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  1. #1

    Move account to another server in the same network.

    Hello,

    If you have two (2) servers and you want to move account from one (1) server to another, how do you get the new server to recognize the domain name right away? These two (2) servers are in the same network.

    This is what I got when I tried it.
    I setup the new account on the new server, it took an hour to 24 hrs to get the domain name to point to the new server. Sometimes it moves to te new server and move back to the old server. (move back and forth) If I delete the account on the old server, it will take several hours to 24 hours for the domain to point to the new server. Meanwhile, if the account on the old server is deleted, you will get a broken url when you url the domain name.

    Anyone have a solution to this?

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    Servers
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    Couldn't understand exactly what you are trying to achieve? But I never had a problem moving account between servers even if they live in east and west

    Why it moves back to the old server?

    Why do you want to delete account on the old server so quick?

    I moved a few of my domains recently. I gave them two weeks to fully adjust to the new environment
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  3. #3
    The problem is if you have two (2) accounts (one on each server) with the same domain name, then there would be a confusion on which server is responsible for handling the domain name.

    It seems like the two (2) servers are fighting each others for the domain name, so the domain name moves back and forth. The reason to delete the domain name on one server is to avoid the confusion between the two servers.

    Each time I do this, it will take few hours to a 1 day for the domain name to be on the new server. I just wonder if anyone could get the domain name to be on and recognize by the new server instantly.

  4. #4
    just change the dns zone for the old acct, point it to the new acct, and alter your TTL in the zone to something smaller

  5. #5
    Originally posted by AlaskanWolf
    just change the dns zone for the old acct, point it to the new acct, and alter your TTL in the zone to something smaller
    This is exactly what I heard and would like to learn.

    Could you show me example?

  6. #6
    I really need to work on this.
    It would be great if someone could show me how to do it.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Ann Arbor, MI
    Posts
    2,979
    This just requires a little planning. Before you change the IP address that a name resovles too, just lower your TTL to something reasonable like 15 minutes in the domain's zone file.

    Code:
    $TTL    86400
    
    @       IN      SOA     yourdomain.com. you.yourdomain.com. (
                            975932999       ; serial
                            10800   ; refresh
                            3600    ; retry
                            604800  ; expire
                            86400 ) ; minimum
    Something like the above might be your usual settings. But your telling all of your past visitors and DNS caches not to ask you if the IP address has changed for up to 86400 seconds (24 hours).

    So 24 hours before you make your changes, change these settings to something like this:

    Code:
    $TTL    900
    
    @       IN      SOA     yourdomain.com. you.yourdomain.com. (
                            975933000       ; serial
                            10800   ; refresh
                            3600    ; retry
                            604800  ; expire
                            86400 ) ; minimum
    Don't forget to update the serial number and or modify the refresh value for any secondary servers and reload your nameservers. Make sure you change this value back after the move to minimize DNS traffic from the Internet.

    These instructions are of course for BIND.

    Of course if you're moving the entire IP address to another server, then it's a whole other story with ARP cacheing.
    Last edited by bitserve; 08-10-2002 at 02:14 PM.
    -Mark Adams
    www.bitserve.com - Secure Michigan web hosting for your business.
    Only host still offering a full money back uptime guarantee and prorated refunds.
    Offering advanced server management and security incident response!

  8. #8
    bitserve,

    Thanks for putting out the time to show me.

    Let me try it out.

  9. #9
    Hello,

    I think the domain name part is easy now.

    Now, how do you move the files/data of an account from one server to another. These two (2) servers are within the same cabinet?

    OS: RH Linux 7.1

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Posts
    82
    Can the MX record be set to the hostname of the new server, or even the ip address of the new server? My current mx records are all set to domain names.

    Thanks,
    kmsd

  11. #11
    MX records cannot point to IP addresses afaik. It can point to any hostname though.

    To move the site, just tar up the directory on one server... FTP or SCP it over to the other server. Untar it there.. make sure permissions are ok... copy the <VirtualHost> entry from old server to new server. restart apache. Boom, should work fine.

