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  1. #1

    Strangenesses with Corporate Colocation.

    Week ago I have sent by fax Corporate Colocation Service order (Bust rate $45.00 per MBPS;/26 (64 IP); Monthly (MRC) $60.95), having received the consent to these conditions by phone has sent them the dell PowerEdge 1850. In some days, already after sending a server they have suggested to change conditions in the worst party (to give only 16 ip) or to explain (!) what for to me 64 ip.
    Also there was a requirement full in lines in IP Address Reguest/Justificationj Form:
    Usage of current Corporate Colocation IP addresses (85 % + required for additional allocations)
    Usage of new Corporate Colocation IP addresses (75 % usage requried within 90 days, attach additional sheets if necessary)

    I communicate with them through the translator and have ceased to understand that they want from me and whether should escape from them.
    Yours faithfully Nikolay
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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Saskatchewan, Canada
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    946
    Ip justification is needed by any co-location company that I know of.
    What they need to know is that you will use a majority of the ip addresses for an actual purpose.

    It comes down to this: Do you really need that many ips?

    Example of justification: http://www.integratelecom.com/ispsup..._just_form.asp
    Last edited by macdonaldp; 08-03-2005 at 08:23 PM.
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  3. #3
    1. If I cry money for 64 IP it means to me is necessary.

    2. Each additional user Cpanel often wishes allocated IP.
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  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Saskatchewan, Canada
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    946
    Well just because you want them, that isn't a credible reason.
    Nor is the reason to allow each user to have their own ip.
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  5. #5
    So I should make to receive that that was promised to me?
    My server is not connected a week. I am really ready to give any necessary information, but I do not understand that I should make to solve this question as soon as possible.
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  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
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    1,834
    Any where you host you will have to provide justification under ARIN guidlines for IP's.

    I think 1.) Nameservers, 2.) FTP sites, and 3.) SSL websites are justifications for IP addresses.

    A provider that does not follow ARIN guidelines can have their IP's yanked. Sounds like you are at a fastidious host that is doing their job correctly.
    Ray Womack @ atOmicVPS LTD
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  7. #7
    Nicholas, it's not their fault that they cannot allocate that amount of IP's to you because you do not want to provide justification for the IP's for whatever reason you may have. All you need to do is provide proper justification for those IP's (as required by ARIN), and the IP's will be given to you. All the providers I've used required justification because it is needed as per ARIN's guidelines.
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  8. #8
    I do Cpanel webhosting and I am going to give to users on 1 ip. This requirement of users which pay more $50 month. If I do not give ip to the user it leaves. If to me give only 16 ip - I the bankrupt.
    I should give what substantiation?
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  9. #9
    You need to give reason that is accepted by ARIN, the company which controls all IP's in USA, as a allowed reason to get the IP.

    Give them reason which is valid from ARIN for each IP of the 64
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  10. #10
    Nicholas.Moscow,

    Even though your service order had a 64 IP block in it, there is a provision in your contract that the IP Justification Form you filled out be approved by our IP provisioning dept. Hardly any justification was given, so they only allocated 16 IPs to you. Of course, your service order will be reduced, and your monthly fee will only reflect a 16 IP block, since you were given a lower allocation.

    New allocations can be requested at any time, and as long as proper justification is given, new IPs are allocated within 24 hours.
    Garry Dolley @ ARP Networks | gdolley _at_ arpnetworks . com | #arpnetworks on Freenode | @arpnetworks, @bsdvps
    State of the art services, strong community and friendly support
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  11. #11
    EU IPs must meet RIPE (rpe.net) justification
    US IPs must meet ARIN (arin.net) justification

    Not sure about other continents / country groups
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  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
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    69
    Sounds like a clear case of "bait and switch" to me. Unfortunately, this guy made the mistake of sending Corporate Colocation his server without first getting the IP's allocated. Seems like once Corporate Colocation have your server, they like to play hardline about what the rules are. Now the Russian guy is talking about "escape" - no doubt he'll want to get that server back because he wasn't given what he was promised. This is where it gets interesting. I wonder if he'll get his server back? Or will it be another court case?
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  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Saskatchewan, Canada
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    Originally posted by saxroots
    Sounds like a clear case of "bait and switch" to me. Unfortunately, this guy made the mistake of sending Corporate Colocation his server without first getting the IP's allocated. Seems like once Corporate Colocation have your server, they like to play hardline about what the rules are. Now the Russian guy is talking about "escape" - no doubt he'll want to get that server back because he wasn't given what he was promised. This is where it gets interesting. I wonder if he'll get his server back? Or will it be another court case?
    Nope. Just look at the reply from corporate colocation.

