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  1. #1
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    Mishandled Shipping..... What would you do?

    I had my server shipped back to me from FDC. I was told by FDC that the server was in fine condition when it came to me. I see no visible marks on any part of the server that would indicate it was dropped at FDC. I do find small marks on the box that would indicate that the box was mishandled and this is what caused the damage to the server.

    The case was bent (pretty nice bend) and although there are no visible or current config indications that there are problems with the hard drives, mobo, cpu, or memory I am leary about the condition of my server now. I ensured it for 2k and I original paid probably about 3k to build it. I don't want to have problems in the future because it was dropped. So I would rather give the whole damn server to the shipping company and get my 2k. I should have just went and insured it for 3k. But I had been looking around and had convienced myself that the prices were down enough that I could probably get a new comparable server for about 2k. Well I think I was wrong. My server has 2 gig of ram and 4 sata drives 2 of which are 10k raptors and it has a 320 scsi 10k in it. Needless to say, I wish I had insured it for 3k.

    Would you just forget about the claim and replace the case or do you feel that the internal system components could be compromised because of what happend to cause the damage?

    Or would you feel that certain components like memory or hard drive are unlikely to have been affected by "the incident"? And that I could salvage them and be able to get enough of my invested money out of it before I claim it out to get new parts?

    Looking for any insight anyone might have on my issue.

    Thanks,
    Soul

  2. #2
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    Well you have 2 options .

    1.) File a claim and get some cash
    2.) replace the parts that are obviously damaged

    personally I would file a claim and get the insurance money , and make a mental note to overinsure next time.
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  3. #3
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    I would file a claim. You never know what could have been damaged during shipping and the problem is something might crop up down the road that you didn't see right away causing even more problems.

  4. #4
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    One question.

    Do they take the package if they pay out the claim?

  5. #5
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    From my experience with carriers, you will be very lucky to get any money out of them perticually if you signed for it.

  6. #6
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    Yes but there was no visible damage on the outside of the box. But you could see once you open it op that it had been damanged. Further inspection shows where the case had to have been put down on its side pretty hard to force contact of the handle of the case with the side of the box.

    I pray you are wrong in my case.

    EDIT:

    I wasnt even there to sign for it. It was our not so bright shipping clerk that wouldn't know a computer unless well... we dropped it on his head.

  7. #7
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    You should file a claim, the worst thing that can happen is they say no.
    Last edited by music; 07-19-2005 at 05:30 PM.

  8. #8
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    Originally posted by music
    You should file a claim, the worst thing that can happen is they say no.
    Yes. I am filing a claim. I just need to collect all of my documentation that shows how much I spent.

  9. #9
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    Originally posted by DaSoul
    Yes but there was no visible damage on the outside of the box. But you could see once you open it op that it had been damanged. Further inspection shows where the case had to have been put down on its side pretty hard to force contact of the handle of the case with the side of the box.

    I pray you are wrong in my case.

    EDIT:

    I wasnt even there to sign for it. It was our not so bright shipping clerk that wouldn't know a computer unless well... we dropped it on his head.
    To me it is sounding like they'd just claim it was packaged inpromperly or was damaged previously, both of which sound more likely to me if there was no visible damage on the outer box. Worst I've seen out of a box that was properly packaged, etc. is needing to reseat the RAM and that was in a box that definitely looked damaged.

    Note: I've heard of two similar issues with boxes shipped out of FDC, so...
    Karl Zimmerman - Steadfast: Managed Dedicated Servers and Premium Colocation
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  10. #10
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    In my expiernce with doing shipping claims they ca n be very rough on you, in your condition it would raise a red flag for possible fraud, not that you have any intentions to defraud but your making a claim for a package thats been opened, unknown condition prior to shipping, if it still works currently then you have no idea when it may have been damaged. Yes they can take the pacakge after paying out a claim most of the time they don't. UPS i know forsure will only pay upto the cost of goods, which also could be the current cost of goods damaged. I am unsure of this but i know they make you prove the cost also.

