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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
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    Questions about SEO/PR/Alexa

    After recently discovering what PR and SEO even are (yes I feel extremely stupid for not researching this long ago) , I've recently started manually submitting my site to the following free directories in an attempt to up our back links and PR.
    http://www.web-directories.ws/General/Free/page-1.html

    EDIT: Side note, is it worth it to submit to directories with no page rank? or should we stick to the PR 1 + sites?

    Between myself and a few members of the staff willing to help out with his boring task , we've covered around 400 thus far in about a weeks time. I noticed after the recent Alexa update that our 1 week average had dropped nearly 100k ( www.e-rev.tv) , is this due to the directories reviewing our site? Will this spike back up when we finish the submissions?

    Also , I've done as much research as I can on google PR, and I can't find a solid answer on when google PR updates. Does anyone know the time frame they use and when the last update took place?

    Appreciate the help in advance.

    -Erick
    Erick Pauley Erick@e-rev.tv
    Marketing Managerwww.e-rev.tv

    Electronic Revolution , Gaming TV Enhanced

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    1,902
    No one knows exectly about PR updates.
    I think that do things yourself if you don't have skills is time wasting.
    What is your main goal with SE? - Getting people which are interested in your deals. And they never look at your PR or Alexa ranking.
    I think that you'd better give this job for SEO specialists and start doing SEM
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~ServerPoint~ View Post
    No one knows exectly about PR updates.
    I think that do things yourself if you don't have skills is time wasting.
    What is your main goal with SE? - Getting people which are interested in your deals. And they never look at your PR or Alexa ranking.
    I think that you'd better give this job for SEO specialists and start doing SEM
    Well , in all honesty, what skills are needed to submit links to directories? I've read a lot of success stories of people up'ing their PR by doing it manually and posting their press releases.

    Our main goal is to simply have our page rank go from 0 to anything higher than what it is. We would also like to appear higher than our competitors ( we only have 4 world wide) on google and so on.

    Just to clear things up, we aren't a hosting company , in fact we don't sell anything. We're a broadcasting company and our revenue will stim from ad's placed on the site as well as being paid to cover LAN events.
    Erick Pauley Erick@e-rev.tv
    Marketing Managerwww.e-rev.tv

    Electronic Revolution , Gaming TV Enhanced

  4. #4
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    You are happy not to know more about PR and Alexa rank. Alexa rank does not worth because their algorithm can be cheated and most people does it. So do not count on Alexa rank? Just build your site for a better users experience and that's it.
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  5. #5
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    Jul 2002
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    Quote Originally Posted by ErevErick View Post
    After recently discovering what PR and SEO even are
    The only people that harp on about PR are those trying to seel you some snake-oil website on sitepoint forums

    Search engines dont buy things - make you site user friendly and human readable ...

    Quote Originally Posted by ErevErick View Post
    I've recently started manually submitting my site to the following free directories
    How many times have *you* used a free directory to research something and get a link to a product - exactly !

    Quote Originally Posted by ErevErick View Post
    I noticed after the recent Alexa update that our 1 week average had dropped nearly 100k
    There are so many well documented reasons why the Alexa rank is a worthless metric, that its not even worth visiting their site to check it.

    I'd start by fixing the obvious errors with your website - it'l do more than any amount of submitting to directories.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by othellotech View Post
    The only people that harp on about PR are those trying to seel you some snake-oil website on sitepoint forums

    Search engines dont buy things - make you site user friendly and human readable ...


    How many times have *you* used a free directory to research something and get a link to a product - exactly !


    There are so many well documented reasons why the Alexa rank is a worthless metric, that its not even worth visiting their site to check it.