    Originally posted by garrycc
    Nicholas.Moscow,

    Even though your service order had a 64 IP block in it, there is a provision in your contract that the IP Justification Form you filled out be approved by our IP provisioning dept. Hardly any justification was given, so they only allocated 16 IPs to you. Of course, your service order will be reduced, and your monthly fee will only reflect a 16 IP block, since you were given a lower allocation.

    New allocations can be requested at any time, and as long as proper justification is given, new IPs are allocated within 24 hours.
    Read the contract. That is all I have to say to that.
    But of course in his case he will have trouble with this, because he does not speak english fluently. But you can hardly fault corporate colocation for that.
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  14. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    69
    Originally posted by Corporate Colo
    there is a provision in your contract that the IP Justification Form you filled out be approved by our IP provisioning dept
    Translation: Sales department approved the deal for 64 IP's - but his brother or father ("IP Provisioning Department") reneged on the deal - it's as simple as that.

    Now they have the guys Dell 1850 server in their possession and suddenly, they can't understand a word the customer says???
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  15. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Saskatchewan, Canada
    Posts
    946
    Originally posted by saxroots
    Translation: Sales department approved the deal for 64 IP's - but his brother or father ("IP Provisioning Department") reneged on the deal - it's as simple as that.

    Now they have the guys Dell 1850 server in their possession and suddenly, they can't understand a word the customer says???
    Can you explain how ip justification through another provider would be any different than through corporate colocation?

    Sure it says you can get that amount of ips, but only if you are going to actually need them.

    I'm not sure why I bother with this thread.
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  16. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    69
    What you have here is one or more employees of Corporate Collocation jerking this guy around telling him one minute he could have 64 IP's in the deal and then after receiving his server only to assign him 16 IP's. Now, no doubt he owes them money, right? And if he wants his server back, he'll have to pay a month or two right? (Sound familiar?) Why? Because Corporate Colocation moved the goalposts on this guy. It's pretty random isn't it? How can he be qualified for 16 IP's but not 64 when the purpose given for the first 16 is exactly the same as the next 48 IP's? If they agreed to give him 64 IP's in the deal - then shouldn't they at least have assigned those (as agreed by the sales people) and given the customer a period of time to use them before they are taken back? Alternatively, if they knew they weren't going to give him 64 IP's then why promise them and take the guy's money and his server in the first place?
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  17. #17
    Originally posted by saxroots
    Sounds like a clear case of "bait and switch" to me. Unfortunately, this guy made the mistake of sending Corporate Colocation his server without first getting the IP's allocated. Seems like once Corporate Colocation have your server, they like to play hardline about what the rules are. Now the Russian guy is talking about "escape" - no doubt he'll want to get that server back because he wasn't given what he was promised. This is where it gets interesting. I wonder if he'll get his server back? Or will it be another court case?
    There is no bait and switch, when they send you the contract, they send you the IP justification form and tell you fax both back at the same time.

    Unless they want their IP space taken away they need to have proper justification. If he provides that he can get his IP's as promised.
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  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    984
    Saxroots, whats your personal beef with CC? This isn't the first post by another WHT user where you've taken the opportunity to make assumptions and criticize them.

    It's pretty simple, the guy asked for the IP's, the salesperson stated they could provide them (with justification), when it came time to turn up the server and provision the IP's the customer wasn't able to provide adequate justification for the block of 64 IP's according to CC or ARIN's requirements. Obviously the language barrier is a problem and has complicated the process.

    I haven't ever heard of anyone ever submitting their IP justification BEFORE activating their service. It's always AFTER which is why you may not get the whole block when you can't adequately justify their use per ARIN's requirements.
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  19. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    256
    Originally posted by concept
    There is no bait and switch, when they send you the contract, they send you the IP justification form and tell you fax both back at the same time.