    I move sites with literally 2-3 minutes of downtime.
    Roman Volf
    volfman@keystreams.com
    http://www.keystreams.com

  12. #12

    What about minimum ttl?

    Sorry to dredge this post up from the dead, but it was my understanding that "minimum ttl" (now used for negative caching) was the proper place to use a low value when preparing for a server move?

    Which one is it, or should both values be changed?

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Ann Arbor, MI
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    2,979
    Like you sort of said, it's only for negative caching. This might be useful in a server move if you are changing hostnames, but I don't see why you wouldn't just set up the new hostname early as to prevent any negative caching.
    -Mark Adams
    www.bitserve.com - Secure Michigan web hosting for your business.
    Only host still offering a full money back uptime guarantee and prorated refunds.
    Offering advanced server management and security incident response!

  14. #14
    Sorry, I'm a n00b when it comes to DNS. I did a bit more reading up on negative caching today, and now understand why it won't help reduce resolving downtime (negative caching just allows expired cache to be used a little longer in the case that a name lookup fails).

    Maybe I'm going about this all wrong, but just over 24 hours ago I changed the TTL for one of the domain names I am planning to move. I verified that the first line of my domain's db file is now:

    @ 60 IN SOA ns1.xyz.com admin.xyz.com

    where xyz.com is the domain name of the site I wish to move. I am hosting my own primary and secondary DNS on the same box until I have found a good secondary DNS provider in another location. The serial number did increment.

    I left the site on the old server active, so 24 hours after decreasing TTL I changed the A record's IP to the old server IP. After 60 seconds I would have expected my browser to stop showing the new site and start showing the old site again. It did not happen - for 30 minutes anyway. What did I do wrong?

    My new host does not provide DNS service, so last week I told my domain registar to set ns1.xyz.com/ns2.xyz.com as the nameservers for my domain name (xyz.com). I have set up my nameservers correctly I believe because I am able to resolve xyz.com.

    Do I also need to set TTL lower on my own nameservers before the move? They are at 14400 right now.

    Thanks!

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Ann Arbor, MI
    Posts
    2,979
    If you are using BIND, you should read the Administrator Reference Manual. Your zone files should start with a $TTL line if you want to set a default TTL for the zone. Or you can set a TTL for each RR.

    I don't understand the format of your SOA. It seems very wrong to me. I'm not sure what putting 60 there will do, and you seem to be specifying an authority of ns1.xyz.com.$ORIGIN amonth other problems.

    You completely lost me when you were talking about your "domain's db file", and then go on to talk about "your own nameserver" as if they're two separate things.

    You also mention changing a serial number after a change, as if you have slaves, but you never mention changing the serial number again, even though you mention further changes.

    And you own xyz.com? Why not post the real domain? I have a feeling that if you posted the actual contents of these zone files, using cut and paste, they would make more sense. As I'm assuming/hoping that a lot of what I'm seeing is just typos on your part. Plus, I could actually do some queries to fill in some gaps, since you left out tons of information on your setup and what you might be trying to do.
    -Mark Adams
    www.bitserve.com - Secure Michigan web hosting for your business.
    Only host still offering a full money back uptime guarantee and prorated refunds.
    Offering advanced server management and security incident response!

  16. #16
    If you are using BIND, you should read the Administrator Reference Manual.
    I am using BIND 8 - I googled a copy of the BIND 9 manual (only one I could find) and will read through it tomorrow - thanks.

    The SOA had 14400 before I changed it to 60 - I thought that was the TTL.

