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  1. #1

    VPS's future in China

    I think VPS will be the rage in the future.Who owned a web will means he owned a VPS.

    VPS is cheaper than dedicated server.So lots of people pay for vps instead of dedicated server.
    In the pass ,people buy a bigger webhosting for the web site.Now,he buy a vps instead of the webhosting.

    In China ,The IP resources are tight, and a VPS needs one IP. So the IP resources will Hinders VPS's development.

    Do you think VPS can be the rage in China?

  2. #2
    Hey Man.... First Chinese guy I know with internet, congrats!

    I also have to commend you on your English, it's pretty good.

    Anyway.... China.... A country that is relatively poor, but is becoming more powerful, and richer every day.... I think, because most areas are over-populated it will be easy to justify the expense for datacentres...... I don't see VPSs as a rage though, not even in the Western World, but I think China will follow after the rest of the world...

  3. #3
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    China is always slow in technology related development, I'm saying this because I'm Chinese, but I am living in Australia.

    For instance, I can't stand for the web hosting industry in China, it's so messed up.

    VPS is little to unknown in China, not many providers offer VPS packages. That could change in the future but I don't think it will become much more popular than standard virtual hosts.

    How many host providers in China are offering control panels? Not many.

    Are providers going to provide management support for VPS hosts without a control panel? Highly unlikely.

    Are people in China willing to use VPS hosts without control panels? Some might, but that will be a tiny portion of the popularity.

    The fact is that, control panels such as CPanel, Plesk or Direct Admin cost too much for Chinese users. Most Chinese users if not all, are using Windows servers because of the following reasons:

    1, They don't know how to manage *nix servers.
    2, Control panels are too expensive for them.
    3, Windows is largely pirated even in the hosting industry in China.
    4, With Windows servers they don't neccassarily need a control panel.

    See, the hosting industry is different between China and western countries. Therefore what is popular here might not be popular 'there'. For example, many Chinese users never thought that a server has 'bandwidth limits'.

    Just my 2 cents.
    DevOps!

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canglan
    For instance, I can't stand for the web hosting industry in China, it's so messed up.
    What's so messed up? The web hosting industry, or the government regulation?

    Seriously, when I search for shared hosting under .cn domain there seems to be quite a lot of results. SWsoft also has its presence in China. I would think VPS is indeed one step forward just for CPU utilisation and power consumption reason. China is thirsty for more energy, and virtualization will help it to reduce its cost.

    IP addresses wise, it has always been an issue with Asian countries where there are more Internet users than anywhere else in the world, but have been allocated very limited IP addresses. No wonder IPv6 is much more advanced in Asian countries.

    Scott

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canglan
    China is always slow in technology related development, I'm saying this because I'm Chinese, but I am living in Australia.

    For instance, I can't stand for the web hosting industry in China, it's so messed up.

    VPS is little to unknown in China, not many providers offer VPS packages. That could change in the future but I don't think it will become much more popular than standard virtual hosts.

    How many host providers in China are offering control panels? Not many.

    Are providers going to provide management support for VPS hosts without a control panel? Highly unlikely.

    Are people in China willing to use VPS hosts without control panels? Some might, but that will be a tiny portion of the popularity.

    The fact is that, control panels such as CPanel, Plesk or Direct Admin cost too much for Chinese users. Most Chinese users if not all, are using Windows servers because of the following reasons:

    1, They don't know how to manage *nix servers.
    2, Control panels are too expensive for them.
    3, Windows is largely pirated even in the hosting industry in China.
    4, With Windows servers they don't neccassarily need a control panel.

    See, the hosting industry is different between China and western countries. Therefore what is popular here might not be popular 'there'. For example, many Chinese users never thought that a server has 'bandwidth limits'.

    Just my 2 cents.
    Hello,

    happy to see some Chinese here. I am also from China, but I stay in Singapore.

    just some of my personal comments about VPS or say hosting industry in China:

    1. Hosting industry in China is indeed quite different from the English world, in a sense they are mainly using Windows system.
    2. They do have control panels for webhosting, but they mainly (if not 100%) use those written by Chinese programmers. try search "主机管理系统" in Baidu.com
    3. VPS is being known by more and more people now in China, as many hosting providers are providing VPS. try search "VPS" in Baidu.com.
    4. there are quite a number of *nix players in China. And some of them are quite good in *nix management. you may want to take a look at the following forums: www.linuxsir.org/bbs/, bbs.chinaunix.net.
    5. they are not using *nix for hosting, probably is because that there is not so much demand in the market. However, the demand for *nix hosting is growing now, and we also see more and more providers doing *nix hosting.

    at last, I would say Baidu is your best friend to know more about China.

    RonyZ

  6. #6
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    I'm also from China I live in Shanghai now.You just can see some Virtuozoo VPS in China,openvz or xen based vps is almost nothing here.
    My Personal Sites:Oh !!!MIYU-GのDAYs
    http://www.1221.in
    MY LIFE IS COOL,SO IS MY VPS I WILL TELL YOU MORE ABOUT VPS

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by ylsy
    What's so messed up? The web hosting industry, or the government regulation?