  11. #11
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    I am almost to the decision that I just eat it and take my loss. It seems to be running ok..... and maybe I will take it as a lesson learned. Kinda sucks though. I don't want to be left with a lemon server. But your right. I don't know if FDC is lying or if FedEx damanged the goods. But the amount of time I want to spend trying to get it resolved is not very much. I was placing this server in a new 1u case and shipping it off to a better host. I just don't know if I want to have to wait up to 2 weeks while its all worked out, especially when the possible out come is that they deny the claim and I have wated time for nothing.

    How do you protect yourself from this in the future. If you can't visually inspect the server before they ship it? What would you suggest for us people that don't necessarily live in the state where the server will be colocated?

    What a bummer of a mood this puts me in. ho hum

  12. #12
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    Hi!
    I am planning on getting into the custom server business shortly. I would never send a server via UPS...I'm sorry. No way.

    Second...I don't honestly care how much one of those expanding foam encasement systems cost...I'm getting one. Period. Two maybe.

    Third..I'm going to see if Samsonite makes shipping boxes. Has this been gorilla-tested?

    It would be worth the money even if you had to buy special cases that I could have the shipper pick up for me at the DC and ship back to me maybe...we'll see.

    Fed Ex is the only way I'd ship a server. I'm sorry you had problems with them...I have never had problems with them.
    It's it's worth 10K..it's going to have 10K insurance on it, though.


    Using UPS many years ago with my dad's business: If UPS can break it..it will be broke.
    Guaranteed.

    Bryon
    Last edited by bryonhost1; 07-19-2005 at 11:13 PM.

  13. #13
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    Add signature required to the pacakage and don't let the FedEx guy leave till you have opened the package and inspected it.

    As for what to do next time ask for confirmation in writing that the server is undamaged prior to shipping, most reasonable people will accomidate that request.

    But what you should do file a claim with FedEx, call up FDC ask for confirmation that they didn't damage the package prior to shipping (as if they would admit it) There can be your proof of damage during shipping. And then find documentation as they request.

  14. #14
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    If you want to see some pictures of how my precious server came back to me....

    http://www.gofclan.org/modules.php?n...t=273&start=15

  15. #15
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    Also, I would make sure to take out all spare components before filing a claim, for those times when you need a spare RAM chip or a SCSI hard drive.

  16. #16
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    There was more padding in the box than what you see there...

  17. #17
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    To avoid the problem in the future I would guess that you can hire a packaging company to handle everything from picking the server up, packaging it and shipping it. Of course this will cost you more money.

    Karl Zimmerman - Steadfast Networks , Just some constructive criticism as we exchanged opinion in a previous thread today, this might come across as FDC bashing.

  18. #18
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    Originally posted by music
    To avoid the problem in the future I would guess that you can hire a packaging company to handle everything from picking the server up, packaging it and shipping it. Of course this will cost you more money.

    Karl Zimmerman - Steadfast Networks , Just some constructive criticism as we exchanged opinion in a previous thread today, this might come across as FDC bashing.
    I'm just stating that this is the third or forth complaint I have heard that is almost exactly the same just over the past couple weeks... Not stating it is the case, but I have seen pictures of three systems, all shipped from FDC, that are noticably damaged.
    Karl Zimmerman - Steadfast: Managed Dedicated Servers and Premium Colocation
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  19. #19
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    This is fascinating where did you hear these complaints from in the past few weeks?

    I would think that we would see something on WHT?

    I do not think it makes a lot of sense, but can you post the e-mails and/or other complaints that were personally sent to you for what ever reason?

    It truly blows the mind that these people with servers being damaged over the last few weeks would only tell Karl Zimmerman - Steadfast Networks and not share it with WHT.

  20. #20
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    Originally posted by music
    This is fascinating where did you hear these complaints from in the past few weeks?

    I would think that we would see something on WHT?

    I do not think it makes a lot of sense, but can you post the e-mails and/or other complaints that were personally sent to you for what ever reason?

