Web Hosting Talk : Web Hosting Main Forums : Programming Discussion : Need advice on going from ASP to ASP.NET

[jimpoz]

I learned classic ASP back in 1999 by going to asp101.com and going through the samples and gradually picking things up. I've been making database-driven ASP sites ever since. I had a 900-line file a year ago that was causing server load problems, and by going through it line by line and translating that's how I taught myself PHP.

I've always been, in my day job at least, a sort of informal ad-hoc web developer: making all kinds of intranet sites like project management or inventory sites and even CRM applications and my own version of phpMyAdmin to use with Access databases stored on a remote server; but this always has been in addition to some other regular job duty. So since I've never really had a formal development platform, I've usually just used whatever was lying around, which usually has meant Classic ASP and Access since they were free and already installed and sufficient for whatever I had to do.

So why this post? Since I might be re-entering the job market soon I figure I'd better start looking at ASP.NET finally, since a year or so of PHP, six years of ASP, six years of Access, three years of MySQL, and a smidgen of MSSQL aren't really enough. I installed the .NET framework from Microsoft and looked at some of the samples on w3schools.com. But for some reason, unlike Classic ASP and PHP, something's just not clicking for me. Maybe it's because I don't work alongside other web developers on a daily basis and have never seen a .NET site in action and thus can't really grasp the whole .NET concept, but I'm having trouble making the jump from ASP to ASPX.

I was wondering if anyone could recommend a good ASPX tutorial for someone like me. I am proficient with the whole ASP/database concept, but I don't have access to any existing .net applications (or developers for that matter), so whatever I'd make would be small and standalone.

Thanks.

[sunpost]

check out this site...
http://asp.net/Tutorials/quickstart.aspx

[greybalance]

Originally Posted by jimpoz

I learned classic ASP back in 1999 by going to asp101.com and going through the samples and gradually picking things up. I've been making database-driven ASP sites ever since. I had a 900-line file a year ago that was causing server load problems, and by going through it line by line and translating that's how I taught myself PHP.

I've always been, in my day job at least, a sort of informal ad-hoc web developer: making all kinds of intranet sites like project management or inventory sites and even CRM applications and my own version of phpMyAdmin to use with Access databases stored on a remote server; but this always has been in addition to some other regular job duty. So since I've never really had a formal development platform, I've usually just used whatever was lying around, which usually has meant Classic ASP and Access since they were free and already installed and sufficient for whatever I had to do.

So why this post? Since I might be re-entering the job market soon I figure I'd better start looking at ASP.NET finally, since a year or so of PHP, six years of ASP, six years of Access, three years of MySQL, and a smidgen of MSSQL aren't really enough. I installed the .NET framework from Microsoft and looked at some of the samples on w3schools.com. But for some reason, unlike Classic ASP and PHP, something's just not clicking for me. Maybe it's because I don't work alongside other web developers on a daily basis and have never seen a .NET site in action and thus can't really grasp the whole .NET concept, but I'm having trouble making the jump from ASP to ASPX.

I was wondering if anyone could recommend a good ASPX tutorial for someone like me. I am proficient with the whole ASP/database concept, but I don't have access to any existing .net applications (or developers for that matter), so whatever I'd make would be small and standalone.

Thanks.

i think the reason it's not an easy transition is because there really aren't a whole lot of similarities between classic asp and asp.net aside from maybe the file name extensions

asp.net takes a much more object-oriented approach to building web pages, whereas classic asp and php are more like scripting languages, where you have code and html interlaced in the same file (ie your knowledge of how to use database connectivity in asp).

i think the quickstart tutorials are a good starting point, although i can't think of any sites off the top of my head that are written in a way that makes it a transition of asp concepts to asp.net concepts. if i were you i'd probably *not* try to draw any similarities between the two and just view learning asp.net (if you decide to do so) as a completely new undertaking.

although i haven't worked with it extensively, php seems to have a much richer feature base than classic asp and is used in many enterprise-level sites.

hope this helps...

[sasha]

greybalance:
PHP is programming language, ASP is use of VB or JS scripts to make a web page. Good PHP code has no HTML in it.

jimpoz: ASP and ASP.NET are very much different. ASP.net is platform using C#. C# and VB script have nothing in common. In a same way that someone can make crappy PHP application that embeds HTML, you can make very crappy application with ASP.net. But, at a same time, with both PHP and ASP.net you can make solid object oriented applications.

The biggest problem I have with ASP.net is MS Studio. It tries to make things too easy on programmer and does some rather stupid things in the process. I have no doubt that in hands of pro it can be great tool, but given to newbie it is granted to help generate some horrid applications. So, an advice, stay away from MS Studio for as long as possible. Download .net SDK and get some editor with hightlighing support and start there. That will help you start from zero and by the time you have your first "Hello world", you will start to understand some basic concepts.

