View Poll Results: Should post counts be removed from advertising threads?

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  • Yes. Remove post counts.

    36 63.16%
  • No. Keep post counts.

    21 36.84%
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  1. #1
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    Pondering the Perplexing Post Count Problem

    It's been suggested that post counts be removed from the Advertising Forums.

    We'd like to get members' opinions on this.

    This is only in regards to the Advertising Forums that involve posting threads for profit.

    The Reviews, Outages, etc, will continue as they are.
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  2. #2
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    Any chance on an "Indifferent" option, or do you want it to be Yes/No?

  3. #3
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    I think removing them from anywhere would be silly.
    Any specific reason for the request for removal?

    (I think signatures should be disabled from certain forums though!)

  4. #4
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    Originally posted by DanX
    Any chance on an "Indifferent" option, or do you want it to be Yes/No?
    If you are indifferent then why vote? An indifferent vote is a wash so it really isn't necessary.

    My vote would be to eliminate post count for advertising forums.

  5. #5
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    Just curious. What is the logic behind removing post count from the Ad Forum?

    Vito
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  6. #6
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    I'd like to see the theory behind this, as I see absolutely no reason why it would be an issue in the first place.

  7. #7
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    Perhaps it's an issue because people post in the advertising forums "nice site" "nice design" "good luck!" in order to nab their 5 post count so they themselves can post an advertisement. I assume this is the issue, which is why I voted for the removal of post counts from ad forums.

  8. #8
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    Uhh... I think he means the actuall post count under the profile.

    Basically, someone may think a member with poor posts has more "wisdom".

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  9. #9
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    Originally posted by Chris Armstrong
    Perhaps it's an issue because people post in the advertising forums "nice site" "nice design" "good luck!" in order to nab their 5 post count so they themselves can post an advertisement. I assume this is the issue, which is why I voted for the removal of post counts from ad forums.
    AFAIK, you got it...

    I cast my vote to yes... Since it will help us track spammers and suchwhat.
    Dan Sheppard ~ Freelance whatever

  10. #10
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    I always voted yes. Since there is no need to say "Nice design" if you are not planning on buying other then to reach 10 posts to post your own ad. I think that removing the count would only have people interested in it, asking questions etc post instead of mindless dribble.
    Tyler Cole
    Eeek, a Blog

  11. #11
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    I voted No. It will do nothing but increase the amount of fly-by-night kiddie hosts we see advertising on the board. I would actually like to see the post count increased to 100.

    My logic behind this is, while you will see some determined folks who will make the post count, just to advertise, it will give more time for the mods to actually identify (or community memebers to identify) these knuckleheads so that their posts can be nuked.

    I think advertising on a forum such as this (much like the membership) is a privilidge, and not a right gained, just by registering.

    My .02 (no refunds!)

    Sirius
    I support the Human Rights Campaign!
    Moving to the Tampa, Florida area? Check out life in the suburbs in Trinity, Florida.

  12. #12
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    Wow, everything old, is new again. We seem to have this post count question (and variations of it) every few months.

    Ain't broke.. don't fix I say.
    Former Webhost... now, just a guy.

  13. #13
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    Re: Pondering the Perplexing Post Count Problem

    Originally posted by SoftWareRevue
    It's been suggested that post counts be removed from the Advertising Forums.
    Sounds good.
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  14. #14
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    Originally posted by Chris Armstrong
    Perhaps it's an issue because people post in the advertising forums "nice site" "nice design" "good luck!" in order to nab their 5 post count so they themselves can post an advertisement. I assume this is the issue, which is why I voted for the removal of post counts from ad forums.
    Originally posted by Tyler
    I always voted yes. Since there is no need to say "Nice design" if you are not planning on buying other then to reach 10 posts to post your own ad. I think that removing the count would only have people interested in it, asking questions etc post instead of mindless dribble.
    Maybe I'm missing something but I don't see how that will change anything. Instead we will have people posting "I agree" or "good post" or something similar in the other forums which count posts.

  15. #15
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    Sirius, unless I'm completely mistaken, the vote is to remove the system that awards people post counts by posting in the advertising forum. Not to remove the minimum post count required to start threads there.

    Maybe you have it right, but from the way I read your post it made me think that you believe they're removing the post count minimum to start threads there.


    Originally posted by sirius
    I voted No. It will do nothing but increase the amount of fly-by-night kiddie hosts we see advertising on the board. I would actually like to see the post count increased to 100.

