Results 1 to 27 of 27
  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106

    win 2003 dedicated scsi mssql

    Hi, can anybody offer any advice? We are a small early stage UK based co. We need to find a hosting partner and are keen to look to the USA purely on a cost basis it does appear we may pay up to 50% less all round for a quality dedicted host service.

    We have an " online application" that runs on win2003 standard edition aspx.net required MSSQL and we will install our own matching/search engine which is optimized purely for matching and connect via a pipe to mssql which return results to the front end web site. I have been told we are processor intensive and must run scsi drives. (excuse me i am non technical.

    I have looked at a number of hosting providers in the US and seems to me there are very many good ones. I like three in particular, can anyone recommend either or an.other. they are

    liquidweb
    sago networks
    netnation

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106

    one other question

    actually i do have one second question ref the above post.

    do you believe we will experience wany performance problem by have our servers in the USA we are UK based and so too will be all our customers in the early months?

    will it reduce speed in any way that would annoy usres, i am thinking of more than a 1 second delay? against hosting in the UK.

    as a guide in the UK we very much like netplan.co.uk

    what do you guys think? should we go US or stay UK?

    Best regards Paul

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    133
    If all your customers are UK based you would definately see performance differences between USA and UK hosting. If you have the choice between hosting in the USA and hosting in the UK i'd prefer UK (or NL, if you can't find what you're looking for in the UK).

    Go see for yourself, visit a few USA-hosted sites and right after that visit some UK-hosted sites. You'll definately experience a faster loading UK site.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106
    Weppel

    hi, i have tried this in the past few days and to be honest i really did not notice the difference, maybe i missed something, but if it is less than 1 second then it is not a problem. Do you think it would be more than 1 second delay for hosting in the USA?

    Paul

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    133
    Stilesp,

    All depends on how your site is built. Look at it this way:

    Average pingtime to a server located in the USA would be around 125-150ms. Average pingtime to a server located in the UK/NL would be around 12-20ms. Every request would take up to 10x the time if hosted in the USA, because every request would take 125-150ms to even arrive at the server.

    Say you have 10 images on your site, who doesn't nowadays.
    That would mean your PC has to wait around 1.2 seconds before all requests are being sent back (okay, not really realistic but you get the point). When you'd host in the UK/NL the requests for those 10 images would have been handled in under 120ms total

    It's always a good thing to host somewhere near where your main visitors will come from. I'm doing both; i have servers in the US for my US-based websites and i also have several servers in NL for my NL-based websites. I'm from NL myself and i really see the difference between requesting a page from my NL servers and requesting a page from my US servers.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106
    Weppel

    thanks for this, actually our site/application is about matching texts and has very little by way of images, it is really about writing and reading usually 20-40k pages" to dbase and getting an answer back more like a search application. I hear what you say but i really do not understand ping and millisecond, if it the difference is more than 1-2 seconds to serve a page then i think it is a noticable difference.

    thank you very much for helping, much appreciate it, who do you host with in the US and who in NL? also what type of sites do you run? are the dbase driven from say mssql or mysql?

    Paul

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    133
    Paul,

    With ping you can check the time spent connecting to the server in question and back. This gives you a very good view of how far the server is away from you and how much time your PC/internet connection needs to get to that server and start requesting data. General rule here: The lower the ping, the better.

    Miliseconds: When someone talks about a ping that's for example 150ms that would mean 0.15 seconds (1000miliseconds == 1 second). Hope this clears things up a bit.

    I have several dedicated servers at ThePlanet and LayeredTech and i colocate my own servers at NXS (dutch site). I run various kinds of websites on them, mostly MySQL websites (NL) but also alot of static websites (US).

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    458
    I'd definitely recommend a UK-based server if you are UK-based and your site's visitors are mainly UK/Europe.

    There is not so much price differential these days between good quality UK and USA based dedicateds as there used to be. Note I said "good quality"

    You should evaluate whether you need to run SQL Server on your dedicated box or would be better off using shared SQL Server (much cheaper for smaller databases, not only because of the licence cost for SQL Server but also because you will need higher spec hardware). You could also investigate using MSDE, which is free -- ok if it's your site and you are not reselling space (MSDE is a cut-down version of SQL Server which can work very happily on a webserver).

    Whether you need SCSI drives is debatable. I've seen some very busy sites run very happily on servers with non-SCSI drives. SCSI will put your costs up.
    Chris at TDMWeb.com
    Windows & Linux hosting and fully managed dedicated servers with great customer service!
    UK-based but serving the world...

