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  1. #1
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    Choosing a backup for JaguarPC reseller account

    Greetings,

    The last events on JaguarPC (Demetrius server is down for more than 38 hours, no ETA of its recovery) showed I can't deem them reliable.

    May I ask you to advise me another reseller with good reputation, prices comparable with JaguarPC and good techs/support?

    Thank you.

  2. #2
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    Look at DowntownHost.

  3. #3
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    Check out HostGator.com
    They offer free WHMCS and other goodies, tech support from my experience has been great.
    Last edited by Cody Salter; 12-19-2007 at 11:32 PM.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by sclick95 View Post
    Look at DowntownHost.
    Are you a customer of downtown host?

    I don't think you can post offers or link to offers in this forum.
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  5. #5
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    JaguarPC is a reputable company here at WHT with good reviews.

    Unfortunately, there are no company's that can offer 100% guarantee that they will not have a problem. The difference is the capacity of restoring the service in case of a problem arise, like a disk failure.

    It's not because they add an issue that you should leave then, just try to understand what happend and if the explanation is satisfactory, just request a refund for that month.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by msm25 View Post
    JaguarPC is a reputable company here at WHT with good reviews.

    Unfortunately, there are no company's that can offer 100% guarantee that they will not have a problem. The difference is the capacity of restoring the service in case of a problem arise, like a disk failure.
    Until the major hardware failure I had no problems with JaguarPC and would be glad to add to the list of good reviews.

    Quote Originally Posted by msm25 View Post
    It's not because they add an issue that you should leave then, just try to understand what happend and if the explanation is satisfactory, just request a refund for that month.
    There will be no refunds.

    I asked the support about that and was told that hardware failures, as the one that happened on 18-th, are not the reason to request refund or receive any other compensation.

    Moreover, at their community forum someone has recalled that similar disaster happened to other server of JaguarPC (1-2 years ago) and it also lasted for more than 2 days. JaguarPC' promise was to prevent such long downtimes in the future.

    However, it happened again. And next time the HDDs of any JPC's server fails in this manner, all the customers will have to wait for whatever time it will take to replace the hardware and restore the data. Judging by technical data provided at JaguarPC forum, I can predict this time will only grow. It may as well become a wek of downtime - without any compensation, of course.

    There's no clause in JaguarPC SLA dedicated to this kind of problems.

    So, unless such failures happen, JaguarPC is good and reliable, and I can witness that. When server disks fail, there's a feeling that customers are on their own - and without backup data, they can't even move to another hoster.

  7. #7
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    I believe JPC offers services on different control panel. What kind of control panel are you using? Do you want to use the same control panel? Or you can try with another one? How many space, bandwidth do you need?

  8. #8
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    Check out Knownhost, I have a Pro+ account with them for a year now. Their servers are reasonably fast and in case of any problems they respond in a prompt and courteous manner. Rates are almost the same as Jaguarpc, though they do not provide free ips with a reseller account.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by gate2vn View Post
    I believe JPC offers services on different control panel. What kind of control panel are you using? Do you want to use the same control panel? Or you can try with another one? How many space, bandwidth do you need?
    I have replied by PM.

    Quote Originally Posted by bcmtouring View Post
    Check out Knownhost, I have a Pro+ account with them for a year now. Their servers are reasonably fast and in case of any problems they respond in a prompt and courteous manner. Rates are almost the same as Jaguarpc, though they do not provide free ips with a reseller account.
    Thank you, I will visit their site ASAP.

  10. #10
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    Well as others have said no host is immune for hardware failure. But what you need to look for is ones that try to minimize this risk. So for example they're running raid is one way to minimize the impact of hard drive failure. Granted it's not fool proof by any means it can protect from a drive failure.

    Obviously track record on here is also something to note. I think you're going to find that pretty much every host who has experience hardware failure requiring backups not a single customer was happy. I'd say probably 12-48 hours would be reasonable for an entire server restore.
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by TonyB View Post
    Well as others have said no host is immune for hardware failure. But what you need to look for is ones that try to minimize this risk. So for example they're running raid is one way to minimize the impact of hard drive failure. Granted it's not fool proof by any means it can protect from a drive failure.
    The irony is that server did use RAID. However, I don't know what was the RAID setup - uniting HDDs into large one or mirroring. The fact is the RAID failed in the manner that nullified its purpose (all the data were lost and restoration from backups became necessary.

    Quote Originally Posted by TonyB View Post
    Obviously track record on here is also something to note. I think you're going to find that pretty much every host who has experience hardware failure requiring backups not a single customer was happy. I'd say probably 12-48 hours would be reasonable for an entire server restore.
    No, it's impossible to make everyone happy. But here are possible solutions in such a situation:

    - provide temporary hosting space on another server - in order to set up temporary sites, perhaps even one-page ones with message to visitors - site is under maintenance/recovery, please wait. The absence of site affects their visitors/customers more gravely than the 'Maintenance in progress' page.

    At JaguarPC community forum I was told (by those customers that were not affected by the disaster) that it is in fact my fault of relying solely on a sole hosting provider. But hell, how can I re-setup all my customers sites elsewhere if I have no up-to-date backup data? so

    - provide access to sites backup data so I could restore sites elsewhere while the server is being recovered

    I would like to see those 'advisers' from that forum in the similar situation when they find out they have no actual data of their sites.

