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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
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    Slovakia
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    Looking for a host that wouldn't mind getting up to 500mbit ddos attacks

    Hi,

    Our network gets attacked frequently. Last week we received the highest 400mbit attack and datapipe pulled the plug since the attack lasted the whole day.

    We are looking to spend 2-3k, all we need is 1 server /with gigE adapter/ where we would filter the traffic ourselves.

    Please let me know what host could help us.

    regards,
    Paul
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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Seattle
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    We get attacks like that all the time, daily even. IRC I take it?

    You shouldn't have to spend that much for an adequate level of protection, but if you're looking to I know some providers (DataPipe comes to mind) will sell a GigE with 10 megabit at 95th percentile for $4000/mo + $1000/setup. Of course, you'll need space too, so I guess that would come out to more like $5400, at least with DataPipe's managed co-location service.
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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
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    Slovakia
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    Datapipe

    Hi,

    Datapipe pulled the plug, since the attacks were penetrating thru their riverhead ddos protection. We can filter the attacks though it just a matter of bandwidth..and of course the provider has to make sure his uplink provider won't nullroute us.

    We need to agree on flat rate and the host has to have at least 1gig of free capacity.

    Paul
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  4. #4
    I have not used them but they might be what you are looking for http://www.blacklotus.net/servers.html as they do not charge for incoming traffic and has those DDoS protection and stuffs.
    http://www.batchimage.com - Offering Batch Image Processing and TIFF/PDF Software Solutions
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  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Kathmandu, Nepal
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    that is a lot of traffic... i think you need a larger budget. Also, why are you getting such huge DDoS attacks?
    Kevin Ohashi - Founder of ReviewSignal.com - Honest Web Hosting Reviews
    Check out our WordPress Hosting Performance Benchmarks (Updated: Sep 2016), the most comprehensive look at WP performance
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  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
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    Last attack

    Hi,

    The last attack was pretty sophisticated, 1000s of ips involved and repeating just few times a day, so wasn't that easy to track. Paul from former httpd.net helped us with the firewall rules, so we are able to filter it, just need the bandwidth.
    Our standard traffic doesn't exceed 2mbit, since all large content is served from elsewhere.
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  7. #7
    Any reason why DDoS keeps following you ?
    http://www.batchimage.com - Offering Batch Image Processing and TIFF/PDF Software Solutions
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  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
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    Slovakia
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    ddos reason

    Hi,

    First we thought it's our competition, but it seems all template sites are under attack recently. Boxedart gets blasted with 600mbit, not sure about TM, but I am sure they got their problems too.
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  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Seattle
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    To think I actually considered buying transit from DataPipe..

    You could try the "Host Quote" at the top of your screen and see what type of responses you receive.
    Last edited by ddosguru; 06-02-2004 at 08:19 AM.
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  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Slovakia
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    Boxedart

    Hi,

    We do not run Boxedart, but DesignGalaxy.net, DesignLoad.net and ProCartoonz.net. Our attacks are not as large as Boxedarts, but it's the same type of attack from the same source.
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  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Seattle
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    Quite odd. I'm sure your budget is right on key for what you're looking to do though.

    I have not used them but they might be what you are looking for http://www.blacklotus.net/servers.html as they do not charge for incoming traffic and has those DDoS protection and stuffs.
    Those plans would actually entail null routing whichever IP is under fire, a fully filtered solution (as kohashi eluded to) is a bit more expensive.
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  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Kathmandu, Nepal
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    3,937
    strange.... so you have no idea why they are after your template site? I have read about BoxedArt's issues... very strange world I must say.
    Kevin Ohashi - Founder of ReviewSignal.com - Honest Web Hosting Reviews
    Check out our WordPress Hosting Performance Benchmarks (Updated: Sep 2016), the most comprehensive look at WP performance
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  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    Seattle
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    Everyone DDoS's everyone these days, there dosn't have to be a reason for it
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  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Slovakia
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    DDos

    Hi,

    Not sure, we got attacks from the early begin, so almost 2 years.
      0 Not allowed!

  15. #15
    Sounds like a very dangerous business to be in. There has to be a reason why templates and design sites are being singled out and targetted.
    http://www.batchimage.com - Offering Batch Image Processing and TIFF/PDF Software Solutions
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  16. #16
    Usually the DDoS attacks are from competition, you're better to look for some hardware firewall soultion to minimize the effect of DDoS.
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  17. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Seattle
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    nowisph:

    I wish it were that simple, I really do.
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  18. #18

    Re: Last attack

    Originally posted by vilords
    Hi,

    The last attack was pretty sophisticated, 1000s of ips involved and repeating just few times a day, so wasn't that easy to track. Paul from former httpd.net helped us with the firewall rules, so we are able to filter it, just need the bandwidth.
    Our standard traffic doesn't exceed 2mbit, since all large content is served from elsewhere.
    several thousands of connections can generate that amount of traffic? Was it a TCP established, traffic intensive attack? so It can pass through riverhead system?
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  19. #19
    the hardware solution you are referring to is your upstream's m160s. imho, 2-3k won't do it. jeff may disagree, since he seems to be quite keen on signing you, so get in touch with him already =]

    paul
    * Rusko Enterprises LLC - Upgrade to 100% uptime today!
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    call 1-877-MY-RUSKO or paul [at] rusko.us

    dedicated servers, collocation, load balanced and high availability clusters
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  20. #20
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    Seattle
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    nowisph:

    Riverheads are VERY powerful devices. From reading this thread, i'm now left with the impression that DataPipe is slightly fudging on their ability to handle DDoS (or perhaps they decided they didn't want to filter for him anymore regardless of whether or not they could actually handle it).