[ACW]

Hi jimpoz,

Like you, I too had to learn ASP.NET after years of classic ASP and have rarely had a colleague I could go to for help. But although it has a leaning curve, it hasn't been too difficult for me. What really helped me was that I had been playing with the concept of objects for many years. So much so that because of my generous use of Classes, my classic ASP resembles what I do now with ASP.NET.

The syntax itself should be easy for you to pick up if you decide to use VB.NET in ASP.NET because its syntax is similar to VBScript. The biggest challenge will probably be getting your head around object oriented (OO) programming concepts and learning the special features/idiosyncrasies of the new platform.

There are many resources on the web that explain OO concepts. But something that really benefited me, despite it being targeted to a different platform, was Rocky Lhotka's "Professional Visual Basic 6.0 Business Objects" (he has a new version for .NET but I've yet to read it). It really helped me understand what objects were and was a good first step for me.

As far as understanding the platform, keep in mind that in your case you are learning two, the .NET framework and ASP.NET. I’ve mostly done it thru actual use of the platform and spending some time with Visual Studio's Object Browser. One book that may help you is "MCAD/MCSD Training Guide (70-305): Developing and Implementing Web Applications with Visual Basic.NET and Visual Studio.NET". The MSDN site is also a great resource.

[greybalance]

Originally Posted by sasha

greybalance:
PHP is programming language, ASP is use of VB or JS scripts to make a web page. Good PHP code has no HTML in it.

jimpoz: ASP and ASP.NET are very much different. ASP.net is platform using C#. C# and VB script have nothing in common. In a same way that someone can make crappy PHP application that embeds HTML, you can make very crappy application with ASP.net. But, at a same time, with both PHP and ASP.net you can make solid object oriented applications.

The biggest problem I have with ASP.net is MS Studio. It tries to make things too easy on programmer and does some rather stupid things in the process. I have no doubt that in hands of pro it can be great tool, but given to newbie it is granted to help generate some horrid applications. So, an advice, stay away from MS Studio for as long as possible. Download .net SDK and get some editor with hightlighing support and start there. That will help you start from zero and by the time you have your first "Hello world", you will start to understand some basic concepts.

actually i think this needs a bit of clarification. there's nothing wrong with MS visual studio as a whole- to me & many others it's an indespensable and unparalleled IDE. what does SUCK about visual studio is the default drag-and-drop designer that automatically generates code for you. BAD IDEA. you can set a default to editing of your .aspx files are done in HTML mode (instead of the designer). using it this way does not automatically generate ANYTHING for you and allows you complete control over where things go and what code is added.

i'd personally recommend staying with visual studio as a beginner. the intellisense and integrated msdn help are invaluable for developers of all levels. stay away from the designer though. if you'd like me to step you through what settings to change (there aren't many) i'd be happy to do so.

other than that, i agree with the above poster- simply using asp.net does not make a better application. in fact, many tutorials and sites you see out there on asp.net will have examples of db connectivity & business logic in the aspx code itself, which is fine and works but is actually poor design and unscalable (there should be proper business logic and data access layers). if you're looking to just expand your skill set, it's fine to learn the nuts and bolts of asp.net and have a basic understanding of its concepts, but it would be just as valid to apply that same amount of time towards increasing your php knowledge & mastery. to me it's better to do one thing really well than a lot of things o.k.

[sunpost]

you might be able to use some of the info for migrating asp->asp.net on MSDN helpful too...

http://msdn.microsoft.com/asp.net/le...p/default.aspx

[bbscan]

I had a pretty easy time with it once I got started, before you invest to much I highly recommend getting Web Matrix it is free and a good environment to learn and test in. Good luck

[null]

First of all, buy a book. "Professional ASP.NET 1.1" by Wrox is very good. You can get it for $20 on ebay. Once you get the basics go to http://asp.net/Tutorials/quickstart.aspx as sunpost mentioned.

Download Visual Studio 2005 Web Developer Edition (free) at www.asp.net

The key in learning ASP.NET is to understand the concept of web controls, view state and object oriented programming.

null

[bbscan]

do you think he should go through asp.net 1.1 or skip to 2.0?

[sunpost]

A programmer that is re-entering the job market should know v1.1 in order to perform maintenance on v1.1 apps or port apps from v1.1 to v2.0.

the book that null suggested is the best one that I have found for v1.1 and it might be worthwhile checking out the v2.0 equivalent from Wrox.

[Burhan]

ASP.net is platform using C#

Slight miscalculation here. ASP.NET is a framework for developing web applications, you can use any .NET-enabled language to develop code in ASP.NET (C#, VB.NET, J#, etc. any).

[agramont13]

I agree with greybalance. Visual Studio is a great tool, but when coding ASP.NET pages it inserts code automatically which sometimes messes up things design-wise. But I find it very useful aside from that.