    ...
    Well said.

    I think too it's rather a regulation problem then the webhosting industry.

    G
    PutFile.io Disrupting traditional file hosting.
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Googled
    I think too it's rather a regulation problem then the webhosting industry.
    I'd say both.

    Regulating websites is simply hilarious. Last year when I was on vacation in China, I opened up my browser, typed in wikipedia.org, and boom! Page not found! And, a couple of months ago the government inforced individuals to register (put on records) before one can set up a website, even if it's just a blog.

    Despite the regulation, the industry is messed up too. There are way too many kiddie hosts and take-the-money-and-run hosts. I know many friends over the Internet who have very limited technical knowledge yet still sell hosting packages (and provide so-called support by themselves).

    Also, the users need to be further educated as well. I ran a small hosting business a few years ago, and it was mainly targeted at Chinese users who were seeking for hosting environment in the US.

    It was stressful. In China, emails are rarely used. People prefer to use instant messengers such as MSN or Tecent QQ to communicate and to get support. Every day when you log on your instant messenger, you're flooded with tons of stupid questions. A large portion of the questions were non-hosting related, e.g. their forum software needs to install some plugins, they want to install Wordpress but don't know how, so on and so forth. It's okay to deal with these kind of things for a period of time, but not FOREVER! Especially when you clearly stated that you're not going to offer support for 3rd party software. Now, you might want to say, why didn't you use a support ticket system? The answer is I tried, but customers will simply ignore the ticket system and rather put the question right in your face!

    Last but not least, there are some serious technical issues in China. I'm no expert on this topic, but why on earth do they have completely seperate networks?! To name a few, there're China Telecommunication (中国电信), China Unicom (中国联通), China Netcom (中国网通) and more. The problem is, a user in a network, will get *very slow* speed to other networks. Even slower than accessing most of the websites hosted in the US! Now *that* is rediculous!

    Just my 2 cents.
    DevOps!

  9. #9
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    so good to see my Chinese buddies around WHT forums. I've been running websites for 3 years so far and my hosting companies are all in the U.S. The reason why I avoid buying hosting service in China is because their censorship is too strict. I am physically in the States and I have no way to register the websites at the Public Security Bureau.

    One of the hosting companies (Called Huaxia, sudu.cn) I know of provides VPS at a much higher price than their conterparts in the States. I don't know why VPS is so expensive in a place where almost everythin is inexpensive. May be too few competition?? dunno

    ps: I am from China, too and have been studying in a graduate program in the U.S. for 3 years. Glad to see you guys here

    cheers,

    IVYtony
    Tubenode.com - FFMPEG, PHP & RoR Hosting
    RCholic.com - R/C videos sharing

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by ylsy
    What's so messed up? The web hosting industry, or the government regulation?

    Seriously, when I search for shared hosting under .cn domain there seems to be quite a lot of results. SWsoft also has its presence in China. I would think VPS is indeed one step forward just for CPU utilisation and power consumption reason. China is thirsty for more energy, and virtualization will help it to reduce its cost.

    IP addresses wise, it has always been an issue with Asian countries where there are more Internet users than anywhere else in the world, but have been allocated very limited IP addresses. No wonder IPv6 is much more advanced in Asian countries.

    Scott
    Don't make this a Social Issues thread with government remarks. Just a suggestion.

  11. #11
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    Before I start, I must say I'm french, and I live in Shanghai (and I'm the owner of GPLHost worldwide). I'll reply to this post and have a more general post right after.

    Quote Originally Posted by Canglan
    Regulating websites is simply hilarious. Last year when I was on vacation in China, I opened up my browser, typed in wikipedia.org, and boom! Page not found! And, a couple of months ago the government inforced individuals to register (put on records) before one can set up a website, even if it's just a blog.
    Regulation is like that and you have to deal with it. Either you do political action, either you do business, but you clearly can't do both. To me, the blocking of wikipedia is more hurting the PRC gov than helping them, and I'm sure it's going to be unblocked soon. Blogs and forums ARE impossible to regulate, and I wouldn't personaly accept to host them in China (maybe ask my customer to go in one of our other locations... ?). Anyway, telecoms ARE going to be deregulated sooner or later (we are all waiting for 2008...).

    Quote Originally Posted by Canglan
    Despite the regulation, the industry is messed up too. There are way too many kiddie hosts and take-the-money-and-run hosts. I know many friends over the Internet who have very limited technical knowledge yet still sell hosting packages (and provide so-called support by themselves).
    That means that there is still a space for REAL profetionnals, and maybe a lot of customers are searching for it. Having a lot of "kiddies" the way you say doesn't scares me at all...

