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  1. #1
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    "Love" in action and victims of ex-gay brainwashing

    Saw this on another forum. I had to post it here. Unbelievably disgusting and cruel in so many ways. I can't believe organizations like this exist... and that there are people so heartless as to support them.
    --Cut out bad language to be pasted on this board---
    This is "Love in Action," an anti-gay camp for teens to find Jesus and change their sinful sinful ways.

    And these are the thoughts of a 16 year old boy, who doesn't want to be a part of it, who came out to his parents only to be thrown into the program with the ultimate goal of brainwashing out the gay.

    The camp rules are posted, and it's just ----ing sick. It's brainwashing, it's child abuse, it's ----ing INSANE and I wish that it was illegal so these ----ed up misguided ---holes he calls mom and dad could be locked away for attempting to emotionally DESTROY their child.

    Just because you wrap it up in bible quotes doesn't mean it isn't intended to harm. The entire goal of this brainwashing scheme is to take away what matters most. No communication with any friends, no keeping a journal, no "false images" that could at all remind you or relate to your previous (read: happy) life, no physical contact with anyone aside from polite professional handshakes.

    These cruel sick ----s think that it's ok to take a CHILD, a ----ing child who says NO and break him, mess him up mentally and emotionally until he is weak and powerless, crush his soul and leave an empty sad shell of a person that they can implant their BULL---- anti-gay rhetoric in and send on his way.

    They're going to murder him. They're going to kill everything that made him who he was. I hope his parents and everyone brainwashing kids in this sick cult ----ing roast.
    What do you think? As of now, he has over 100 comments on his latest blog posting.
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  2. #2
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    That is just wrong. He is only young!
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  3. #3
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    Disgusting that something like this even exists...And as Bakie said too young
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  4. #4
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    While I agree with the premise for it, I disagree with the execution of it.

    I think that they go a little too far with everything. We are not supposed to judge, thats God's job. Rather than forcing this on them, it should be voluntary, teach them the Bible, and let them make their own decisions. If they don't want to do it, they don't have to.


    I like the way MN Teen Challenge works. It is a similar program like this one, only focuses more on drug and alchohol abuse. I have quite a few friends whose lives have completely turned around after going to Teen Challenge (many of which voluntarily went there to get clean). And we're talking about hardcore crack addicts being clean almost cold-turkey.
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  5. #5
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    Originally posted by amish_geek
    While I agree with the premise for it, I disagree with the execution of it.

    I think that they go a little too far with everything. We are not supposed to judge, thats God's job. Rather than forcing this on them, it should be voluntary, teach them the Bible, and let them make their own decisions. If they don't want to do it, they don't have to.


    I like the way MN Teen Challenge works. It is a similar program like this one, only focuses more on drug and alchohol abuse. I have quite a few friends whose lives have completely turned around after going to Teen Challenge (many of which voluntarily went there to get clean). And we're talking about hardcore crack addicts being clean almost cold-turkey.
    I should assume that you feel drug and alchohol abuse is similar to homesexuality then.
    What do you mean by saying - "I agree with the premise for it"

    Jord
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  6. #6
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    That is shocking.

    I cannot believe that his parents would be so cruel. Whether they agree or disagree with homosexuality is their problem. They shouldnít force him to go through such pain and suffering.

    Some peopleÖ
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  7. #7
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    Originally posted by effusionx1
    I should assume that you feel drug and alchohol abuse is similar to homesexuality then.
    What do you mean by saying - "I agree with the premise for it"

    Jord
    A sin is a sin is a sin.

    We're all sinners. I sin, I've lied, I've stolen, I've lusted after a woman (committed adultury). I've hated (committed murder in my heart).

    Having homosexual tendency or thoughts is a temptation. Acting on those thoughts is a sin. Just like I can be tempted by a beautiful woman, to act on those thoughts, by fantasizing/lusting after her, or actually doing an act outside of marriage, is a sin.

    There are differences between being tempted, and actually committing a sin.

