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07-12-2005, 06:42 AM #1Newbie
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How is VPS account administrated/managed? (total newbie questions)
Hi,
introduction
I have good knowledge on IT generally and I have long experience on using whm/cpanel, I know php/html/javascript and can design websites.
But: I'm not a "linux" guru (like most of the guys here ) and I know absolutely zero when it comes to managing/administrating (I don't even know what's the difference between these terms...) a server or a virtual private server. In fact: I heard about VPS only few days ago. I'm total newbie in VPS
My business plan is:
- To (re-)sell VPS (and dedicated if available) to (local, non-english speaking) companies
- I will price the service somewhere between €200-500 per month
- Most of the clients hired an artist to create their website, these artists will recommend my service (and I will recommend theirs)
- I will provide companies some support/service in the language they speak. I will also offer consultation in terms of website issues. I will handle the set up of their site and necessary domain actions. etc.
- I'm aiming for 10 000€ monthly income and calculated that I would need anything 20-50 customers to reach this level. I have set up a plan to reach this amount in 5 years.
I can handle cpanel, but I cannot manage linux (I know pretty much nothing about linux)
At the moment I have two service provides on my list:
- PowerVPS
- Httpme
(liquidweb.com is also option... but could not get my top 2 list. At the moment this is the situation. I have ruled ServInt away)
the questions:
1a) Will PowerVPS provide management/support in that way that I could collect the support issues from the company and redirect them to PowerVPS crew?
1b) How about Httpme?
2) What there is to do in VPS if the ISP provides the management? What that rules out? I have tried to fetch information about PowerVPS and Httpme but I cannot get a good picture what the service really promises.
3a) What kind of uptime PowerVPS has?
3b) How about Httpme?
3c) I'm planning to give 99.9% uptime guarantee (or money back - no conditions! if it breaks, they get their money back). I calculated that I could afford to have 2 months with uptime less than 99.9% - this would be acceptable. 3 or more months: no can do. I'm also trying to figure out if 100% guarantee could be possible? This would be a very powerful Benefit for our company and we could build our image on this. But - if the servers have few minute downtimes each month then it's not good. I checked the httpme servers and most of them were rebooted 8 days ago. (I know that computers need to be rebooted.. but how long could it be to manage without reboots? Is there a managed/administrated VPS/dedicated hosting company specializing in providing real 100% uptime?)
4) What happens if for some strange reason PowerVPS or Httpme suddenly stops doing their business... how hard would it be to transfer 20-50 accounts to another VPS provider? (Notice: this is one requirement for the service provider - I want to make a long term deal with one provider and make sure we both are very happy with this)
5) What's the difference between managed/administrated vps?
6) What do I really need to know (technically) to be able to manage/administrate a VPS?
7) PowerVPS charges about $50-100 per month per virtual server and Httpme just announced their $150-$200 per month deal. At the moment the PowerVPS option sounds better to me - IF - they would provide me enough support.
8) What about VPS backups? Can the powervps/httpme crew help me to restore backups so that I don't need to take care of this?
9) I really want to *automate* support as far as possible and concentrate on managing the customer relationship and acquiring more customers. If you have recommendations, please let me hear.
Thanks for your help!
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07-12-2005, 11:30 AM #2Web Hosting Master
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1) Your best bet is to email them directly and ask them.
2) I didn't understand your second question.
3) Most VPS's do not need to be rebooted unless the main VPS server has a kernel upgrade. Your own individual VPS will never need to be rebooted if run correctly. [Applies to Virtuozzo VPS's only]
4) If you are using cPanel, the transfer is very easy, providing you have access to the old data and/or backup's at hand.
5) You are once again advised to email them for their definitions.
6) Not much, you just need to learn to get used to WHM/cPanel, if that is the control panel of your choice.
8) Email them for clarification, some companies charge money, some don't.YourCheapHost.com - Low cost multi domain hosting solutions. [Legal adult content friendly]
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07-12-2005, 11:48 AM #3Web Hosting Master
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well a lot of the virtual private servers are in a directory under something like vservers and are chrooted to provide the dedicated like enviroment
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07-12-2005, 12:35 PM #4Newbie
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@net-trend: Thanks for your answer.
1) ok
2) well... your reply to question 6 actually answers this quite well.
3) Do you know if this is the case with powervps/httpme (oh, well - I just might ask them...) Thanks for this.
4) Ok. But isn't there a bug in the cpanel restore option?
5) Hmm.. ok.
6) Can you specify *what else* besides whm/cpanel? Not much = nothing? (I really need to know, sorry for sounding stupid)
8) ok
@gilbert: do you know if this is the case with PowerVPS or Httpme?
[edit]found info: at least PowerVPS has Virtuozzo[/edit]
Thanks for your time. I'm getting much better picture now... but will need some more info.Last edited by Indiepath; 07-12-2005 at 12:40 PM.
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07-13-2005, 03:37 AM #5Junior Guru
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You wont be able to offer a 100% uptime gurantee because the host server that your VPS runs on will need to be rebooted for kernel updates and patches. These outages are usually less that 5 minutes but are absolutely essential to keep the host OS and virtualiasation software up to date. On my own VPS I have experienced 2 outages for this very reason this year so far. My VPS is with PowerVPS.
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07-13-2005, 04:54 AM #6Web Hosting Master
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Originally posted by Indiepath
4) Ok. But isn't there a bug in the cpanel restore option?