    Quote Originally Posted by Canglan
    Also, the users need to be further educated as well. I ran a small hosting business a few years ago, and it was mainly targeted at Chinese users who were seeking for hosting environment in the US.
    That's IMHO silly. Why would they choose you more than another american? Only because they don't speak english? Also, sometimes, connecting to USA is soooooooo slow from here! To me, a chinese targeted service MUST be located in China.

    Quote Originally Posted by Canglan
    Last but not least, there are some serious technical issues in China. I'm no expert on this topic, but why on earth do they have completely seperate networks?! To name a few, there're China Telecommunication (中国电信), China Unicom (中国联通), China Netcom (中国网通) and more. The problem is, a user in a network, will get *very slow* speed to other networks. Even slower than accessing most of the websites hosted in the US! Now *that* is rediculous!
    The solution is to use a multi-homed network (meaning connected to both ChinaNet and China Unicom at least). That way you have 1/ redundancy 2/ speed.

    Thomas
    GPLHost:>_ open source hosting worldwide (I'm founder, CEO & official Debian Developer)
    Servers & our leading control panel and our Xen VPS hosting, which are already included in Debian and Ubuntu
    Available in: Kuala Lumpur, Singapore, Sydney, Seattle, Atlanta, Paris, London, Barcelona, Zurich, Israel

  12. #12
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    Hi all, and especialy Chinese people !!!

    I am currently looking at chinese market, and I wish to enter it. My company has presence in many places like Sydney, LA, Florida, etc., but nothing in China yet. We had some tries with customer based in China and there VPS in Singapore, but it was not as satisfying as it should be with a local network connectivity (it almost always goes by Starhub which is not-so-bad).

    But my company faced 2 major problems. First, even if my wife is chinese and I can talk a bit Mandarin, I can't write or read anything in Chinese. Our (open source, meaning no added costs) control panel is translated to many languages. Chinese simplified is included in it, but the translation is NOT full (maybe 70% is translated, and since it has evolved a lot). Also, I would have need to do support for chinese customers, and that I'm sure I can't do it.

    Also, I have visited some data centers, and what I saw horified me. Imagine a room with wires everywhere, no key or security to access the racks, and consumer non-centralized coolers instead of a real centralized cooling system (with all the servers being on the side of the coolers). Even if network connectivity seemed nice, no way I would rack-in a 1500 USD server with many customers in it. That's too scary. But I'm sure it's because I didn't visit the good places.

    I'm currently actively searching for a RELIABLE individual in Shanghai that would help us to enter the market here BEFORE 2008. The job would be first to do the translation of the website in Simplified Chinese. Then we could simply jump in, create the chinese company and start racking-in the first server. Note that I'm searching for a real partner for a LONG work (years?). That mean a lot of work with no benefits at the begining before we get enough customers, like I did for YEARS for GPLHost world (but I'm willing to pay for the first translation job).

    Note that I tried to work with 2 guys in the past already, but NONE where responsive enough (no news durring weeks). Is there anybody here with a REAL motivation??? If so, please get in touch (PM me here, use my instant messenging contacts, or the contact form on our website...).

    I truely believe that VPSes will be the futur of web hosting in China like it is right now everywhere in this world. I know that the main issue is IP addresses, but there are many ways to get them if you know the correct persons.

    I hope I'm not too much off-topic here and that my request for partners didn't bother anybody,

    Thomas
    GPLHost:>_ open source hosting worldwide (I'm founder, CEO & official Debian Developer)
    Servers & our leading control panel and our Xen VPS hosting, which are already included in Debian and Ubuntu
    Available in: Kuala Lumpur, Singapore, Sydney, Seattle, Atlanta, Paris, London, Barcelona, Zurich, Israel

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by gplhost
    That's IMHO silly. Why would they choose you more than another american? Only because they don't speak english? Also, sometimes, connecting to USA is soooooooo slow from here! To me, a chinese targeted service MUST be located in China.
    Language is problem one. Problem two is payment. Most of them don't have credit cards or paypal accounts. So some local bank accounts really are essential.


    Regarding your post above, since your wife is Chinese, I'd suggest you to check out im286.com. The forum was designed for discussing server or website related topics, although it's getting very stupid with tons of garbage lately, but if you do search around you'll find some cool guys there.

    I'm not sure what's your requirement here. Are you after a partner company or just a sole trader (individual)?

    Hope that helps.
    DevOps!

  14. #14
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    For me, payment is NOT a problem, as we are using eNETS in Singapore. For a (quite low) fee, they would also accept chinese debit cards. Most chinese have such card...

    I'm looking for an individual (maybe an employee...).

    Thomas
    GPLHost:>_ open source hosting worldwide (I'm founder, CEO & official Debian Developer)
    Servers & our leading control panel and our Xen VPS hosting, which are already included in Debian and Ubuntu
    Available in: Kuala Lumpur, Singapore, Sydney, Seattle, Atlanta, Paris, London, Barcelona, Zurich, Israel

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