  9. #9
    Why not buy an IBM xSeries or Compaq DL series machine and colocate it yourselves? This will be the best way to handle this by far. Few providers will actually provide quality servers, most are using desktop motherboards in rack cases and passing them off as "servers"

    Some great servers to look at:

    IBM xSeries 345
    IBM xSeries 360
    Compaq DL580 G2
    Compaq DL360 G2
    Compaq DL380 G3
    Dell PowerEdge 2650
    Dell PowerEdge 6450 / 6650

    These are all available on www.ebay.co.uk at good prices.

    Best of luck
    EuroVPS VPS Hosting - Virtual Private Servers | Web Hosting | Dedicated Servers
    Providing Reliable Plesk and cPanel Servers since 2004, now offering low priced Xen & VMware VPS in Amsterdam
    UK +44.203.355.6681 / Amsterdam +31.208.202.120

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106

    thanks all for your help

    colocation is an absolute non runner for us, we want dedicated and managed after the test period and it is also about cash flow, but thank you for suggesting it.

    on the other issues we have evaluated shared mssql and it just will not work for our application, very sure on this.

    all "experts" point us in the direction of scsi and all i read tells me this is a must for us when we go into production

    the price thing i am convinced that the US in many cases is 50% less all round than the UK and i have looked at quality v quality well as sure as i can be liquidweb US for instance of course the $ rate could change this

    the speed i am still to be convinced that it is so much different, when i say so much i mean much more than 1 second to the human eye

    the google thing i see could be an issue, but for us we will not be reliant heavily on google ranking

    has anyone any experience of solidhost.com

    once again than you all for you feedback, happy to still receive feedback

    esp uk v us

    best regards paul

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106
    tdmweb

    thank you for all your points i left one off in my answer, msde is a non runner for us sadly.

    paul

  12. #12
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106
    TDMWEB


    Take a look at the comparison below UK v US at 1.85 ex rate that is 183 pounds for the US offering and look at the spec diff, it seems so much more for so much less and then you have good ole VAT at 17.5% on top for buying from UK. Of course i would love to buy British but it seesm to me below tells the story...ps this US supplier has a very good reputation here and i know i can gett raid added to this or 10% off!!

    UK
    2.4Ghz Dual Xeon, 2Gb RAM, 2 x 120Gb hard drives, daily backup to second hard drive, 5 IP addresses, 1200Gb/month data transfer

    TW/KW03
    monthly 365 set up 220


    _________________________________

    USA


    Two 64-bit Intel XeonTM processors at 3.2GHz
    1MB L2 cache
    2GB DDR-2 SDRAM, upgradeable to 12GB
    Two 147GB 10,000RPM Ultra320 SCSI drives
    Hot Swap Drives
    100Mbps Network Connection
    Intel PRO/1000 MT single port Gigabit NIC (at 100Mbps)
    2000GB Data Transfer
    $339.00 / $0.00 setup

    ______________

    not sure if evryone thinks the price diff is so large as I seem to think it is I am non technical and could of course be missing something here, but i can't see the reason to buy British in this market, someone please prove me wrong!!


    Paul

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Amsterdam/Rotterdam, NL
    Posts
    2,085
    British bandwidth is just much more expensive, if you want an affordable solution near to you, choose a solution based in the Netherlands.

    The Netherlands has a great connectivity with the UK (you won't notice much difference in speed between UK and NL. NL prices are really going toward the USA prices, while UK is definitely falling behind.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    458
    Paul/stilesp: Make sure you compare like-for-like. Not many providers do a complete server setup, and not many provide the level of management that some do. In the US, you need to take someone like Xiolink as a comparison. There are indeed some great outfits in the US.

    Apoc: No, UK bandwidth is not necessarily more expensive than US. US bandwidth is typically oversold more than in the UK. UK prices have come down a lot.
    Chris at TDMWeb.com
    Windows & Linux hosting and fully managed dedicated servers with great customer service!
    UK-based but serving the world...