    So a person who struggles with homosexuality, or faces homosexual temptations, is no different than me struggling with similar temptations towards women at a beach on a hot day. They just need help dealing with those temptations.

    For someone who calls themself a homosexual, meaning they actually stepped forward and delved into the temptation, then that is a sin, and the person should repent.


    So yes, to answer your question, I would consider a practicing homosexual the same.
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  8. #8
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    Originally posted by effusionx1
    I should assume that you feel drug and alchohol abuse is similar to homesexuality then.
    What do you mean by saying - "I agree with the premise for it"

    Jord
    I also agree with the premise of it and I do know (from others who have been through it) in some cases homosexuality can be the same as drug and alcohol abuse because it's an outlet for someone that has emotional issues that they need to escape from.
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  9. #9
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    The stupid thing is, in the bible it says homosexuality is wrong...but then in the next chapter it says disobedient children should be stoned to death!! I don't think there is wrong with homosexuality...but that's just me.

    garr, I really hate them now, this picture is a thumbnail size on their site...no link to it, other than if you use the ff right click thing.

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  10. #10
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    Sorry, but why are these right wing religious nuts concentrating in wife beaters and killers and things that are actually destructive?

    The hypocrisy of these people is pathetic. Preach tolerance as long as you are tolerating what they decide you can tolerate.
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  11. #11
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    Originally posted by amish_geek
    A sin is a sin is a sin.

    We're all sinners. I sin, I've lied, I've stolen, I've lusted after a woman (committed adultury). I've hated (committed murder in my heart).

    Having homosexual tendency or thoughts is a temptation. Acting on those thoughts is a sin. Just like I can be tempted by a beautiful woman, to act on those thoughts, by fantasizing/lusting after her, or actually doing an act outside of marriage, is a sin.

    There are differences between being tempted, and actually committing a sin.

    So a person who struggles with homosexuality, or faces homosexual temptations, is no different than me struggling with similar temptations towards women at a beach on a hot day. They just need help dealing with those temptations.

    For someone who calls themself a homosexual, meaning they actually stepped forward and delved into the temptation, then that is a sin, and the person should repent.


    So yes, to answer your question, I would consider a practicing homosexual the same.
    So you agree that you should be sent to one of these camps because you've lusted after a woman? Because you've lied? You should go to a special camp for those things? If those things are on par with homosexuality, then we should ALL be at a camp. No need for a special camp.

    BTW: How would they be abstinent until marriage if you don't allow them to marry?

    btw, about this camp:
    "But whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea" ó Jesus (Matthew 18:6, NASB)
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  12. #12
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    Originally posted by amish_geek
    A sin is a sin is a sin.

    We're all sinners. I sin, I've lied, I've stolen, I've lusted after a woman (committed adultury). I've hated (committed murder in my heart).

    Having homosexual tendency or thoughts is a temptation. Acting on those thoughts is a sin. Just like I can be tempted by a beautiful woman, to act on those thoughts, by fantasizing/lusting after her, or actually doing an act outside of marriage, is a sin.

    There are differences between being tempted, and actually committing a sin.

    So a person who struggles with homosexuality, or faces homosexual temptations, is no different than me struggling with similar temptations towards women at a beach on a hot day. They just need help dealing with those temptations.

    For someone who calls themself a homosexual, meaning they actually stepped forward and delved into the temptation, then that is a sin, and the person should repent.


    So yes, to answer your question, I would consider a practicing homosexual the same.
    Ahh but there is one fundemental flaw in your whole 'A sin is a sin is a sin' argument.

    Its only a sin to those that are religeous, you are so you see it as a sin i'm not so to me its nothing a non event if someone is a homosexual then the only person they have to answer to is themselves who on earth am i to say that it is wrong.

    So you see your putting your own views on things that do not concern you.
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  13. #13
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    YAGT... (yet another GAY thread!)

    I think the idea is pretty sick.....