    It truly blows the mind that these people with servers being damaged over the last few weeks would only tell Karl Zimmerman - Steadfast Networks and not share it with WHT.
    They didn't only tell me. One ended up colo'ing with us and the other server had been built, and then RMA'd back to, the company we use for our servers. He was just telling me about the experience, etc. Here are some pictures from that one:

    http://www.theclarkster.com/defect/HPIM0797.JPG

    It may not look terrible, but the whole system was bowed, pushed down in the middle so that it rocked on a table. This flexed the motherboard thus requiring a motherboard replacement, which is why the system was RMA'd.

    Not really sure why everyone would mention every single problem they may ever have with a provider on WHT, especially since a majority of colocation customers don't even visit WHT, as odd as that may sound. It isn't as if I just make this crap up...
    Karl Zimmerman - Steadfast: Managed Dedicated Servers and Premium Colocation
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  21. #21
    I am going to have to support Karl on this one. We have gotten servers shipped to us from this provider in a box that a case comes in. There was little packing. It also had a mismatched side panel that wouldnt even fit on the box. Removing sides was discussed in an earlier thread. This was over a year ago and may have been an isolated event, but it made a bad impression on me and the customer.

    What isnt isolated is music running to the defense of his provider without even knowing the facts. He wasnt there when the box was packed and he wasnt there when Karl unpacked it. His only real knowledge of the information in this thread is he loves his provider no matter what anyone else thinks. In this thread his support is actually hurting the provider since Karl is not going to drop this when he is right. I think Karl can prove his point so it might be better to let this one go.

    You need to do your best for your customers. That includes shipping the server back to them if they choose to go somewhere else. In many instances the customer has never seen the facility, so the packing job may be the only impression they have. We have servers arrive from other facilities that looks like the shipper intentionally did a bad job as a "going away" present. We just take a picture and send it to the customer.
    Looking for next opportunity

  22. #22
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    Karl it does sound like you are making it up.

    Take a look at the Topic “Mishandled Shipping..... What would you do?

    DaSoul said “I see no visible marks on any part of the server that would indicate it was dropped at FDC.”

    In your first post you bring up FDC and make a special note that you have heard of two similar issues with boxes shipped out of FDC, so... .

    Then in you next post you say “I'm just stating that this is the third or forth complaint I have heard that is almost exactly the same just over the past couple weeks.”

    Now in the last post you say ,” One ended up colo'ing with us and the other server had been built, and then RMA'd back to, the company we use for our servers. He was just telling me about the experience.

    LOL

  23. #23
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    The only part on the server I see that would indicate it was dropped is the handle. But I don't think that this could happen by accident as I imagine there would be other marks say on the back right side of the server or the front of the server. I believe that in this case the box was allowed to roll on its side. When it came to rest on the right side, enough force was used, or insufficent package was used which allowed the right side handle to puncture the box just enough to make contact with the ground. Which in turn caused the server damage.

    This is just my guess at what happened. I need to look at the packing and make a rational estimate if I think FedEx will say it didnt have enough packing or if they will honor the claim. But I just don't want to waste time filling a claim and then finding out that they won't pay out. This is the only server I have and I want to bring it or another server online soon. If I had 10 servers it wouldnt be an issue Maybe someone wants to buy 10 servers for me

  24. #24
    Dasoul and Karl, thanks for posting this info. whoever replied with advice to have a s/h company pick the server up from the datacenter gave some excellent advice.

  25. #25
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    did i ever tell you what my favorite word was CHARGE-BACK
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  26. #26
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    Originally posted by gilbert
    did i ever tell you what my favorite word was CHARGE-BACK
    Except I built this server by buying the pieces from different companies on different cards and putting it all together 8 months ago.

  27. #27
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    You know, it almost looks like they were stacking servers ontop of that case causing it to bend in the middle..

    http://www.theclarkster.com/defect/HPIM0797.JPG

  28. #28
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    It thought partially it could look like that as well. But it could also just be the picture.

    But it would make sense "if" you were going to place a machine on top of this 1u server that you would place it on top sideways. I am not saying that it would make sense to place a server on top of this machine at all. But I would only see it as a last resort if the machine was placed on top on its side. I don't see FDC placing the server just right on top like that. But I could be mistaken. One guy complained in the forums that the memory he sent wasnt added to his machine. He said that he got an email saying that they had to take out one of the hard drives to fit the memory in. He replied saying that he only had one hard drive O_o

    Take that for what you will....