6) Can you specify *what else* besides whm/cpanel? Not much = nothing? (I really need to know, sorry for sounding stupid)
6) Basically cPanel/WHM will take care of EVERYTHING. However, there may be occasions where you might have to get your hands dirty in a shell. Seeing, as you are going with a managed solution, you need not worry about that.YourCheapHost.com - Low cost multi domain hosting solutions. [Legal adult content friendly]
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07-13-2005, 08:26 PM #7Junior Guru Wannabe
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Originally Posted by net-trend
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07-13-2005, 11:32 PM #8Newbie
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You wont be able to offer a 100% uptime gurantee because the host server that your VPS runs on will need to be rebooted for kernel updates and patches. These outages are usually less that 5 minutes but are absolutely essential to keep the host OS and virtualiasation software up to date. On my own VPS I have experienced 2 outages for this very reason this year so far. My VPS is with PowerVPS.
yeah...or if apache crashes. there are a lot of reasons besides a kernel upgrade to need a reboot.
4) Never encountered any such bug. There used to be bugs a year or two ago but they fixed it.
Thanks guys for your informative answers. This really clears things a lot!
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07-13-2005, 11:51 PM #9Junior Guru Wannabe
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slowdive was just telling you will need to have reboots and can't offer 100% uptime. i didn't comment on anything he said.
net-trend was the person i quoted...he said correctly-run vps's never need to be rebooted aside from kernel upgrades.
there are a TON of other reasons to need reboots on a vps, and you really should have a firm understanding of that before you open this business.
to add to what i said and stay on topic....don't expect any of the vps providers to perfectly optimize your vps so that they'll never need to be rebooted.
if you are dealing with high-bandwidth clients, you will have to understand the risks of using a VPS, and what happens when you don't have enough ram (apache crashes is just one particular example).
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07-14-2005, 01:35 AM #10Newbie
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@slaxxx: Thanks for your comments, I really appreciate your help.
there are a TON of other reasons to need reboots on a vps, and you really should have a firm understanding of that before you open this business.
to add to what i said and stay on topic....don't expect any of the vps providers to perfectly optimize your vps so that they'll never need to be rebooted.
if you are dealing with high-bandwidth clients, you will have to understand the risks of using a VPS, and what happens when you don't have enough ram (apache crashes is just one particular example).
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07-14-2005, 10:20 AM #11Web Hosting Master
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Originally posted by slaxxx
Originally Posted by net-trendLast edited by net-trend; 07-14-2005 at 10:23 AM.
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07-14-2005, 10:21 AM #12Web Hosting Master
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Originally posted by slaxxx
there are a TON of other reasons to need reboots on a vps, and you really should have a firm understanding of that before you open this business.
FYI, I deal with Virtuozzo on a daily basis as we do sell them. So, i'd be very interested to know why reboots are needed aside from kernel upgrades.YourCheapHost.com - Low cost multi domain hosting solutions. [Legal adult content friendly]
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07-18-2005, 12:15 AM #13Newbie
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@Net-Trend:
As being complete VPS newbie (and I don't want to bash anyone ) I would really like to know what reasons there are for reboots - can you please name the reasons you know? (Altough your post states that there are no other reasons than kernel upgrades)
Maybe the processor or memory leaks can require apache reboot? Or maybe use of too many threads or something?
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07-18-2005, 02:39 AM #14Web Hosting Master
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To get back to the original question - in order to manage a VPS you simply need a SSH client
As far as reboots go, it seems from this thread that some VPS users reboot it rather than finding the real reason something has stopped.
In reality, a reboot is only needed for a Kernel upgrade, and in the case of non hot-swap hardware upgrade/replacement.
If think you need to reboot more often than this, then you should consult a server admin to sort out the problem rather than blindly rebooting your VPS when something is not working.CPanel Shared and Reseller Hosting, OpenVZ VPS Hosting. West Coast (LA) Servers and Nodes
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07-18-2005, 05:19 AM #15Web Hosting Master
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Originally posted by Indiepath
@Net-Trend:
As being complete VPS newbie (and I don't want to bash anyone ) I would really like to know what reasons there are for reboots - can you please name the reasons you know? (Altough your post states that there are no other reasons than kernel upgrades)
Maybe the processor or memory leaks can require apache reboot? Or maybe use of too many threads or something?
A process [like HTTP] that uses too many threads will not be solved by a reboot. A reboot is a temp measure, but why reboot when a service restart will have the same effect? Basically, if you have that issue, the solution is to upgrade.
Reboots are excuses for people who do not know what to do in a simple situation. Most servers really only get a reboot due to a kernel upgrade, as this is the case with all our servers as well.
Apache and PHP upgrades never need a reboot, anyone who tells you so, does not know what they are saying.YourCheapHost.com - Low cost multi domain hosting solutions. [Legal adult content friendly]
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07-18-2005, 08:33 AM #16Automation Specialist
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A good rule of thumb for management is that if it comes with the VPS when you get it, it's fully managed by the provider (assuming they say managed VPS's)
Hope this helps.██ Automated Tendencies - Brand Management Agency from Baltimore, Maryland.
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01-12-2006, 12:22 AM #17Junior Guru Wannabe
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i'm a vps newbie too.. what if remote desktop goes down or something and you can't get it? then what?
Also,how the hell do you set up a VNC server if you don't have remote desktop......
And why the hell does my VPS keep closing my appications when my remote desktop session disconnects? i'm using windows server 2003
are there any settings that make it terminate programs that aren't signned or added to a whitelist ? I'm running a custom game server and lobby server and it keeps shutting them down!
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01-12-2006, 12:49 AM #18Junior Guru Wannabe
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OK, I figured out it's logging me off for inactivity and shutting down the programs I started in that session.
My question is: HOW CAN I make the programs run even if I log out? IE make them services or something? or make them run without needing my user login? bah
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01-13-2006, 12:41 AM #19Junior Guru Wannabe
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Thanks for all your help, elite WHT members.
I wrote my own service. i was looking for a different approach, but this worked. dARRRHHH>> DERR H *BLURP* DER