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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
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    Tomy
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    100

    Host says "NO" to com install

    Hosting company - which shall thus far remain anonymous - is telling me NO to installing ASPPDF on our shared account. I'm not asking for it for free - I'm asking them if I go and drop the $300 and buy a license for ASPPDF how much will they charge to install it.

    "Upgrade to dedicated!" they say. And still haven't given me a price to install it. I'm currently paying $40/mo. Their dedicated Windows plans start at $400/mo.

    Is this common? Or perhaps am I with the wrong company?

  2. #2
    The problem is the management of it. If lots of customers have lots of custom modules installs, it makes restoring a server or migrating shared hosting clients to new hardware a pain in the arse.

    If your "off the beaten track", dedicated certainly is the way to go - as you can install anything you like yourself. You should be able to find a decent dedicated machine for alot less than $400/month!
    Robert Bentley - SynergyWorks.co.uk - AS41659

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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Albany, NY
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    258
    It's not uncommon for custom components, but aspPDF is hardly a custom component, it's made by one of the top 2 ASP component makers. There are a bunch of shared hosts out there that will let you run any Persists product in a shared environment. You shouldn't need a dedicated server just for this.
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  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Waco, TX
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    5,084
    It is a choice by the providers. I know we have a policy against such for a number of reasons most of the revolve around legalities.

    We buy site licenses, and all are the same across all servers, we have a uniform set available across all, they are in our name, etc.

    I can see the reason a host would say no for these alone.
    Think if you were to leave after installing making legality problems, they then have this object that other customers may have stared to use(since it was available) that then leave them at a point to have to buy a site license for others because people saw it on one server that a client installed and now expect it on others.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Chennai , India
    Posts
    4,604
    "Upgrade to dedicated!" they say. And still haven't given me a price to install it. I'm currently paying $40/mo. Their dedicated Windows plans start at $400/mo.
    you can find a lot of good providers with a decent cost. Have a look into these

    http://www.dedicatedbox.net
    http://www.theplanet.com

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    North West England
    Posts
    612
    Or, alternatively, a vps - you can pick one up for a fraction of the cost of a dedi.

    I've got to admit, i agree with not installing it - keeping track of various customers components can be a nightmare - if i had installed it as part of the shared platform, then fair enough.

    Alternatively, pay the host for their own site license (at least part of the cost anyway).
    Regards,
    Leigh

    Host High - reliable UK hosting

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    India
    Posts
    200
    u can look at www.softlayer.com

    can get a decent server at lesser price ..
    david .c
    web hosting india , bookdomains.net
    windows , linux -- webhosting

  8. #8
    It depends on the hosting provider. We've dropped a ton into licenses across all of our servers, but these are usually for popular modules. Either find a new host or get a VPS/Dedicated server.
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  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
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    Softlayer or LayeredTech


  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Scotland
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    2,830
    Quote Originally Posted by SynergyWorks View Post
    The problem is the management of it. If lots of customers have lots of custom modules installs, it makes restoring a server or migrating shared hosting clients to new hardware a pain in the arse.
    This is the reason we stopped offering custom installs. Even when explaining that any migration would break it and we could not ensure 100% availability, it normally still came back to be our fault when the site was migrated and stopped working, only for them to notice days later.

    Quote Originally Posted by Omnibot View Post
    Is this common? Or perhaps am I with the wrong company?
    You are asking for something that isn't standard, so you definitely should not just assume they will do it for you. If it was advertised that they offered this then fine, but shared servers are limited in many ways and the lack of being able to install things like this is one of those limitations.

    Some hosts will install anything you give them but those servers are going to be a nightmare to restore/migrate and the objects they install could also open the server up to inside attacks. Just be aware that a shared host who installs anything you want doesn't necessarily make them a better host. A good host will test anything before it is installed on a server.

  11. #11
    I think you should take it that you are with a good host who understands the platform because their refusal to install one-off components is the correct one in this situation.

    They are protecting you and your neighbours from future problems.
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  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
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    Tomy
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    100
    May I reiterate that the com object in question is Persits ASPPDF, not some script whipped up overnight by the stoned chav next door...

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    West Michigan, USA
    Posts
    9,675
    Quote Originally Posted by Omnibot View Post
    May I reiterate that the com object in question is Persits ASPPDF, not some script whipped up overnight by the stoned chav next door...

    But its one that requires a $300 license, making it impractical to install it across all of their servers. It is much easier to run solid servers if you keep them all consistent. When you have 100 shared servers, all running variations of different software and modules - maintenance becomes much more involved. Will the latest upgrade of X negatively affect Z? If Server A crashes and we have to restore to a new server, how many different extra hoops are we going to have to jump through, because we have to relicense the server for a software solution that just one person is using?

    If you want the flexibility to run custom software or modules...get a VPS or dedicated server. Or pick a host that doesn't mind loading up their servers with whatever "trusted" software a customer demands at the moment. Personally, I'd stick with the host that has an organized system and understands the importance of keeping things consistent.

    --Tina
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  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
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    Tomy
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    That does make sense Tina; I see your point, as the host's architecture is spreading shared accounts across multiple servers.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Albany, NY
    Posts
    258
    I'm with the OP on this one instead of all the other hosts in this thread it seems Personally, I have no issues installing any object from Persists on any of our web servers. A user's custom COM object on the other hand is a completely different story and that's where the nightmare comes into play.

    If you were to ask me to name a vendor whose COM objects I would install without any questions asked, the ONLY vendor I could tell you would be Persists. We've probably used all their components at one time or another, and I can't remember any issues we've had with them ever. Would we pay $300 for a component for one person? No way, that wouldn't make any sense. If they purchased it though, we would definitely install it.

    This is where I respectfully disagree with the other hosters out there. Does doing this get tricky? A bit...but it's nothing that's hard to manage. Just jot down the fact they purchased ASPPDF in the customer notes and throw the license and install in there as well. It requires a bit of effort, but that's what customers want and we've found it pays to be flexible to this degree. Customer's appreciate the situation and are thankful for a host that goes the extra mile to do this.

    If we ever were to move that one client, we review the client notes for any specifics our support department have noted about their application and websites and go from there. In the event of a system wide failure, we take image based backups so there would be no extra steps restoring just this person's work.

    I'm a big fan of Dedicated & VPS's, it's where I see the hosting industry moving towards every day. I don't consider this thread topic a reason by itself to upgrade to one though. The OP is paying $40/month. Could he find a good VPS for that price and end up very happy? Absolutely. But he shouldn't have to, at least not because a Persists component. If it were actual "custom" code, I would be right along with the other hosters in recommending a VPS because I wouldn't ever mess around with the security and stability of our infrastructure for a customer.
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