  15. #15
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106
    TDM

    not sure it is fair to compare Xiolink with uk suppliers, if you were you would need to look at energis, easynet, claranet and demon and then the price would go still higher so I guess still 50% less state-side. I think the three i mentioned at the start sagonet, liquidweb and netnation (Canada) all seem good mid sized hosting companies, it appears from what I have read that liquidweb seem to have the best reputation on this board. Sago seem to have graet prices for their scsi atlas range.

    this is all new to me and a learning curve w emust trust whoever we go for "does what it says on the tin" if we get it wrong we could be history before we start!

    thanks for your comments much appreciate it, what do you think of netplan in the uk they seem to have great reputation for speed?

    best regards Paul

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Amsterdam/Rotterdam, NL
    Posts
    2,085
    Originally posted by TDMWeb
    Apoc: No, UK bandwidth is not necessarily more expensive than US. US bandwidth is typically oversold more than in the UK. UK prices have come down a lot.
    That's just not true. If you compare (non oversold) US bandwidth with UK bandwidth of the exact same quality you will see that UK bandwidth is significantly more expensive.

    UK bandwidth has come down, but it's nowhere near US/NL prices.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    458
    Paul,

    Originally posted by stilesp
    [B]TDM
    not sure it is fair to compare Xiolink with uk suppliers
    The reason for giving Xiolink is the level of support and management they provide, which is significantly more than most. "Managed" can mean just "we turn on automatic OS updates". Just as in the US you can find prices much lower than Xiolink's, but with a lower level of service (which doesn't mean they are "bad" at all -- you should buy the service level you need), so there are plenty of providers in the UK with prices lower than ours, but with a different level of service (caveat as before).

    what do you think of netplan in the uk they seem to have great reputation for speed?
    Haven't come across them. They are in Telehouse, Docklands. There are lots of providers in the Docklands area; performance will be similar for many (as long as they have their network sorted out).

    Be careful when looking at webperf by the way. Many would feel that the results are not entirely representative of reality...
    Chris at TDMWeb.com
    Windows & Linux hosting and fully managed dedicated servers with great customer service!
    UK-based but serving the world...

  18. #18
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106
    Once again thank you TDM thank you. Sadly we are not in the xiolink, rackspace or datapipe league at this stage, we could not justify the cost right now. But you are absolutely right when you say about take what is right for you. I have no tech expertise myself and a totally outsourced dev team (non uk), now although this is a great relationship of three plus years they are not really well placed to totally manage the system when live. I could employ a sys admin but again at this stage do not favour this, better to outsource the management of the server, network and op sys. The difficult part is the SQL I think my current just must manage that along with our core software (i.e. our application) as they have developed it and they know it inside out. If we flew than there could be a time for bringing it in-house or having it managed by the hosting co, then i guess we must get micro specialist MSsql dba's which does push us into datapipe territory. If budget was no barrier I would sign up with datapipe tomorrow.

    One other issue for us is that we do have a period of three months to do some final live beta testing and this means we must keep costs down next 6-9 months.

    Best regards Paul

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    458
    All the best with the business Paul, hope all the pieces come together and it works out well!
    Chris at TDMWeb.com
    Windows & Linux hosting and fully managed dedicated servers with great customer service!
    UK-based but serving the world...

  20. #20
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106
    thanks TDM.

    I assume at some stage in this thread you thought you might be interestet willing and able to supply such managed scsi win2003/mssql servers?

    best regards Paul

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    458
    Drop me an email if you want to talk.
    Chris at TDMWeb.com
    Windows & Linux hosting and fully managed dedicated servers with great customer service!
    UK-based but serving the world...

  22. #22
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106
    hey tdm

    i think we have talked th cows home already, i think you know my needs now better than i do, if you want to make an offer you are more than free to do so, but of course you know my feelings on where the market is ref US v UK and with sago and liquid both with good reputations coming in at $300 pm all in for dual scsi, dual xeon 2 gig ram with blistering networks, including a lump of bwidth and back-up in the case of liquid, we have a problem working with each other as much as i want to buy UK

    if you want to do a quote with any reasons why it would be sensible to pay more to you than to one of these bigger guys i would be happy to think it through.

    once again thank you for coming back

    paul

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    458
    Paul: 'Fraid we can't quote here as it's a non-advertising forum. If you'd like a quote just drop me an email (no need to put any reqts in) and we'd be happy to oblige.
    Chris at TDMWeb.com
    Windows & Linux hosting and fully managed dedicated servers with great customer service!
    UK-based but serving the world...

  24. #24
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    106
    defender hosting

  25. #25
    paul can you mail me re the demo on wednesday please,
    Thanks, Nick.

  26. #26
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    15
    Hello,
    You should also check the uptime of server.
    Silvermoon

  27. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Amsterdam/Rotterdam, NL
    Posts
    2,085
    Quote Originally Posted by IWANTBLUE
    paul can you mail me re the demo on wednesday please,
    Thanks, Nick.
    Do you realize this thread is a year old?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •