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  1. #1

    Getting Domains from your Host...

    A friend of mine is going through a battle with HostDime, similar in experience to what happened to me with CirtexHosting. I initially registered my domain name through Cirtex when I purchased hosting there last year. When I had had enough of Cirtex's issues, I asked them for my domain login information, the one that I had paid for and had retained a receipt for. They tried to charge me $15 to give me my own domain and I argued with them to the point they finally transferred the domain from their enom account to my own.

    So here is my question: If it is not anywhere in the TOS, are they allowed to charge you for a domain name you have already paid for? Especially if they registered it with enom, and transferring it to your account amounts to nothing more than entering an account name in a form and clicking submit?

  2. #2
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    The First mistake would be registering your Domain from your webhost provider.

    I dont think they should have tried to make you pay for it, unless they had somewhere written a fee to transfer.

  3. #3
    So here is my question: If it is not anywhere in the TOS, are they allowed to charge you for a domain name you have already paid for? Especially if they registered it with enom, and transferring it to your account amounts to nothing more than entering an account name in a form and clicking submit?
    From someone that has faught these battles on behalf of clients from other hosting providers, here is what i can tell you for certain:

    - every host can put whatever they want in their TOS
    - most registrars do not permit additional fees as you have decribed and they are breaking their reseller agreement by doing so
    - if you push the root registrar hard enough and provide all the documentation required to prove ownership - the registrar will enforce their TOS against their reseller and get your domain back.

    The First mistake would be registering your Domain from your webhost provider.
    Thats not the mistake - the mistake was the choice in web host providers. Many web hosts will give full control of the domain to the domain owner right from the get go. I cannot tell you how many enom reseller accounts we have created for our customers and how many domains we have pushed into those accounts. There is nothing wrong with buying a domain name from a host - you can benefit from their bulk pricing and any integration with their system they have set up - but, you do need to make sure - like with anything else - that you are actually in control of your domain, independant of the host

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xau
    The First mistake would be registering your Domain from your webhost provider.
    That's not necessarily bad however; with places like namecheap.com I don't see the need to integrate the two as very few companes give customers that freedom in the first place.

    I can have websites up in seconds thanks to Namecheap.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrEwDF
    A friend of mine is going through a battle with HostDime, similar in experience to what happened to me with CirtexHosting. I initially registered my domain name through Cirtex when I purchased hosting there last year. When I had had enough of Cirtex's issues, I asked them for my domain login information, the one that I had paid for and had retained a receipt for. They tried to charge me $15 to give me my own domain and I argued with them to the point they finally transferred the domain from their enom account to my own.

    So here is my question: If it is not anywhere in the TOS, are they allowed to charge you for a domain name you have already paid for? Especially if they registered it with enom, and transferring it to your account amounts to nothing more than entering an account name in a form and clicking submit?
    Hi DrEwDF

    I understand your frustration for your friend but I assure you we're not that kind of company that take anything hostage from our customers. As you said we didnt transfer your domain to you free in the end and I believe you only made TWO REPLIES to ticket before we just sent it to ya for free and there wasn't much argument going on as we just did what we thought was right

    This is again what your mentioning our past policy We do not take our customer's domain hostage, and when we asked for a $14.99 fee it is our regular practice if a customer wants to transfer domain out. But note we add a free year of registration when you pay the $14.99 and transfer out from us. This is a very fair practice and is our policy but in the past few months we've changed this practice, from now on users have total control of their domains and can change nameservers to new hosts, update domain information and so on all from our control panel interface

    If they still wish to switch domain registrar when they can do all this with us in our user interface, they may do so free of charge and we're very flexible when it comes to such situations as well

    Cheers
    CirtexHosting Providing Affordable and Quality Web Hosting & Reseller Hosting since 2003
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  6. #6
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    A lesson learned for everyone who reads this thread: though most (all?) hosts allow clients to register domains with them, as well as setup a Web hosting account, it is not wise to do this! I cannot stress this enough ~ always register your domain name at a different place than where you host.
    Daniel B., CEO - Bezoka.com and Ungigs.com
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  7. #7
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    No the problem lies when they integrate the hosting and domains together.