    I'd start by fixing the obvious errors with your website - it'l do more than any amount of submitting to directories.
    Appreciate your response. The only reason we've submitted to the free directories were for the back links to improve the PR. Again , we don't actually sell products, we sell our content. And were hoping a higher PR would improve our advertisement appeal. Thanks again for the input.
    Last edited by ErevErick; 02-04-2008 at 08:43 PM.
    Erick Pauley Erick@e-rev.tv
    Marketing Managerwww.e-rev.tv

    Electronic Revolution , Gaming TV Enhanced

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    543
    I've a .tv blog that has currently PR:3, in my experience back linking with media sites helped a lot particularly for .tv, now I am expecting PR 5 plus in next update.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Needham, MA
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    PR is important, but the best way to improve PR is to provide more relevant content and be linked together with other sites that have high PR. If I were you I wouldn't submit to any directories with a PR lower than 3 or 4. It's just not valuable for your business otherwise. Spend more of that time finding partners or writing press releases.

    PR usually updates 2 or 3 times a year, but nobody really knows when.

    Alexa is a fickle ranking system. It's fairly useless until you're above the 100K mark and even then it does fluctuate wildly. I would not use this as the sole indicator of how well you're doing on the web. I'd recommend checking out Quantcast and Compete as well, and of course, get a good historical look at your own analytics and stats, that's the only information that truly matters.

    I also recommend checking out www.websitegrader.com. It will do a free review of your site for technical SEO issues and give you some suggestions on how you can improve. (They may call you to try to sell you SEO services, but I think it's worth it.)
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by RatePointGuy View Post
    PR is important, but the best way to improve PR is to provide more relevant content and be linked together with other sites that have high PR. If I were you I wouldn't submit to any directories with a PR lower than 3 or 4. It's just not valuable for your business otherwise. Spend more of that time finding partners or writing press releases.

    PR usually updates 2 or 3 times a year, but nobody really knows when.

    Alexa is a fickle ranking system. It's fairly useless until you're above the 100K mark and even then it does fluctuate wildly. I would not use this as the sole indicator of how well you're doing on the web. I'd recommend checking out Quantcast and Compete as well, and of course, get a good historical look at your own analytics and stats, that's the only information that truly matters.

    I also recommend checking out www.websitegrader.com. It will do a free review of your site for technical SEO issues and give you some suggestions on how you can improve. (They may call you to try to sell you SEO services, but I think it's worth it.)
    thank you very much for your insight , i'll defiantly check out those sites. A quick side note, what are the best sites to submit your press releases to? free/paid? Thanks again
    Erick Pauley Erick@e-rev.tv
    Marketing Managerwww.e-rev.tv

    Electronic Revolution , Gaming TV Enhanced

  10. #10
    Alexa *can* be useful.

    People that talk about gaming Alexa are quite right. However, that applies to sites gaming Alexa in order to bump their apparent traffic while they are trying to sell the site.

    If you are *not* gaming Alexa, then it can be quite useful to take a look at the long term trends in the graphs once in a while.

    Use them as trend indicators, not absolutes and you will find them quite informative. If you also watch other systems, you will soon get a feel for how the graphs react.
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  11. #11

    Thumbs up << title removed >>

    Quote Originally Posted by ErevErick View Post
    After recently discovering what PR and SEO even are (yes I feel extremely stupid for not researching this long ago) , I've recently started manually submitting my site to the following free directories in an attempt to up our back links and PR.
    http://www.web-directories.ws/General/Free/page-1.html

    EDIT: Side note, is it worth it to submit to directories with no page rank? or should we stick to the PR 1 + sites?

    Between myself and a few members of the staff willing to help out with his boring task , we've covered around 400 thus far in about a weeks time. I noticed after the recent Alexa update that our 1 week average had dropped nearly 100k ( www.e-rev.tv) , is this due to the directories reviewing our site? Will this spike back up when we finish the submissions?

    Also , I've done as much research as I can on google PR, and I can't find a solid answer on when google PR updates. Does anyone know the time frame they use and when the last update took place?

    Appreciate the help in advance.

    -Erick

    Well whichi PR ur talking about? google status bar or google search engine?? if u r talking about Google IE bar then it take s 6 to 8 months to be update. if u r talking about google search engine then it changes oftenly.
    I would again suggest these sites for SEO books.

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    Last edited by writespeak; 04-21-2011 at 10:00 AM.

  12. #12
    Alexa is skewed at the very least to the point of being unusable and unreliable as an indicator.

    Toolbar PageRank (the pretty green bar) is worthless. Do not even allow yourself to be concerned with it. It is not a true indicator of the PageRank google uses in ranking considerations, and nobody knows or can see those values but google themselves.

    Pay more attention to getting your keywords in the anchor text of all links you aquire, as the anchor boost is far easier to measure.

    Pay attention to the actual quality of the website you want linked from. IE: do it's users like it. Is it ranked well for its own keywords. Do a lot of people link to them for being a solid resource. Is their theme related to your own.

    The above are far better things to concern yourself with.
    William Cross
    Don Halbert *play site*
    william@seofox.com

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    184
    Well , in all honesty, what skills are needed to submit links to directories? I've read a lot of success stories of people up'ing their PR by doing it manually and posting their press releases.

    --- Submitting your site manually to directories is your best opt. You get to choose the most appropriate category this way as compared to automated services.
    OneIMS.com - Internet Marketing and SEO

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    Our main goal is to simply have our page rank go from 0 to anything higher than what it is. We would also like to appear higher than our competitors ( we only have 4 world wide) on google and so on.
    I think that the main goal for wemaster who are doing SEO for own web site - number of visitors and sometimes placement and PR do not influence on it.
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  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by MrCat View Post
    Well , in all honesty, what skills are needed to submit links to directories? I've read a lot of success stories of people up'ing their PR by doing it manually and posting their press releases.

    --- Submitting your site manually to directories is your best opt. You get to choose the most appropriate category this way as compared to automated services.
    You are paying attention to the pretty green bar again. Obsessing over PR will not help you much really. Great, so your site lights up the bar, it will not help your traffic numbers. Directories are a great starting point, but unless it is an extremely uncompetitive keyword, directories alone will not get you ranked.

    As far as automated services, I agree fully with you.
    William Cross
    Don Halbert *play site*
    william@seofox.com

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
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    37
    Thanks for the great responses guys , I've taken a lot of notes from this.
    Erick Pauley Erick@e-rev.tv
    Marketing Managerwww.e-rev.tv

    Electronic Revolution , Gaming TV Enhanced

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Malaysia
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    The objective of any SEO exercise is to improve the rankings and thus the traffic to the site.

    PR really has little to do with that, its only real use is IMO for bragging rights.

    Submitting to directories can be a useful tactic to raise your rankings, but you have to insure that the page where your link will be displayed is relevent to your site and is indexed in the major search engines (Google, Yahoo and MSN) and that when they do put a link to your site it is an anchor text link and is not a "nofollowed", javascript or redirected link. PR of the page (not the site) is an indication that the page is indexed in Google and thus can be useful.

  18. #18
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    PR is one of the PRIMARY methodologies Google uses to determine relevance. While PR makes no difference when searching for very specific direct terms with little competition, it makes a LOT of difference when competing against more common keywords.

    http://www.google.com/technology/

    The biggest issues is that people think PR is important, but they're talking about the difference between PR1 and PR2. PR really starts to play a role much higher than that, but most people won't get there, and won't see the benefits.

    I should mention, that the PR rank that you seen is just a very general indicator and as was stated for many people is just bragging rights. The system is MUCH more complex under the hood than the 1-10 that you see.
    Last edited by RatePointGuy; 02-06-2008 at 11:13 AM.
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  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by RatePointGuy View Post
    PR is one of the PRIMARY methodologies Google uses to determine relevance.
    You are quoting from papers that were from a bygone era. When google first started out, nobody was linking for ranking juice, they only linked to sites they liked. However when google came along with their algo based on mainly links, that all changed and links became abused. In the past few years we have seen countless algo changes and filters to diminish that. PageRank has become less and less of the main thrust of their algo.

    When you say PR1 & PR2, you are talking about nothing more than a pretty green bar which is there for the simple purpose of making us watch one place instead of where we should be. Its slight of hand. And, in your case at least, it works.

    I read the particular google docs you speak of very soon after they were released. In fact, it was Phil Craven, from webworkshop.net, who wrote the first easily understood paper on PageRank, and it is still considered a definitive work. I moderate the SEO forums at WebWorkShop. Please don't throw patents and docs at me. I have already read them all
    William Cross
    Don Halbert *play site*
    william@seofox.com

  20. #20
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    I'm just saying that Google acknowledges that PageRank is still a a piece which is why I wouldn't disregard it, no matter how mysterious Google is about these things. To your point, even they say that there's a lot more underneath the hood, and your correct, that stuff under the hood is probably much more important in this generation of Google.

    There's no doubt in my mind anyone that focuses on PR solely is just asking for it especially the day when they totally turn over and eliminate it, but if all things were equal, content, domain name, links etc, do you think a PR4 would rank better than a PR3 for the same search? Or do you think it's been totally eliminated from the game and is just for suckahs already?

    I'll definitely have to stop by your SEO forum sometime and dig a little deeper, there's always more to learn, which might be the defining characteristic of your business!
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  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by RatePointGuy View Post
    if all things were equal, content, domain name, links etc, do you think a PR4 would rank better than a PR3 for the same search?
    I think PageRank plays a role still, but not the toolbar PR that you see in your browser. True PageRank, which is used in rankings, is not a 0-10 numerical value. I see PR1 sites outranking PR6-8 sites almost every day, however I have yet to see an "all things being equal" scenario in real life.. In theory it is possible, but in practice it does not happen often.
    William Cross
    Don Halbert *play site*
    william@seofox.com

  22. #22
    Google take about 3 months to give pr. If you want your website to be fresh because you just updated then submit your site map and they will re index you in about a day this is especially good if you changed any meta tags. as far as links its not worth the time and trouble to be on anything less then a pr3 in most cases how ever there are some very popular sites with low page rank and a lot of people say any link to your site is a good link because its potential traffic.

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by phillowe View Post
    as far as links its not worth the time and trouble to be on anything less then a pr3
    Rubbish. Todays free PR0 link can be tomorrows expensive PR7 paid link. Stop paying attention to PR. Pay attention to quality and relevance.
    William Cross
    Don Halbert *play site*
    william@seofox.com

  24. #24
    I cant believe so many seo business owners or free lancers have a problem with page rank look the multi billion dollar company is right page rank counts if your mad because you can not achieve a good page rank maybe you should just wait until they rank you a lot of where you stand in the search engine has to do with time like i said before besides that are you telling me you would rather have a pr0 i dont think so if you can choose what choice are you going to make i bet you jump all over that 7 besides that if you have a 7 and your a directory you can make thousands of dollars a month selling links and ads because your pr7 site has influence on every site you link to. I just do not get how so many people dog out page rank when if it was not for Google's pr system there would not be anything called seo and we would not have jobs... I am not trying to argue with you but it upsets me that you say what i said is rubbish lol

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by phillowe View Post
    I am not trying to argue with you but it upsets me that you say what i said is rubbish lol
    If you read what I said, you might notice that what I said was that todays pr0 could be a pr7 later. Getting a link free there now would be the intelligent choice. In other words, definately potentially worth the 60 seconds it takes to get the link. On the flip side, you can get a link from a PR8 site and watch it go to PR0 for selling links next month if caught. Same time spent, same potential for failure.

    As for the pretty green bar IE: Toolbar PR, it is simply there to make you look there instead of focusing on what you should be to achieve rankings. Is this conjecture? No. The reason so many SEO's say this is due to the fact that some of us actually spend a good chunk of our days testing, testing and testing some more. What I spit out comes from that testing.
    Last edited by nuclei; 02-07-2008 at 03:50 AM.
    William Cross
    Don Halbert *play site*
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