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  14. #14
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    Originally posted by phill2003
    Ahh but there is one fundemental flaw in your whole 'A sin is a sin is a sin' argument.

    Its only a sin to those that are religeous, you are so you see it as a sin i'm not so to me its nothing a non event if someone is a homosexual then the only person they have to answer to is themselves who on earth am i to say that it is wrong.

    So you see your putting your own views on things that do not concern you.
    I see it as a sin, because the Bible says it is a sin. I believe in the Bible.

    You don't have to believe in the Bible, and I'm not going to force you to. I will tell someone about Jesus and the Bible, and I'll pray for them. But if they don't want to have anything to do with it, thats fine, I'll let them be. My concience will be clear when I stand before God at the great white throne on judgement day.

    God gave mankind a freewill. People are free to choose God, should they desire to do so. The Bible clearly states what will happen to those that go their own way. And God will let them go their own way, and let them learn from their mistakes on judgement day.
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  15. #15
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    Originally posted by amish_geek
    A sin is a sin is a sin.

    We're all sinners. I sin, I've lied, I've stolen, I've lusted after a woman (committed adultury). I've hated (committed murder in my heart).

    Having homosexual tendency or thoughts is a temptation. Acting on those thoughts is a sin. Just like I can be tempted by a beautiful woman, to act on those thoughts, by fantasizing/lusting after her, or actually doing an act outside of marriage, is a sin.

    There are differences between being tempted, and actually committing a sin.

    So a person who struggles with homosexuality, or faces homosexual temptations, is no different than me struggling with similar temptations towards women at a beach on a hot day. They just need help dealing with those temptations.

    For someone who calls themself a homosexual, meaning they actually stepped forward and delved into the temptation, then that is a sin, and the person should repent.


    So yes, to answer your question, I would consider a practicing homosexual the same.
    Wow - this sort of thinking is exactly I abhor conventional, organized religion - equating someone who is homosexual to someone who is a drug addict, telling us we're all sinners, that we should repent, that temptation is evil - a bunch of hogwash, that's what it is.

    People choose to do drugs, just the same way you choose to be religious. People don't choose to be gay. You can't take the gay out of someone.
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  16. #16
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    Originally posted by amish_geek
    I see it as a sin, because the Bible says it is a sin. I believe in the Bible.

    You don't have to believe in the Bible, and I'm not going to force you to. I will tell someone about Jesus and the Bible, and I'll pray for them. But if they don't want to have anything to do with it, thats fine, I'll let them be. My concience will be clear when I stand before God at the great white throne on judgement day.

    God gave mankind a freewill. People are free to choose God, should they desire to do so. The Bible clearly states what will happen to those that go their own way. And God will let them go their own way, and let them learn from their mistakes on judgement day.
    I think I understand your points Amish and I most certainly respect them. However, do you not see it as naive that this company/website has chosen to isloate homosexuals as an example?

    If they are also sinners (the website owners), what makes them more capable of providing ' spiritual support' to those that do not neccassrily seek it? What qualifies them to do that?

    If we are all the same, why write an article about homesexuals?
    As for you believing in the Bible - I will not challenge that as that is your belief.

    From what I understand they say that anyone who submits to temptation has no place in heaven. Does this not mean that no human will be in heaven?

    The article loses total respect for me because of one main fact:

    They use imperatives throughout

    Not once do they open a question for thought or selfr-contemplation, not once do they cross-reference and analyse their own beliefs in the article.

    Some examples:

    There is no such creation as a "gay"
    modern American culture has bought into a lie!
    They say homosexuality is a wrong mindset.
    Would they consider the reality of placing ones entire belief in a book with such off-handed mannerisms?

    Thay say that everyone must repent; how does one repent exactly? By holding ones hands together and looking to the sky asking for forgiveness? I'm not saying thats wrong, i'm just challenging it - just like I question my own beliefs.

    I could go on but I will not. I think the general point has been made.

    Relgious individuals do not seem to self-question the beliefs they hold. I would ask them to do this more than they question others. I think I question my belief readily and with an open-mind as much as is possible.