    This means the user isn't in complete control of them.

    If the host provides both SEPARATE services and leaves the user in complete control of both the hosting and domains, there is nothing wrong.

    It's when they AREN'T given control trouble starts. Why? Because it's not dynamic, they have to go through a PERSON and you know what people are like, that causes issues.

    Theoretically it should work fine, it's the people.

    But yes, to avoid all the trouble it is best to register outside your hosting company.
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  8. #8
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    All you have to make sure is to get your domain admin contact details under your name when you purchase a domain name. That way, if necessary you can transfer
    your domain at your will.
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  9. #9
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    You also have to make sure it's not locked.

    However, what's to stop the host changing things around?
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  10. #10
    in response to you hoobastank. You are correct in that I may have exaggerated in my initial post. There was no mention of an additional year extension, only that it would cost me money to have you all push the domain to me, which I already paid for. The best way to have handled that would be to tell customers what to expect when they register a domain through Cirtex's new account creation process.

    However, as you say, your protocols have changed so that should not be a problem any longer. I in no way meant to slight Cirtex, I of course have my own opinion about your services but I will let others judge for themselves

    Kat >> Ya I told my friend to take a SS of the TOS before he really started complaining
    Last edited by DrewAPicture; 09-08-2006 at 12:09 AM.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrEwDF
    in response to you hoobastank. You are correct in that I may have exaggerated in my initial post. There was no mention of an additional year extension, only that it would cost me money to have you all push the domain to me, which I already paid for. The best way to have handled that would be to tell customers what to expect when they register a domain through Cirtex's new account creation process.

    However, as you say, your protocols have changed so that should not be a problem any longer. I in no way meant to slight Cirtex, I of course have my own opinion about your services but I will let others judge for themselves

    Kat >> Ya I told my friend to take a SS of the TOS before he really started complaining
    Hi,

    No problem, our regular procedure is $14.99 +1yr then push to your ENOM account, we might have misinformed you on that but anyways hope you're doing good with your new host!

    Good luck.
    CirtexHosting Providing Affordable and Quality Web Hosting & Reseller Hosting since 2003
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlobalWebDan
    A lesson learned for everyone who reads this thread: though most (all?) hosts allow clients to register domains with them, as well as setup a Web hosting account, it is not wise to do this! I cannot stress this enough ~ always register your domain name at a different place than where you host.
    That's not true, we has been registering domains for our customers for over 5 years, and all this years, we only have problems with 1 customer, because she doesn't know how to change the contact information to transfer her domain away.
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  13. #13
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    I am sorry, Jedito, but I will have to disagree with you. It is in the customer's best interest to keep domain registration and Web hosting separate. Sure, it means more $$$ for the host if they do not, but at least at our company, we're not in business only for ourselves.
    Daniel B., CEO - Bezoka.com and Ungigs.com
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    Email Daniel directly: ceo [at] bezoka.com

  14. #14
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    Well, I might as well put my 2 cents worth in also. Personally, I could care less if a client registers a domain through us or someplace else. Makes no difference to me what-so-ever. But to keep on topic here, we have a number of clients that know absolutely nothing about hosting but want/have websites. We manage the entire process for them, down to updating their sites, or anything they need. Out of all these clients, one sadly left (although is currently in the process of returning) and wanted his domain transfered. We went through the process (right away), and everything was set. So we thought. 2 days later I received another email from him asking why the domain wasn't transfered. I knew we did it, but looked into it anyway. To make a long story as short as possible, it took us 3 DAYS to get the NEW host to accept the transfer!
    So I will agree it's a good idea to make sure you have control over your domain(s) and if you feel safer doing that away from your host, fine by me. But what I think people have to understand is it's simply the host you have chosen. Agreeing with CartikaHosting completely on this one! There's absolutely nothing wrong with buying a domain from your host, it's the host you choose in the first place.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim2Macs
    ...it's the host you choose in the first place.
    True. But how can a client be absolutely sure that the host he/she is picking won't turn rotten at some point down the road?
    Daniel B., CEO - Bezoka.com and Ungigs.com
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  16. #16
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    Unfortunately Dan, your correct, one never knows. People don't have to restrict that to the hosting industry either. I'm only talking about our experiences, which granted are limited, but I do agree with you, to a degree anyway.
    I just think to many people constantly say NEVER register a domain with your host, making it sound like every host is going to steel your domain, hold it hostage hoping you come back or so they can sell it and make 50 cents off it. It's rediculous, but evidently there's enough people who either have been screwed or know someone that has. Which is pretty sad. I guess all I can say is there's good reputable companies in every industry, unfortunately there's bad ones also. So guess I'm still sticking with what I said earlier - "There's absolutely nothing wrong with buying a domain from your host, it's the host you choose in the first place".
    Jim - 2Macs H-Sphere Web Hosting
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  17. #17
    I am sorry, Jedito, but I will have to disagree with you. It is in the customer's best interest to keep domain registration and Web hosting separate. Sure, it means more $$$ for the host if they do not, but at least at our company, we're not in business only for ourselves.
    Jedito - dont choke here - but, I agree with you