    Unless they want their IP space taken away they need to have proper justification. If he provides that he can get his IP's as promised.
    And if the justification form isn't filled out to their liking, they shouldn't accept the contract until either they've gotten a proper justification form, or he's agreed to only 16 IP's.
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  20. #20
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    69
    Originally posted by seraph1
    And if the justification form isn't filled out to their liking, they shouldn't accept the contract until either they've gotten a proper justification form, or he's agreed to only 16 IP's.
    Exactly... Corporate Colocation can't have it both ways.
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  21. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    36
    Why then isnt the server up and running ?
    If they approved 16 ip's then the box should be operational. I agree this sounds like CC is jerking the guy around probably because they are dealing with an international customer.
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  22. #22
    Guys,

    Corporate colo have an agreement to provide 64 IPs. Justification comes later, and they can talk about taking some IPs back say after 3 months if Mr. Moscow/Nikoloy is not using at least 80% with proper justification.

    What appears to be now is:
    1) Corp Colo, agreed to give Nikoloy 64 IPs
    2) Corp colo after recieving the server changed the mind of allocating him the promised 64 Ips
    3) All this is b.s. from corp colo that IP has to approved from IP Provisioning dept and blah blah, they are no walmart with half million employees and thousand different store and depts. They are just a colo shop probably run by less than 10 guys in total. So instead of giving lame excuse like it has to be approved by such and such dept. they should get their balls straight and give the guy what was promised or send him server back + the amount charged + the compensation for wasting his time and shipping cost.

    4) Other than that, no wonder, blame should go on DELL for making these sexy PE 1850 servers, how corporate colo can resist from stealing it! They have a history of doing it!! LOL
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  23. #23
    Originally posted by saxroots
    Translation: Sales department approved the deal for 64 IP's - but his brother or father ("IP Provisioning Department") reneged on the deal - it's as simple as that.

    Now they have the guys Dell 1850 server in their possession and suddenly, they can't understand a word the customer says???
    The IPs were allocated well before the server was shipped.
    Garry Dolley @ ARP Networks | gdolley _at_ arpnetworks . com | #arpnetworks on Freenode | @arpnetworks, @bsdvps
    State of the art services, strong community and friendly support
    FreeBSD, OpenBSD, Linux VPS • ARP Metal™ Dedicated Servers • Colocation • IP Transit
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  24. #24
    Originally posted by saxroots
    Translation: Sales department approved the deal for 64 IP's - but his brother or father ("IP Provisioning Department") reneged on the deal - it's as simple as that.

    Now they have the guys Dell 1850 server in their possession and suddenly, they can't understand a word the customer says???
    FYI, people can "order" as many IPs as they want, but whether they get them or not is another story. If the amount of IPs the customer is requesting is not approved, then they are of course not bound to pay the same rate as if they had got the full allocation. Their service order is automatically reduced to a lower price.
    Garry Dolley @ ARP Networks | gdolley _at_ arpnetworks . com | #arpnetworks on Freenode | @arpnetworks, @bsdvps
    State of the art services, strong community and friendly support
    FreeBSD, OpenBSD, Linux VPS • ARP Metal™ Dedicated Servers • Colocation • IP Transit
    Native IPv6 • VNC Console • Tunnel VNC over SSH • Serial Console over SSH • DNS Manager
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  25. #25
    Originally posted by saxroots
    What you have here is one or more employees of Corporate Collocation jerking this guy around telling him one minute he could have 64 IP's in the deal and then after receiving his server only to assign him 16 IP's. Now, no doubt he owes them money, right? And if he wants his server back, he'll have to pay a month or two right? (Sound familiar?) Why? Because Corporate Colocation moved the goalposts on this guy. It's pretty random isn't it? How can he be qualified for 16 IP's but not 64 when the purpose given for the first 16 is exactly the same as the next 48 IP's? If they agreed to give him 64 IP's in the deal - then shouldn't they at least have assigned those (as agreed by the sales people) and given the customer a period of time to use them before they are taken back? Alternatively, if they knew they weren't going to give him 64 IP's then why promise them and take the guy's money and his server in the first place?
    The IPs were sent before the customer shipped the server. He knew he had a 16 IP block. He still shipped the server. We did not reduce the allocation after we got the server, it was reduced immediately after the IPJ was reviewed, far before the server was shipped.
    Garry Dolley @ ARP Networks | gdolley _at_ arpnetworks . com | #arpnetworks on Freenode | @arpnetworks, @bsdvps
    State of the art services, strong community and friendly support
    FreeBSD, OpenBSD, Linux VPS • ARP Metal™ Dedicated Servers • Colocation • IP Transit
    Native IPv6 • VNC Console • Tunnel VNC over SSH • Serial Console over SSH • DNS Manager
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