    Would the world not be better if they stopped judging homosexuals and went about with a greater understanding of the modern world and of modern people.

    Would the world not be better if they stopped preaching to homosexuals and went about stopping all the wars they have started.

    I think so.

    Thanks,

    Jord
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  17. #17
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    The stupid thing is, in the bible it says homosexuality is wrong
    Iíd just like to clarify that the Bible doesnít state that homosexuality is wrong. No where does it state that being a homosexual is a sin. It is argued though that in certain parts of the Bible it says homosexual relationships are sinful (You can find both sides to the argument here).


    Ahh but there is one fundemental flaw in your whole 'A sin is a sin is a sin' argument.

    Its only a sin to those that are religeous, you are so you see it as a sin i'm not so to me its nothing a non event if someone is a homosexual then the only person they have to answer to is themselves who on earth am i to say that it is wrong.
    Another problem with his ďa sin is a sin is a sinĒ argument is that a large proportion of denominations donít class homosexuality as a sin.


    I see it as a sin, because the Bible says it is a sin. I believe in the Bible.
    But the Bible doesnít say that homosexuality is a sin. There are many homosexuals who are Catholics, Anglicans, etc. Ė I myself am an Anglican. In fact the Archbishop of Canterbury said there are no grounds to condemn homosexuality as sinful in the Bible.
    Classing oneself as a homosexual doesnít mean youíve had sex with other people of the same sex (which some argue the Bible says is a sin), it simply means youíve accepted that you donít have any feelings for people of the opposite sex.
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  18. #18
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    Originally posted by effusionx1
    I think I understand your points Amish and I most certainly respect them. However, do you not see it as naive that this company/website has chosen to isloate homosexuals as an example?

    If they are also sinners (the website owners), what makes them more capable of providing ' spiritual support' to those that do not neccassrily seek it? What qualifies them to do that?

    If we are all the same, why write an article about homesexuals?
    As for you believing in the Bible - I will not challenge that as that is your belief.
    I'm glad that you have the ability to look at something objectively, and try to see the point of view of someone else. I like to think I have the same ability.

    I don't see it as naive, as that would imply cluelessness towards anything else. As I said in my original post, I agree with the premise, not the execution. Now, using this as an example, not necessarily equating it as equal. If one were to look at homosexuality as a problem, or disorder, similar to how say alchoholism is a problem, or disorder, then you look at resolving it through support groups and counseling.

    I believe my statement was not put as best as it could have been. It is more about classification and treatment, rather than actually equating homosexuality to a drug addiction. They are not the same, other than the fact that both have temptations, and both have actions, and both can be treated (fixed?) in similar fashions through guidance and counseling.



    From what I understand they say that anyone who submits to temptation has no place in heaven. Does this not mean that no human will be in heaven?
    Acutally no, there is nothing wrong with being tempted. But submitting, or acting on that temptation (if the temptation is to sin), is a sin.

    Thankfully, God send his Son Jesus to earth, to live as a man, commit no sin, and then die the worst possible death. To be crucified on the cross as the worst of criminals are. Jesus's death absolves us from our sin, but only if we freely accept that gift of salvation.

    But accepting Jesus's gift of salvation doesn't make one sinnless, but hopefully it will help you to sin less.


    The article loses total respect for me because of one main fact:

    They use imperatives throughout

    Not once do they open a question for thought or selfr-contemplation, not once do they cross-reference and analyse their own beliefs in the article.

    Some examples:





    They say homosexuality is a wrong mindset.
    Would they consider the reality of placing ones entire belief in a book with such off-handed mannerisms?

    Thay say that everyone must repent; how does one repent exactly? By holding ones hands together and looking to the sky asking for forgiveness? I'm not saying thats wrong, i'm just challenging it - just like I question my own beliefs.

    I could go on but I will not. I think the general point has been made.

    Relgious individuals do not seem to self-question the beliefs they hold. I would ask them to do this more than they question others. I think I question my belief readily and with an open-mind as much as is possible.