    To keep the last minute copy of those sites by myself is the only solution I see - i.e. set up another reseller account and automate somewhat the sites mirroring. However, it is not a trivial task, since I need to back up not only files and DBs content, but also email boxes setup/content and other resources. If anyone knows the quick way to do that without buying expensive hosting/software, let me know

    - if no access to temporary space/backups is available, compensate the customers by refunding them for the last month

    Yes, it makes the situation eve less happy for the hoster, but I wonder, do they care about their reputation? The hoster is tested by major failures. If they can find a compromise solution to keep their customers well aware they won't just be left in vacuum until server is back online - they should think about anything.

    After all, if everyone will know that in the worst case they will be just left to their fate to read 'progress bar' at the hoster's forum and left to their own devices to make their customers calm and reassured - I wonder what people will choose.

    As I said, until one is in such a situation, one can deem the hoster good and reliable. So did I.

    I do not withdraw entirely from JaguarPC at this time, but I will move most mission-critical sites off their resources in the immediate future.

  12. #12
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    If you are looking for similar packages / prices then you will probably end to a similar situation.
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  13. #13
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    Masterbo, what kind of budget do you have? What types of plans are you looking for (features, etc)?
    Thanks!


  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonyFF View Post
    If you are looking for similar packages / prices then you will probably end to a similar situation.
    What are the (more expensive) packages that can possibly prevent the same scenario?

    This reseller package is used mostly for charity purposes (I host interesting projects that are unlikely to find hosting otherwise).

    Quote Originally Posted by B-Z-M View Post
    Masterbo, what kind of budget do you have? What types of plans are you looking for (features, etc)?
    Thanks!
    I replied by PM.

  15. #15
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    I would checkout hostgator or axishost; both are very reputable around here.


  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by masterbo View Post
    May I ask you to advise me another reseller with good reputation, prices comparable with JaguarPC and good techs/support?
    Expensive than JaguarPC but a very reliable host with an uptime of 99.9781% since july 2005 and an excellent support team : Bluewho.com

    Similar range of prices and very realiable host also: Dathorn.com

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by B-Z-M View Post
    I would checkout hostgator or axishost; both are very reputable around here.
    Thank you. I was already advised HostGator and 55Host and I have had a good experience with HostGator.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by masterbo View Post
    The irony is that server did use RAID. However, I don't know what was the RAID setup - uniting HDDs into large one or mirroring. The fact is the RAID failed in the manner that nullified its purpose (all the data were lost and restoration from backups became necessary.
    All our arrays are raid10 . If a file system isnt recoverable there isnt anything raid will do for you. Raid is a hardware protection not a software or filesystem protection.
    Greg Landis | Founder Jaguarpc - Keeping websites happy since 1998
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jag View Post
    All our arrays are raid10 . If a file system isnt recoverable there isnt anything raid will do for you. Raid is a hardware protection not a software or filesystem protection.
    Thanks, I know what's RAID10 (1+0), I am using RAID myself. If file system becomes damaged beyond recovery, and no power failure/HDD failure was the reason, it means either extremely bad luck or poorly chosen software.

    May I ask you to comment on the other mentioned issues:

    1. If the previous failure of that scale, mentioned on JaguarPC community forum indeed took place and JaguarPC did indeed promised to prevent long downtimes, how will the company comment the current Demetrius failure (58 hours of total downtime for me)?

    This is not an easy question - RAID size will grow and unless you choose more efficient backup software, the recovery will take longer and longer. Personally, I will quit a hoster if they, in case of similar disaster just keep me without any hosting resources for 3 or more days without either temporary resources or compensation (no sites, no information about them - lost customers, lost reputation).

    1a. Will you modify your SLA to reflect your policy towards such downtimes? I think it should be stated explicitly.

    2. Would JaguarPC consider any of the mentioned suggestions to address such failures? Myself, I'd prefer at least the ability to create temporary one-page sites with user-given content (that would inform site visitors that a recovery is in progress)?

    Thanks.

    As I said, until that happened, I could provide only positive comments on JaguarPC efficiency, support and service level.

  20. #20
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    1) These large arrays can take a long time to decompress and restore. Sad fact really but one we are working to speed up by elliminating compression. It means adding Petabytes worth of new space but we are in the process of doing it for the whole network. Dont expect to see that changed for several months though one system at a time.

    About the sla modifcation and stating things Im not sure what exactly your suggesting be changed.

    2) yes, actually we are taking a look at many of them but nothings a simple change. The easiset "quick fix" we could do is route everyones ip on a given box that experiences a restore to one central temp "Sorry, this site is down for maintenance" page. Beyond that though we are exploring some really great ideas like failovers and clustering for vps nodes but I wouldnt expect those options to come without additional costs.
    Greg Landis | Founder Jaguarpc - Keeping websites happy since 1998
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  21. #21
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    Jag, both comments are reassuring, thank you.

    About SLA: I would suggest, after implementing 'temporary page displaying instead of site(s) in case of server failure' feature, adding the explicit statements that in case of severe server failure requiring time-consuming recovery, you will provide temporary page display instead if sites gone offline.

    One note: I would ask to allow resellers to make custom, per-site pages of this kind (for example, people I host sites for are mostly running sites in Russian, so the page should also be in Russian). Perhaps to make this feature an ad-on to Cpanel (so that every site owner could prepare and provide such a page).

    Good luck and thanks for the commenting.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
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    Very interesting post.

    I have a question about the backup services at Jaguarpc, if by any reason my server have a hardware error, etc. Can i redirect the domains hosted to the backup server to make them online with the backups instantly ???

    That will be great and i will be happy to pay the backup space if that's the case.

    But If the answer is no, it's only a backup space, then

    Where can i find a similar service i'm talking about or how can it be achieved?
    A backup server that works with the backup data in case the primary server goes down.

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