    My logic behind this is, while you will see some determined folks who will make the post count, just to advertise, it will give more time for the mods to actually identify (or community memebers to identify) these knuckleheads so that their posts can be nuked.

    I think advertising on a forum such as this (much like the membership) is a privilidge, and not a right gained, just by registering.

    My .02 (no refunds!)

    Sirius

  16. #16
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    Originally posted by westcan
    Maybe I'm missing something but I don't see how that will change anything. Instead we will have people posting "I agree" or "good post" or something similar in the other forums which count posts.
    That's pretty much my point as well. What difference is there from someone making fluff posts in Main Forum versus Ad Forum? If someone is determined to pad their post count in order to place an ad, they'll do it in whichever forum is available to them.

    Solution: Require a post count of 100 before they have the privilege of posting in the Ad Forum. Done.

    Vito
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  17. #17
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    People should have to apply to be able to post in the ads forum - this way they would have a qualified reason to be using this forum.
    Removing post counts will have little effect.

    Jord
    Our greatest glory is not in never falling, but in rising every time we fall. - Confucius

  18. #18
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    Originally posted by vito

    Solution: Require a post count of 100 before they have the privilege of posting in the Ad Forum. Done.

    Vito
    I believe there will be another thread regarding the required post count in the ad forums not too far away. But this is another method to try and stop spammers from sole purpose to post in the ad forums.
    Tyler Cole
    Eeek, a Blog

  19. #19
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    Wait, perhaps I misunderstood.

    What you mean is actually removing the forums from 'counting as posts'?

    (I would agree to that)

    But if you mean just disabling the posts when viewing users in the forum - then I see no point.

    I'm fairly certain I misunderstood, I'd like to change my vote to yes if it's option #1!

  20. #20
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    Y'all can throw your rotten produce at me for suggesting this one. I'll now rehash some of the reasoning I put forward privately to the other liaisons and leaders.

    I fully, wholeheartedly support removing postcount in all advertising forums. It solves a bunch of issues for members and moderators alike, and I have yet to see a single disadvantage to it.

    You see these posts all the time: "nice template," "good hosting plans," etc. 95% of the time, these are posted by new members attempting to increase their post count so they can advertise. It's the job of the moderators to enforce the policy against this, and more important, to ensure that the primary focus of WHT is preserved. Hint: the primary purpose is not to give people a place to advertise.

    But tossing out these posts is a no-win scenario. On one hand, you have new members bypassing rules presumably meant to keep people from coming here only to advertise, to keep the quality of conversation up. In doing so, you end up with a lot of useless noise. So, you toss it out, right? Well, that seems unfair to the thread starter, because we might be tossing out legitimate praise! Making it so these posts don't affect post count makes this all a non-issue. As far as I'm concerned, it makes the whole "PM Sent," "Check your email" argument moot as well, another big bonus - less need to moderate, less need to report (there are other reasons for this rule, but I personally don't think they are an issue).

    Also, let's face it. One of the big factors that goes into how we judge the value of members is by their post count. There is a large contingency of people who make their nominal 10-post contribution and then copy/paste the same message in every relevant advertising thread they can find. IMHO, you simply can't equate the quality of advertising posts with the contributions made by others whose post counts reflect their willingness to share knowledge and their ongoing quests to learn themselves. I can write a bot that can do the former! By removing post count increases in advertising forums, you're not stopping people from conducting business on WHT by any means. You're creating more of a separation between the heart and soul of WHT (the general forums, and arguably the lounge), and the area that is a perk of being a member, an afterthought. These two distinct areas do not carry the same importance, and removing post count from advertising forums reflects this.

    So, removing post count makes moderation a lot easier, takes the guesswork out of figuring out the intentions of a new member who's posting two word replies, will eventually cut down on the insincere posts when thread-bombers figure out this strategy doesn't work (signal-to-noise people!) and will more actively reflect the value of the contributions members are making.

    Yes, we will see people move out of the advertising forums and post crap elsewhere. But this is a lot easier to expose and remove - rarely is there a judgment call involved. It may also encourage people who live in the advertising forums to venture out and become more productive WHT citizens.

    Now, with all of the possible benefits, why would this not be a good idea?

    To answer some specific questions:

    Wait, perhaps I misunderstood.

