Web Hosting Talk : Web Hosting Main Forums : Domain Names : Backordering by yourself

[DerMax]

Hello,

I want to grab a few domains who are currently in redemption Period. I read a lot about backordering services, they don't seem to be very honest, you often don't know how many people are in the same queue and they don't appear trustfully in general.

So what do you think? Would it work if I set up several servers who constantly check the availability (by simply WHOISing) and then, as soon as the domain gets released, send out a registration request via email or API to 4-5 different registrars?

Or do I have absolutely no chance against all those backordering and grabbing companies?

Thank you!

[Maybe]

I reckon that could work.

A lot of the "backordering" domain services check domains much less frequently than one would expect, so you might be in with a chance.

Unless I'm mistaken - to order via API I would recommend a resellers account with a smaller providor (just in case the larger providors, who often have a branch that run backorder services prevent you from getting the domain, and use the WHOIS that you run to get it for their backorder clients!)

[craigbrass]

Easy enough with a domain registration provider who allows API commands. You just have to set it up to send register command every few minutes and then you have a chance to get it. Just remember it is about 45 days after a domain expires when it gets released and you should be fine.

[dale]

I don't think it'll work. Even amongst the backorder services it is a discriminating process -- that's why people have accounts at different backorder services.

But I guess we'll never know unless the idea is tried. Has anyone done this before as a small, individual registrant?

[hekwu]

If a good domain name, the bigger domainers and resellers will get the domain...

Even then, the domain could go up for sale, without ever "really" dropping... directnic.com does this... and godaddy as well (I believe, but dont' quote me on godaddy. lol)

[Premier]

We do that, have a script that checks every second (the max) during the drop period on 2 accounts. 2 years ago it worked most of the time. Last year it worked maybe 20% of the time. This year...


There are so many others with so many accounts all doing the same thing now, so once a domain drops, it's registered within milliseconds. I know that because this year I had 2 times when the script would do the check and find it available, then follow up with the register request and it's no longer available and the script only takes milliseconds between the check and register.

[Malatya]

"Easy enough with a domain registration provider who allows API commands. You just have to set it up to send register command every few minutes and then you have a chance to get it. Just remember it is about 45 days after a domain expires when it gets released and you should be fine."

I tried it before, but not for 45 days.I checked the expired domains and do it for 2 hours.So i get it.But in high rated domains you have to try it per minute.and also the backorder firms know the time of expire certainly.With minute, hour.So they have a good chance but always own backordering is a choice i think.

[DerMax]

Theoretically it would be easy to check every second if the domain name is available. I'll test out a setup next week and I'll let you know if my grab attempts worked out

[trifecta]

It can be done, but it would be very difficult to grab domains with high value. The dropcatchers/backordering providers have made it into a science, and they have the server horsepower to blow most civilians out of the water.

The API method doesn't usually work because there are others who try the same thing. ICANN instituted a rule a few years ago limiting the number of simultaneous registration attempts at 250 per registrar. Which means that if you use an API, not only are you being squeezed by the registrar themselves trying to backorder, but also by others using their API. It would not surprise me if the registar themselves put a hold or limit on registrations during the drop window to maximize their chances of grabbing the domain themselves.

The absolute best method is to become a registrar yourself, where you will then have 250 simultaneous requests that you can dedicate to your own domains only. Of course, becoming a registrar is a pretty expensive and complicated undertaking...

[Domainitor]

Originally Posted by trifecta

ICANN instituted a rule a few years ago limiting the number of simultaneous registration attempts at 250 per registrar.

Do you, perchance, have a link to the ICANN site for that? I've never heard of it....

[dale]

Voila: http://www.icann.org/announcements/icann-pr16jul01.htm

[DerMax]

eNom seems to have several ICANN accreditations for the only purpose of registering dropped domains.
I'm trying to even up the difference by only putting important domains into my queue, the backdrop providers also don't know the exact drop time and therefore they have to check a lot more domains than I do.

My current setup tries to check the domain status every second and even lower. As soon as it receives a "non found" reply, it immediately sends out registration requests to smaller and medium registrars, definitely to no one which are involved in domain grabbing (especially eNom).

[dale]

Not sure about smaller registrars (as there are way too many), but which medium-sized registrars are not involved in domain grabbing?

[Domainitor]

Originally Posted by dale

Voila: http://www.icann.org/announcements/icann-pr16jul01.htm

Right. That's ancient news.... quite outdated. And it says 250 simultaneous RRP connections, not requests per second. The RRP protocol went away some time ago.

Right now, it's 15 connections in the guaranteed pool and 4 in the batch pool, with other 'overflow' connections on an 'as available' basis.

Given the outrageous XML overhead of the EPP protocol and a best-case half-second (end-to-end) per command, you'd need 500 connections to approach 250 requests per second. And since daily land rush processing is ony permitted in the batch pool, that means you'd have to use the batch pool connections of 125 registrars.

As I understand it, only SnapNames and Pool come close. Is there anyone else?

[trifecta]

Originally Posted by Domainitor

Right. That's ancient news.... quite outdated. And it says 250 simultaneous RRP connections, not requests per second. The RRP protocol went away some time ago.

Right now, it's 15 connections in the guaranteed pool and 4 in the batch pool, with other 'overflow' connections on an 'as available' basis.

Given the outrageous XML overhead of the EPP protocol and a best-case half-second (end-to-end) per command, you'd need 500 connections to approach 250 requests per second. And since daily land rush processing is ony permitted in the batch pool, that means you'd have to use the batch pool connections of 125 registrars.

As I understand it, only SnapNames and Pool come close. Is there anyone else?

Do you have a link for that? If true, that's extremely interesting.