    Would the world not be better if they stopped judging homosexuals and went about with a greater understanding of the modern world and of modern people.

    Would the world not be better if they stopped preaching to homosexuals and went about stopping all the wars they have started.

    I think so.

    Thanks,

    Jord
    I agree with you, everyone should daily question their beliefs. I think too many people get hung up on the peripheral things.

    I firmly believe that the Bible teaches us to love one another. I have a problem with that, as there are some people I know who I have a VERY hard time showing love towards. Yet I still do my best to try to show love towards them.

    I also believe that it is not my duty to convert someone, nor force them to change. I will however, share my faith and belief. I will also ask them if they would care to study the Bible, or discuss spiritual things. I love talking to people of other religions, and chat a lot with some of the foreign students here at college to learn about their beliefs. And as they share with me theirs, I share with them mine.

    I'll share Jesus with people, but I let people find Jesus's truth themselves, and let them make the choice to follow him.


    -----

    I know we got off topic here a bit. Perhaps if this thread of discussion is to continue, we should open up a new thread.
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  19. #19
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    Originally posted by Jay Suds
    People don't choose to be gay. You can't take the gay out of someone.
    Talk about being brainwashed....here we go again. Once again, there is NO scientific proof people are born gay OR straight. The gay community would like you to think so, and they have accomplished in making most people believe the proof has been given, when in reality it hasnt.

    There was a "theory" that there "might" be a gene that "might" make someone gay (or straight). The gay community took that little excerpt from the scientific community and presented it to the world as fact. Anyone who believes it has been severely mislead, and tend to be naive enough to believe anything they hear, and pass it on to other naive people as fact.

    Typical.....but then, I have done the same on other matters too, so am just as guilty of the naive part.. but THIS is one I know better on...
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  20. #20
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    Originally posted by amish_geek

    I know we got off topic here a bit. Perhaps if this thread of discussion is to continue, we should open up a new thread.
    Yeah sorry I think that was my fault - I had a bit of a rant
    I suppose it was all loosely connected though.

    Jord
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    Talk about being brainwashed....here we go again. Once again, there is NO scientific proof people are born gay OR straight. The gay community would like you to think so, and they have accomplished in making most people believe the proof has been given, when in reality it hasnt.

    There was a "theory" that there "might" be a gene that "might" make someone gay (or straight). The gay community took that little excerpt from the scientific community and presented it to the world as fact. Anyone who believes it has been severely mislead, and tend to be naive enough to believe anything they hear, and pass it on to other naive people as fact.

    Typical.....but then, I have done the same on other matters too, so am just as guilty of the naive part.. but THIS is one I know better on...
    How do you know that you havenít been brainwashed to believe that homosexuality is a choice?
    In a previous topic Sirius talked about how he is gay, and has been ever since he can remember. The exact same goes for myself. Youíre not gay, and scientists havenít found anything on either side of the debate yet Ė but we know because we are gay.

    I donít want this topic to go off topic, although there is more evidence to prove that homosexuality isnít a choice.
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  22. #22
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    Originally posted by Anjay
    How do you know that you havenít been brainwashed to believe that homosexuality is a choice?
    In a previous topic Sirius talked about how he is gay, and has been ever since he can remember. The exact same goes for myself. Youíre not gay, and scientists havenít found anything on either side of the debate yet Ė but we know because we are gay.

    I donít want this topic to go off topic, although there is more evidence to prove that homosexuality isnít a choice.
    I'm gay? I thought I just liked shopping... and decorating my home... and my partner of 10+ years... oh yeah, wait, I am gay.

    I love the knuckleheads who post, "Being Gay is a choice!". Coming from a presumably straight person, that's great logic. Really.

    Someone, anyone, prove to me where I made a choice to be gay? Someone... anyone... hello.... anyone...?

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  23. #23
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    Originally posted by sirius
    I'm gay? I thought I just liked shopping... and decorating my home... and my partner of 10+ years... oh yeah, wait, I am gay.