  29. #29
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    Originally posted by 2uantuM
    You know, it almost looks like they were stacking servers ontop of that case causing it to bend in the middle..

    http://www.theclarkster.com/defect/HPIM0797.JPG
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  30. #30
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    I would say ALWAYS insure the machine for what it is worth. To date we had 3 different machines mistreated in transit.. Not sure who was at fault for two of them but the third was pretty apparent that the DC wanted to give us a little "going away present".. It looked like the machine was thrown down a flight of stairs.. That one we sued on and won. A little poetic justice to that is the DC in question went out of business shortly after

  31. #31
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    Lesson learned on the insurance part.

    I faxed my claim to FedEx just a few minutes ago... I guess we will see what happens.

    Do any of you think that some parts might be salvagable. My dual opterons cost 980 bucks and if they might still be safe to use I might consider pulling them when I claim it out. I really want to make sure I have enough money to build the system back. Or maybe pull the 4 sata drives and the 2gig of ram? I think I would feel more comfortable pulling and using the processors if the look alright. (read .. no moving parts here)

    What do you guys think? I definitely under insured it.
    Last edited by DaSoul; 07-20-2005 at 02:02 PM.

  32. #32
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    Originally posted by music
    Karl it does sound like you are making it up.

    Take a look at the Topic “Mishandled Shipping..... What would you do?

    DaSoul said “I see no visible marks on any part of the server that would indicate it was dropped at FDC.”

    In your first post you bring up FDC and make a special note that you have heard of two similar issues with boxes shipped out of FDC, so... .

    Then in you next post you say “I'm just stating that this is the third or forth complaint I have heard that is almost exactly the same just over the past couple weeks.”

    Now in the last post you say ,” One ended up colo'ing with us and the other server had been built, and then RMA'd back to, the company we use for our servers. He was just telling me about the experience.

    LOL
    What?

    I have heard of twosimilar issues, boxes damaged that were shipped from FDC.

    I said I heard of two similar issues, that would make this the third, as I said. I had also heard one other complaint, but didn't get enough information and couldn't determine if it was the same person as in any of the other complaints, etc. so I haven't brought it up.

    I mentioned two incidents, as I said originally, "two similar issues," and this is the third, with one other possible, but I'm not counting it. Where is the LOL? The fact you can't understand what I'm saying?
    Karl Zimmerman - Steadfast: Managed Dedicated Servers and Premium Colocation
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  33. #33
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    Anyone have any suggestions for what possibly I could salvage out of the system?

  34. #34
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    DaSoul, I would probably salvage the ram chips and cpu first as they are not directly attached to the case. You salvage those two things and you can still come out over $2K value I think. Keep us posted.

  35. #35
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    Originally posted by 2uantuM
    You know, it almost looks like they were stacking servers ontop of that case causing it to bend in the middle..

    http://www.theclarkster.com/defect/HPIM0797.JPG
    That's an odd way for a server to be damaged. Stacking them up won't do that, even with a junky shelf that flexes.

    Would the packaging have survived being stepped on? It's not that uncommon I find footprints on packages.

    1U machines are pretty flimbsy. Heck, the doors barely stay attached on that model of case. Some heavy machines like white DL380s will bend under their own weigh when shipped (collapsing around the edges of the drive cage. Standing on the other side actually fixes that if the backplane isn't damaged).
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  36. #36
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    Watch out for UPS. UPS has some anal insurance adjusters. They wont pay out (from my experience) if the box was not UPS "inspected" prior to shipping the goods. -- It may be only for daily shippers that they require this for. But be on the lookout.

    They have a program where you send off one of your boxes with a server inside. Then they stress test it to give you an optimal shipping container. If they break the server either during the test, or during normal shipping, they will pay you back no matter what. Its guaranteed, no questions asked. It might be something you, or others would want to look into if you plan on doing a DC move or plan on shipping a lot of servers around.
    Last edited by Rackmounts; 07-24-2005 at 02:49 AM.

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