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[macdonaldp]

What does everyone think of the current bill in California to ban private health care? I think it's a good thing as long as the money that is needed is committed.

The wait times in Canada really aren't that bad. Really what it is all about is people need to learn to eat healthy and take care of themselves.

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California looks to copy Canada's health-care system

Kelly Patterson, CanWest News Service; Ottawa Citizen

Published: Thursday, August 31, 2006

OTTAWA - California legislators are poised to vote for a "Canadian-style" health-care system this week, in a bill that would outlaw private care throughout the state.

Senate Bill 840, which is widely expected to pass final reading, would provide free medical, dental, vision and prescription drug coverage to all California residents through a state-run agency.

Canada has been front and centre in the vitriolic debate sparked by the bill, which must be approved by Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger to become law.

"We've learned from the Canadian system and integrated it into a plan specifically for California," said Sara Rogers, a spokeswoman for Senator Sheila Kuehl, who put forward the bill.

"A universal health-care plan is the only way California can solve its health-care problems," she added, noting that more than six million Californians have no health insurance.

"Studies by the World Health Organization show that Canada spends about half of what we do on health care, but the overall health outcomes are comparable."

Opponents of the bill have also thrust the spotlight on Canada's system, citing long waiting lists, lack of equipment and doctor shortages as proof that a publicly funded system would lead to catastrophe.

"Californians do not want the rationed care and long waits in line that people living in Canada and Europe have been forced to endure," says Greg Aghazarian, chair of the Republican caucus for the state assembly.

Critics also point out that last year, the Canadian Supreme Court struck down Quebec's ban on private clinics, ruling it violated patients' human rights.

"There is a whole mythology about the Canadian health-care system," says John Graham, director of health-care studies for the Pacific Research Institute, a San Francisco-based conservative think-tank.

"People need to look past the rhetoric and see the reality," which is not only poor access to services, but the exodus of physicians, argues Graham. He warns that California doctors will flee to Nevada to avoid a nanny state.

But Dr. Tom Noseworthy of the Toronto-based Canadian Doctors for Medicare, says such "anti-Canadian rhetoric" is nonsense.

"They paint Canada as a place where people are dying in the streets for lack of health care. That's just not true."

About 46 million Americans have no health insurance at all, he points out: "That's more than the population of Canada put together."

Noseworthy adds that, in the U.S., access to state-of-the-art care is only better for the top-earning 20 per cent of the population; access for the lowest-earning 20 per cent to standard care is "substantially better" in Canada.

Heidi Gantwerk, of ViewPoint Learning Inc., a La Jolla-based policy consulting agency, says a recent study she co-authoured found Californians had a "tremendous openness to powerful health-care reforms."

In fact, San Francisco has already gone ahead with its own version of universal care: Earlier this month, Mayor Gavin Newsom signed a law that would make the city the first in the U.S. to offer health care to its 82,000 uninsured residents.

Under the system proposed for California, health-care providers would be paid by the new California Health Insurance Agency; the agency would set the fees. The plan would be funded by an eight-per-cent payroll tax and a three-per-cent individual income tax.

Kuehl says the system would make up any shortfall in funds by streamlining administrative costs and negotiating bulk rates for equipment and medication.

Schwarzenegger has declined to take a stand on the bill; however, in a July speech to the Commonwealth Club, he said, "I don't believe that government should ... start running a health-care system."

However, he acknowledged that Californians face a health-care crisis, and promised to give the issue priority if he is re-elected in the state elections, slated for Nov. 7.

Ottawa Citizen

[peersignal]

Good idea in theory, but will never work. One of California's largest providers of jobs and one of its largest industries is private healthcare firms. To say nothing of the fact that this would require everyone to pay a tax on this; which would be more deductions from your paycheck. I don't think it'll pass.

[macdonaldp]

Originally Posted by Velostream

Good idea in theory, but will never work. One of California's largest providers of jobs and one of its largest industries is private healthcare firms. To say nothing of the fact that this would require everyone to pay a tax on this; which would be more deductions from your paycheck. I don't think it'll pass.

Well I'm no expert on California politics but the news article said "final reading" so doesn't that mean it has been voted on already in previous readings?

Why does everyone so scared about a little extra tax? I have NO problem paying high taxes as long as the money is well spent. I live in Canada where the income tax is very high, but you will never see me complaining about paying taxes.

Isn't spending money on health care to advance the health of people that cannot afford to money well spent?

[Marklittle]

Originally Posted by macdonaldp

Isn't spending money on health care to advance the health of people that cannot afford to money well spent?

Living in Southern California myself - I highly doubt this money will advance the health of anyone. It will be abused. Look at welfare - this is suppose to be used to purchase food,clothes, and housing. Do you know how much of it is used on drugs? Tons.

I donate money, food, and time to help those in need. I should never be forced to donate anything, and this will do just that. Little extra tax here, little extra tax there, all of a sudden its tons of tax all together.

This wont advance health of the public, it will be abused, handing out drugs to all!

Neither will I trust the government to have some kind of insurance for me. What happens if I develop horrible incredibly expensive cancer? I would want the best care around, and the government wont be the one to give it to me.

[FluffyTigger]

California's hospitals closed by the dozens since the 90s because they're already overstretched paying for illegals. This is just another way for the illegals lobby to gain healthcare benefits for the millions of illegals in CA. It'll doom the state to financial problems if they actually past it.

[hekwu]

Sounds complicated when you compare an entire country to one state. You would have to do something with medical malpratice insurance, for sure. No more lawsuites against doctors in CA? Although, I bet some would be paid less... hmm.... the devil is in the fine details on this one.... dunno.

[Webdude]

Originally Posted by FluffyTigger

California's hospitals closed by the dozens since the 90s because they're already overstretched paying for illegals. This is just another way for the illegals lobby to gain healthcare benefits for the millions of illegals in CA. It'll doom the state to financial problems if they actually past it.

Unless the agency tells the health care provders "if you provide care for illegals, you do it out of your own pocket". Then guess what, they wont be spending money on illegals. Either way, it's not good with millions of illegals sucking the life out of things.

[Acsiak - Andrew]

I disagree. The problem with state provided healthcare is that it is always costly, there is always waste, and in the end you get to situations such as we have in England where choices are made not to treat certain people because their problems arise from smoking or not having a healthy lifestyle (and so apparently their problems are self-inflicted).

I disagree that any government or state should be able to take someone's money to pay for public healthcare and then turn around and say to that person they can't benefit from that healthcare which they help pay for; and anyone who believes this won't become the case in California is fooling themselves.

Private healthcare is the only way forward.