    I love the knuckleheads who post, "Being Gay is a choice!". Coming from a presumably straight person, that's great logic. Really.

    Someone, anyone, prove to me where I made a choice to be gay? Someone... anyone... hello.... anyone...?

    Sirius
    I'll tell you, when you decided what kinds of things you liked. I like women, but I was born neither gay or straight. I turned out straight because of things in my life that affected my perception of things around me. For example, I like big dogs, not little ones. Was I born hating little dogs? Was I born to like big dogs? No. Was I born male? Yes, was I born to like women? No.

    Everything a person turns out to be is cause and effect. Even whether or not you are smart or dumb by society's perspective. What if a dumb back woods person who hunts for a living grew up in an area with educated people who dont believe in harming animals? Would he be the same person? I doubt it.

    It's all cause and effect. Nothing forces you to be gay. Nobody forces me to be straight. Personal life experience tells me it was not how I had to be, that I could choose how I wanted to be. Or I could have used the silly and stupid scapegoat "I was born that way". Life is about choices, you can be who and what you want to be. I have no problem with people being gay, I have a problem with the excuses they think they have to come up with for being the way they are. I know severely handicapped people who dont even use that excuse, and they have a REAL reason to do so..

    Quit crying and making excuses, and just live your life the way you want to. Dont worry about what others think, and you dont have to use that untruthful excuse..
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    The cause and effect theory is complete crap.
    It's the small minded and insecure who need a nice convenient explanation like that to make them sleep better at night with their own inadequacies.

    Why do people who believe homosexuality is a life choice refuse to listen to the facts? Why do they refuse to comprehend that there is no logic in choosing a gay lifestyle when people would know they face persecution?

    The only cause and effect is that some people were brought up wrong and don't have the ability to think for themselves and are not able to accept what they can't comprehend.

    No different than racism.
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  25. #25
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    Originally posted by blue27
    Why do people who believe homosexuality is a life choice refuse to listen to the facts? Why do they refuse to comprehend that there is no logic in choosing a gay lifestyle when people would know they face persecution?
    Why do drug addicts choose to be drug addicts when they would have it worse by the system than a gay person? C'mon, get real... I guess they were "born" that way
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    You would be surprised what parents do when it comes to their kids. And these feelings that they might have at that age can be the true thing or it can be just a phase. And the streets, especially in Hollywood / West Hollywood / Santa Monica are full of kids who have been kicked out of their homes because they told their parents.

    It is scary being the 21st century that ideas such as this still exist
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  27. #27
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    Originally posted by Webdude
    Why do drug addicts choose to be drug addicts when they would have it worse by the system than a gay person? C'mon, get real... I guess they were "born" that way


    Show me some proof that drug addicts are not born predisposed to becoming an adict and I might consider you argument.
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  28. #28
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    Originally posted by blue27
    Show me some proof that drug addicts are not born predisposed to becoming an adict and I might consider you argument.
    Show me proof they are, and I will consider yours..

    Back to the subject though, maybe much to your surprise, I believe the parents are entirely in the wrong here...
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  29. #29
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    Webdude : Your arguements show that people are born just people, with no predesposition, with no sexuality. You make all of lifes "choices," or "outcomes" seem like undecided facts that turn out that way outside of the control of the person, or within their control. But ask yourself this, if both are just natural outcomes outside of the control, then why is homosexuality considered to be so bad, so horrible, so sinful; while the other more common choice is considered more acceptable and more forced onto people.
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  30. #30
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    Originally posted by Aea
    Webdude : Your arguements show that people are born just people, with no predesposition, with no sexuality. You make all of lifes "choices," or "outcomes" seem like undecided facts that turn out that way outside of the control of the person, or within their control. But ask yourself this, if both are just natural outcomes outside of the control, then why is homosexuality considered to be so bad, so horrible, so sinful; while the other more common choice is considered more acceptable and more forced onto people.
    People tend to clump in groups. You have the religious groups, which have divided and formed their own groups. Originally, the religious groups were the biggest, and had the most power. They were the ones who made gays the outcasts. Whatever group has the most power will be the one who attempts to have the most influence. The ones with the most influence, etc, etc.