    Who's to say that its in the customers best interest to keep them separate - many customers will tell you its in their best interest to keep everything with a single vendor - hence why companies like godaddy and enom have gotten into web hosting. We hate selling domains - the margins are low and the support is relatively high - however, it is the CUSTOMERS that demand a single vendor.

    True. But how can a client be absolutely sure that the host he/she is picking won't turn rotten at some point down the road?
    wow - that staement says ALOT for the web hosting industry as a whole (or at least your opinion of it) - However, to entertain your statement, even if the customer purchased a domain from their web host - but, maintained full control from the start - then - how does a company turning "rotten" affect their domain?

    As Jim said -

    it's the host you choose in the first place.

  18. #18
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    Agreed. But a client does not know what kind of host they're getting service with. They really do not know. So to jump right into a company, putting all your faith in them - in my opinion, that's foolish.

    I know that we take care of clients and would never hold their domains hostage. And I know most of you guys are in the exact same boat. But even just one rotten apple spoils the whole bunch.

    I'm not trying to berate anyone or argue with anyone - just trying to inject a bit of reasoning and solid advice. I've seen too many people choose a no-name host for domain registration and hosting, and then become surprised when the company and their domain name disappears.
    Daniel B., CEO - Bezoka.com and Ungigs.com
    Hosting Solutions Optimized for: WordPress Joomla OpenCart Moodle
    Data Centers in: Chicago (US), London (UK), Sydney (AU), Sofia (BG), Pori (FI)
    Email Daniel directly: ceo [at] bezoka.com

  19. #19
    Fair enough, and obviously solid points of reasoning there...

    I'm not trying to berate anyone or argue with anyone - just trying to inject a bit of reasoning and solid advice. I've seen too many people choose a no-name host for domain registration and hosting, and then become surprised when the company and their domain name disappears.
    Personally, I do not find your points argumentative - merely a perspective - however, in my opinion, recommending that it is "mandatory" to choose 2 separate vendors for web hosting and domain registration may not be the correct approach - do you not think it would be more beneficial to all to educate people on how to ensure they maintain full ownership over their domain - rather then letting a few rotten apples spoil it for everyone ?

  20. #20
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    We're all bring up good points and although I disagree with Dan in principle he brings up valid, yet unfortunate points. For the record Dan I don't think your being argumentative at all and hope you don't feel that way about my posts. What I disagree with I think is when you said NEVER register your domain with your host. Either way, I think we would all agree with CartikaHosting that it would be benificial to help educate people better.
    Jim - 2Macs H-Sphere Web Hosting
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  21. #21
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    I do definitely agree with the need for user education. And I don't think either of you were being argumentative - I just feared that I was!
    Daniel B., CEO - Bezoka.com and Ungigs.com
    Hosting Solutions Optimized for: WordPress Joomla OpenCart Moodle
    Data Centers in: Chicago (US), London (UK), Sydney (AU), Sofia (BG), Pori (FI)
    Email Daniel directly: ceo [at] bezoka.com

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