    The 3 IPs being used on the new server are:
    .5 ns1
    .6 ns2
    .7 host

    My full zone files are as follows (as you can see I've changed more than a few TTL values during testing/blundering):

    /var/named/civilizeddesign.com.db -
    Code:
    ; Modified by Web Host Manager
    ; Zone File for civilizeddesign.com
    @	60	IN	SOA	ns1.civilizeddesign.com.	admin.civilizeddesign.com.	(
    					2004010319
    					3600
    					1000
    					2419200
    					60
    					)
    
    civilizeddesign.com.	60	IN	NS	ns1.civilizeddesign.com.
    civilizeddesign.com.	60	IN	NS	ns2.civilizeddesign.com.
    civilizeddesign.com.	60	IN	A	66.197.146.7
    
    localhost.civilizeddesign.com.	60	IN	A	127.0.0.1
    
    civilizeddesign.com.	60	IN	MX	0	civilizeddesign.com.
    
    mail	60	IN	CNAME	civilizeddesign.com.
    www	60	IN	CNAME	civilizeddesign.com.
    ftp	60	IN	A	66.197.146.7
    host	1200	IN	A	66.197.146.7
    /var/named/ns1.civilizeddesign.com.db -
    Code:
    ; Modified by Web Host Manager
    ; Zone File for ns1.civilizeddesign.com
    @	14400	IN	SOA	ns1.civilizeddesign.com.	admin.civilizeddesign.com.	(
    					2004010304
    					3600
    					7200
    					2419200
    					60
    					)
    
    ns1.civilizeddesign.com.	14400	IN	NS	ns1.civilizeddesign.com.
    ns1.civilizeddesign.com.	14400	IN	NS	ns2.civilizeddesign.com.
    ns1.civilizeddesign.com.	14400	IN	A	66.197.146.5
    
    localhost.ns1.civilizeddesign.com.	14400	IN	A	127.0.0.1
    
    ns1.civilizeddesign.com.	14400	IN	MX	0	ns1.civilizeddesign.com.
    /var/named/ns2.civilizeddesign.com.db -
    Code:
    ; Modified by Web Host Manager
    ; Zone File for ns2.civilizeddesign.com
    @	14400	IN	SOA	ns1.civilizeddesign.com.	admin.civilizeddesign.com.	(
    					2004010303
    					3600
    					1000
    					2419200
    					60
    					)
    
    ns2.civilizeddesign.com.	14400	IN	NS	ns1.civilizeddesign.com.
    ns2.civilizeddesign.com.	14400	IN	NS	ns2.civilizeddesign.com.
    ns2.civilizeddesign.com.	14400	IN	A	66.197.146.6
    
    localhost.ns2.civilizeddesign.com.	14400	IN	A	127.0.0.1
    
    ns2.civilizeddesign.com.	14400	IN	MX	0	ns2.civilizeddesign.com.
    The serial number for the master changes automatically when I edit the zone within Web Host Manager, I did not manually change them. The only slave is ns2.civilizeddesign.com.

    Thanks for your help!
    Jon

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Ann Arbor, MI
    Posts
    2,979
    The fields for an SOA record are:

    name type class mname rname serial refresh retry expire minimum

    Not:

    name ttl type class mname rname serial refresh retry expire minimum

    Since you're specifying a TTL For each RR, the default one is going to be worthless. And since you're specifying 60 for most of your records, you might change the default TTL to 60, and then leave the TTL off of the records that you want to have a TTL of 60. I don't know why you had a seperate zone for your nameservers and specified MX records for them.

    Then before you changed the RDATA of an RR, you would change the TTL for that RR. But since you are using such a low TTL already, I'm not sure what you would change it to. Perhaps if you are going to change the RR with the name of "host", you might change it's TTL from 1200 to 600 twenty minutes before you changed it's RDATA. This would make the updates happen in 10 minutes instead of 20.

    You confused me again on the serials, because I'm not sure why you mentioned changing the serial, if you said that WHM changes the serial for you automatically. Not sure how that works. You'd think if WHM was modifying the zone file, that it would notice the syntax problems with it.

    I think I understand what you meant by changing "your own namesever". You were going to change the TTL on the zone files for your nameservers? At least, that's the only reason why I can see why you would post the zone files for them. Changing the TTLs of those isn't necessary.
    Last edited by bitserve; 01-07-2004 at 07:13 PM.
    -Mark Adams
    www.bitserve.com - Secure Michigan web hosting for your business.
    Only host still offering a full money back uptime guarantee and prorated refunds.
    Offering advanced server management and security incident response!

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