    Thats why gays were persecuted, as well as blacks, jews, etc, etc...because the prominent group had grown large enough to do so.

    You can see it happening with our very government, weilding it's powerful influence over other nations..
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  31. #31
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    Originally posted by Webdude
    I'll tell you, when you decided what kinds of things you liked. I like women, but I was born neither gay or straight. I turned out straight because of things in my life that affected my perception of things around me. For example, I like big dogs, not little ones. Was I born hating little dogs? Was I born to like big dogs? No. Was I born male? Yes, was I born to like women? No.

    <<snipped BS>>

    Quit crying and making excuses, and just live your life the way you want to. Dont worry about what others think, and you dont have to use that untruthful excuse..
    This has to be one of the saddest things I have ever read. Are you really this shallow?

    Come on... show me the proof that it was a choice. Do you have nothing better to offer than this narrow minded rant above? Proof. Prove to me that I made a choice to be gay.

    Quit crying and making excuses? Whose crying... I am sure as **** happy about who I am nor am I making excuses, unlike your post above....

    Sirius
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  32. #32
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    Originally posted by sirius
    nor am I making excuses, unlike your post above....

    Sirius
    Doesnt sound like it. Saying you were born like that is nothing more than a scapegoat. So go ahead, use the lie if you wish. I think you have lied to yourself long enough, and the gay community has lied to itself long enough that you and it have come to believe such BS. Blaming the way you are on something like that is just a way of side stepping responsibility of accepting that you are who you make yourself to be. Next thing that will happen is that everybody who feels "persecuted" will now claim they were "born" that way to gain sympathy from the public.

    You are neither born gay or straight. When you are born, you dont even yet have the capacity for sexuality, so you cant possibly claim it.

    Anyway, keep believing the lie. Whatever.
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  33. #33
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    Originally posted by Webdude
    Doesnt sound like it. Saying you were born like that is nothing more than a scapegoat. So go ahead, use the lie if you wish. I think you have lied to yourself long enough, and the gay community has lied to itself long enough that you and it have come to believe such BS. Blaming the way you are on something like that is just a way of side stepping responsibility of accepting that you are who you make yourself to be. Next thing that will happen is that everybody who feels "persecuted" will now claim they were "born" that way to gain sympathy from the public.

    You are neither born gay or straight. When you are born, you dont even yet have the capacity for sexuality, so you cant possibly claim it.

    Anyway, keep believing the lie. Whatever.

    You are so ignorant you are adorable.
    Prove that it is a lie that people are not born gay.

    Are you hiding something? Perhaps a little latency?
    Why are you so afraid of gay people? Why are you so afraid to believe that some things in life are not by choice? A sad upbringing to be sure but you must be over 12 by now. Try to think for yourself.

    If you are thinking for yourself then I have deep sympathy for you. You are a blind bigot and you have no control over it. That is certainly an aquired trait.
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  34. #34
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    Originally posted by blue27
    You are so ignorant you are adorable.
    Prove that it is a lie that people are not born gay.

    Are you hiding something? Perhaps a little latency?
    Why are you so afraid of gay people? Why are you so afraid to believe that some things in life are not by choice? A sad upbringing to be sure but you must be over 12 by now. Try to think for yourself.

    If you are thinking for yourself then I have deep sympathy for you. You are a blind bigot and you have no control over it. That is certainly an aquired trait.
    Blue, you have always had trouble reading, and I understand that. I can tell because rarely do you read an entire post before responding. I never said I had anything against gays. I said I dont agree with the lie. Thats like me saying I was born straight as an excuse for being straight.

    Besides, I dont have to prove a thing. It's the gay community that came up with the lie, and both they and the scientfic community has yet to prove it.