    In any case, I would definately do a lot of homework before deciding to use DataPipe for anything of that nature, although at one point I was considering using them for pull transit and adding them to our BGP

    Bottom line, theres not much that is going to pass through a Riverhead, we're talking about a $40,000 device which is highly regarded as one of, if not the best, DDoS firewall on the market. ICMP, UDP, TCP handshakes -- dosn't matter, as long as the bandwidth is there.

    The question remains, does DataPipe really have the bandwidth or were they simply cutting him off their network for other reasons (eg. they wern't making enough profit for the type of DDoS they were handling?)
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  21. #21
    So only large provider like Verio, level3, UUNet can handle such large-scale attack without interrupting the business?
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  22. #22
    Join Date
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    Seattle
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    No, not at all. Smaller providers can as well, just not really small ones. If you have a GigE, the appropriate firewall solution, and a high end core switch you're good to go. (leaving out the minor details).
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  23. #23
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Slovakia
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    27

    Datapipe

    Hi,

    Yes, I guess they unplugged us because it wasn't worth it. We required lot of assistance, since they didn't want us to handle the firewalls ourselves.
    Thant's why this time we want to handle it ourselves.
      0 Not allowed!

  24. #24

    Re: Datapipe

    Originally posted by vilords
    Hi,

    Yes, I guess they unplugged us because it wasn't worth it. We required lot of assistance, since they didn't want us to handle the firewalls ourselves.
    Thant's why this time we want to handle it ourselves.
    have you tried Rackspace.com?
    P4HOST.COM -- Specialize in quality Web Hosting solutions.
    Affordable -- Prices are very comparative
    Reliable -- Very low load average guaranteed. 60 day money back. Fast Support --Support Forum -- Providing hosting since 2003
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  25. #25

    Re: Datapipe

    Originally posted by vilords
    Hi,

    Yes, I guess they unplugged us because it wasn't worth it. We required lot of assistance, since they didn't want us to handle the firewalls ourselves.
    Thant's why this time we want to handle it ourselves.
    I think you should call each ISP who generate the attack, so the traffic won't keep flowing to your provider?
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  26. #26
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Atlanta
    Posts
    4,419
    go with akamai - you will be fine
    Dedicated Servers
    WWW.NETDEPOT.COM
    Since 2000
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  27. #27
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Slovakia
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    27

    Rackspace

    HI,

    I don't think they would help us. They use riverhead + 2 additional ddos solutions...I am sure the same as with datapipe would happen here.
    We need someone smaller with at least 1gig bandwidth /600meg free/ who could arrange stuff how we want it.
    Datapipe or Rackspace would never plug us directly to gigE port and let us handle the stuff ourselves.
      0 Not allowed!

  28. #28
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Seattle
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    I concur, Rackspace is not going to deal with the DDoS (I had a personal server there a while back).
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  29. #29
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Slovakia
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    27

    Akamai

    Hi,

    Of course we would be, but it would cost us around 10k per day.
    We have been there.

    They do not filter, they serve all the traffic.
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  30. #30
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    2,780
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  31. #31
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Slovakia
    Posts
    27

    FW

    Hi,

    We know how to filter it...we just need the B/W, that's all...we don't need fancy firewall solutions.
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  32. #32
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Seattle
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    Mazo Enforcer? That one is new to me...
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  33. #33
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Seattle
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    A quick Google search for "Mazo Enforcer" reveals nothing but Spanish language web sites appearantly discussing the Magic: The Gathering card game. What are they gonna go, lay down some Mana and cast a Sorcery?
      0 Not allowed!

  34. #34
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    2,780
      0 Not allowed!

  35. #35
    Why not have a distributed cluster setup.
    Instead of having 1 provide ditribute the servers across the US/UK
    so 1 DC would not receive all the traffic this would avoid having your server unplugged.

    This would take some planning but would prove more scalable in time.

    As the attacks increase you can ad some of the hardware DDoS devices or add some more locations.
    Datums Internet Solutions, LLC
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  36. #36
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Slovakia
    Posts
    27

    DNS Cluster

    Hi,

    Yes, we were thinking of it..but it's about the casholla.

    If we agree with 2 providers and pay them let's say 1.5k per month each, it would be ok with us..not sure if would be interesting anymore for the provider.
      0 Not allowed!

  37. #37
    Originally posted by DeathNova
    I concur, Rackspace is not going to deal with the DDoS (I had a personal server there a while back).
    I remember they have two options for their customers, null-route their servers or block the traffic through riverhead system.

    In real cases they just null-route it? riverhead protection is only for large client? just wondering...
      0 Not allowed!

  38. #38
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Slovakia
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    27

    Riverhead

    No,

    If you pay 350usd per month they will put you behind Riverhead, but if the attack is brute..then they'll plug you off. If the attack takes whole day or so..and is at least 200-300mbit

    But for smaller attacks it's a very good solution for that money
      0 Not allowed!

  39. #39
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
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    A Riverhead appliance serves two purposes for most providers that use it (which is only a few at this point):

    - To mitigate small DDoS attacks to prevent the end user from having to deal with them.

    - To mitigate large DDoS attacks only for those customers that want to pay serious cash for the bandwidth and labor thats being used.
      0 Not allowed!

  40. #40
    I think you should first evaluate the worth of "Mitigating" a DDoS
    I would not go with 1 or 2 DC I was think more like 6.
    Spread your network across the US.

    What are you in the business of ? Is it 1 website that is getting attacked?
    Datums Internet Solutions, LLC
    Systems Engineering & Managed Hosting Services
    Complex Hosting Consultants
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