I always thought my 1GB or so (I forget what I set it at) was overkill.

    6608.309498MB of space! what are you emailing? A movie?
    No gmail was not the first who offered 1gb mail box but it's the first big player that made it mainstream. Why did Yahoo or MSN offer larger mail box only after gmail introduced ?

    It's not the storage space that makes gmail no. 1 ... We don't use gmail just because of its gigantic storage but many many other features.
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  36. #36
    I don't understand why big sites would be taking advantage of what is essentially an exploit to get users contacts, wouldn't that just ruin users trust for a website, instead of getting them to "invite" their friends?
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  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mace39 View Post
    I don't understand why big sites would be taking advantage of what is essentially an exploit to get users contacts, wouldn't that just ruin users trust for a website, instead of getting them to "invite" their friends?
    I doubt most users would understand the implications.
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  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by utropicmedia-karl View Post
    It takes some common sense and perhaps some business acumen is all. If you give someone money for something there are inherent rights you receive, along with the product or service. Google has everyone in one place: their paid services and the free services, so everyone get's the same headaches.
    Okay, so you're implying that by paying money I get some legal protection rights, which is correct. But what does that have anything to do with the second part of this paragraph? If I pay for the Google services, do I not get the same rights as if I paid for say your services? What tie are you trying to make between the first part which implies legal repercussions and the fact that the code offering behind the free and paid Google services are 99% identical?

    You don't have to take providers "at their word" when you give them money. You take them at their policies governing such practices. At least with other providers you have recourse.
    So since you've seemingly taken effort in the first paragraph to tie the free and paid Google services, why now are you splitting the two up? The service agreement that goes along with the Google account is acceptable to me. Frankly, I can't even find the terms of service that you offer on your services on your site. I'm sure they're listed somewhere, maybe in the section after I've given you my money, but that seems rather far in the process.


    To get back to the original link you've provided. It talked about one specific feature that the particular user did not agree with on /. I gotta be totally open with you, if someone wanted to just spam an account, I'm certain they would find an easier way than to first of all spam the Gmail servers with a falsified from address. That entire post was sensationalist commentary at best.

    And yes, I am an expert at this as people pay me to be one...
    I don't question your experience, but then please, by all means, provide a valid argument for what the many reasons that you feel exist to not use the Gmail service and please do include on how you feel other providers do it differently. I find it hard to understand, why, if being such an expert you choose to link /. comments and use that as the entire basis for your expert argument.

    Cheers!
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  39. #39
    I have recently started using google apps with a small student company that I work for. It is so much easier and user friendly then working with horde or squirel mail that comes with cpanel.

    I was weary about gmail back in the early days, but a couple of years later, I am starting to trust it a bit more.

    Hotmail annoys me so much - microsoft are too restrictive on it free services compared to google!
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  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by dyna! View Post
    Okay, so you're implying that by paying money I get some legal protection rights, which is correct. But what does that have anything to do with the second part of this paragraph? If I pay for the Google services, do I not get the same rights as if I paid for say your services? What tie are you trying to make between the first part which implies legal repercussions and the fact that the code offering behind the free and paid Google services are 99% identical?
    You do, however, we don't have issues with 1000s of spammers using our servers, breaking captchas for email accounts.

    So since you've seemingly taken effort in the first paragraph to tie the free and paid Google services, why now are you splitting the two up? The service agreement that goes along with the Google account is acceptable to me. Frankly, I can't even find the terms of service that you offer on your services on your site. I'm sure they're listed somewhere, maybe in the section after I've given you my money, but that seems rather far in the process.
    They are linked to in the sign up process, also you can view them on any page from the menu: About->Policies.


    To get back to the original link you've provided. It talked about one specific feature that the particular user did not agree with on /. I gotta be totally open with you, if someone wanted to just spam an account, I'm certain they would find an easier way than to first of all spam the Gmail servers with a falsified from address. That entire post was sensationalist commentary at best.
    Hundreds of people disagree with you enough to take time and comment on /. about it, but we all are entitled to our own opinion.

    I don't question your experience, but then please, by all means, provide a valid argument for what the many reasons that you feel exist to not use the Gmail service and please do include on how you feel other providers do it differently. I find it hard to understand, why, if being such an expert you choose to link /. comments and use that as the entire basis for your expert argument.

    Cheers!
    The link was to spur discussion, that's all. It was not meant as any form of basis for anything let alone an argument. It was to discuss in a place where more people are concerned with hosting then on /. . That's all.

    I feel that any paid provider that does not allow a free automated way onto their systems does it better then GMail. I feel that any provider that doesn't cache private information in the browser does it better then Gmail. There were many issues brought up in the thread, backscatter being only one.



    Kind Regards,
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