    Next time, try going a little slower so you dont hurt yourself, and read an entire post before replying with your under-developed childish responses.
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  35. #35
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    Originally posted by Webdude
    Doesnt sound like it. Saying you were born like that is nothing more than a scapegoat. So go ahead, use the lie if you wish. I think you have lied to yourself long enough, and the gay community has lied to itself long enough that you and it have come to believe such BS. Blaming the way you are on something like that is just a way of side stepping responsibility of accepting that you are who you make yourself to be. Next thing that will happen is that everybody who feels "persecuted" will now claim they were "born" that way to gain sympathy from the public.

    You are neither born gay or straight. When you are born, you dont even yet have the capacity for sexuality, so you cant possibly claim it.

    Anyway, keep believing the lie. Whatever.
    Typical biggoted response.

    So, again, where is proof? Where is proof that this is a choice? Where is your proof that I am "living a lie"? What lie am I believing?

    None... the only proof you have is the anger you hold in your heart.

    Sirius
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    Moving to the Tampa, Florida area? Check out life in the suburbs in Trinity, Florida.
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  36. #36
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    Originally posted by Webdude
    Besides, I dont have to prove a thing. It's the gay community that came up with the lie, and both they and the scientfic community has yet to prove it.
    You said I am not born this way, so prove it. What lie did we come up with? If "we're born this way is a lie", then there must be some proof.

    Where is is?

    Sirius
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  37. #37
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    Originally posted by sirius
    Typical biggoted response.

    So, again, where is proof? Where is proof that this is a choice? Where is your proof that I am "living a lie"? What lie am I believing?

    None... the only proof you have is the anger you hold in your heart.

    Sirius
    Ask the ones who are spreading the lies where the proof is. When someone claims something, they generally have the proof to back it up. You do not have that proof. The burden of proof is on you and the gay community, not me. SHow me the scientific evidence that you all are always so quick to need in order to believe things..
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  38. #38
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    Originally posted by Webdude
    Blue, you have always had trouble reading, and I understand that. I can tell because rarely do you read an entire post before responding. I never said I had anything against gays. I said I dont agree with the lie. Thats like me saying I was born straight as an excuse for being straight.

    Besides, I dont have to prove a thing. It's the gay community that came up with the lie, and both they and the scientfic community has yet to prove it.

    Next time, try going a little slower so you dont hurt yourself, and read an entire post before replying with your under-developed childish responses.
    You do know that animals can be homosexuals too, right?
    Are they lying to themselves too
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  39. #39
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    Originally posted by Webdude
    Ask the ones who are spreading the lies where the proof is. When someone claims something, they generally have the proof to back it up. You do not have that proof. The burden of proof is on you and the gay community, not me. SHow me the scientific evidence that you all are always so quick to need in order to believe things..
    Bubba, I am gay... and I know I was born gay. There is no proof to show you, I am not the one arguing this ignorant argument.

    You say it is a lie. You say I am not born gay. So prove your statement.

    Sirius
    I support the Human Rights Campaign!
    Moving to the Tampa, Florida area? Check out life in the suburbs in Trinity, Florida.
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  40. #40
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    Originally posted by Web dude
    Blue, you have always had trouble reading, and I understand that. I can tell because rarely do you read an entire post before responding. I never said I had anything against gays. I said I dont agree with the lie. Thats like me saying I was born straight as an excuse for being straight.

    Besides, I dont have to prove a thing. It's the gay community that came up with the lie, and both they and the scientfic community has yet to prove it.

    Next time, try going a little slower so you dont hurt yourself, and read an entire post before replying with your under-developed childish responses.

    You are either a raging hypocrite or you really don't have a clue what you think yourself.
    The very nature of your posts prove that you have a problem with gays. Why are you lying now that you don't?

    Do you think you are fooling someone? You are not. Only yourself. It is you that is living the lie.

    It's ironic that you would call my responses childish when you are not even mature enough to accept the fact that homosexuality is not a choice.
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