    What you mean is actually removing the forums from 'counting as posts'?

    (I would agree to that)
    Yes, this is what is being proposed. (move one from No to Yes! )

    People should have to apply to be able to post in the ads forum - this way they would have a qualified reason to be using this forum.
    Hmm...

    Instead we will have people posting "I agree" or "good post" or something similar in the other forums which count posts.
    What difference is there from someone making fluff posts in Main Forum versus Ad Forum?
    Fluff is much easier to judge outside of the advertising forums, and the new rules call for suspension of an account when someone violates this rule, as opposed to receiving a simple warning. I predict removing post count will in conjunction with these new rules SWR announced this morning will significantly reduce noise in the long run.

    Ain't broke.. don't fix I say.
    Oh, it's broke! When you see the amount of garbage that accumulates, you come to realize a fix is needed. The reason it may not appear broken is because the mods do a pretty decent job of getting it crap out of there.

    I voted No. It will do nothing but increase the amount of fly-by-night kiddie hosts we see advertising on the board. I would actually like to see the post count increased to 100.
    Actually, not allowing post count to increase will stop "fly-by-night kiddie hosts" from gaining the privilege of posting advetisements. It will give mods more time to recognize the miscreants, it will make them more apparent, and they will not be able to post fluff in forums that to some degree encourage fluff, allowing what you've identified to take place.

    As for increase in post count to advertise, which a few of you have mentioned...well, that's another thread...suffice it to say I'm on board with that as well!

    There are plenty of reasons to not increase post count based on advertising forum posts. What reasons are there that increasing post count is a positive thing?
    Studio1337___̴ı̴̴̡̡̡ ̡͌l̡̡̡ ̡͌l̡*̡̡ ̴̡ı̴̴̡ ̡̡͡|̲̲̲͡͡͡ ̲▫̲͡ ̲̲̲͡͡π̲̲͡͡ ̲̲͡▫̲̲͡͡ ̲|̡̡̡ ̡ ̴̡ı̴̡̡ ̡͌l̡̡̡̡.__Web Design

  21. #21
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    Originally posted by Chris Armstrong
    Sirius, unless I'm completely mistaken, the vote is to remove the system that awards people post counts by posting in the advertising forum. Not to remove the minimum post count required to start threads there.

    Maybe you have it right, but from the way I read your post it made me think that you believe they're removing the post count minimum to start threads there.
    Ummmmm, Hmmmmmm, Ummmmm <looks both ways>, yeah, I knew that....



    Sirius

    P.S. Change my vote from NO to YES!
    I support the Human Rights Campaign!
    Moving to the Tampa, Florida area? Check out life in the suburbs in Trinity, Florida.

  22. #22
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    Originally posted by Chris Armstrong
    Sirius, unless I'm completely mistaken, the vote is to remove the system that awards people post counts by posting in the advertising forum. Not to remove the minimum post count required to start threads there.

    Maybe you have it right, but from the way I read your post it made me think that you believe they're removing the post count minimum to start threads there.
    Actually, it's to make it so post count does not increase when someone posts there
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  23. #23
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    That's what I was trying to say the_pm, I just took the long route

    Originally posted by the_pm
    Actually, it's to make it so post count does not increase when someone posts there

  24. #24
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    I voted yes, but I also think that the post count should be raised to 50 to 100. I would think that would keep the trouble makers out or for a little longer .

  25. #25
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    Originally posted by the_pm
    Y'all can throw your rotten produce at me for suggesting this one.
    Nice post.

    I'll now rehash some of the reasoning I put forward privately to the other liaisons and leaders.
    Thanks for your well-thought-out explanation. It makes sense to me now, and I just voted yes.

    Also, let's face it. One of the big factors that goes into how we judge the value of members is by their post count.
    This might be part of the problem, which is why I'm not convinced that raising the required post count for some rights will solve the problems. But that's for another thread.

    I do agree, though, that not letting posters use the Advertising forums to increase their post counts is a good idea.

    By removing post count increases in advertising forums, you're not stopping people from conducting business on WHT by any means. You're creating more of a separation between the heart and soul of WHT (the general forums, and arguably the lounge), and the area that is a perk of being a member, an afterthought. These two distinct areas do not carry the same importance, and removing post count from advertising forums reflects this.
    Well said.

    Lois
    "Do what you can, where you are, with what you have." – Theodore Roosevelt

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