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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    85

    15minuteservers (NAC) og Savvis? - East coast ded. server recommendation

    I have searched the forums, but found very little first-hand information on 15minuteservers from their own customers. I find their solutions interesting, but I haven't heard much of them. I have also gotten an offer renting a dedicated from a guy who's colocating in Savvis (previouslky C&W) in the NJ area. Server specs are mostly the same, but the Savvis offer is more expensive, around $70/mo.

    I don't mind paying more for stability, but if quality is good no matter which I choose, I will go with the cheaper one. So, any experience/recommendations/views on this? Thanks

    EDIT: There is one thing that does bother me with 15minuteservers, and that is the following paragraph in their TOS:
    IMPORTANT NOTICE:

    BEGINNING IMMEDIATELY, anyone hosting websites or services on their server that support spammers or cause any of our IP space to be listed in any of the various Spam Databases will have their server immediately removed from our network. The server will not be reconnected until such time that you agree to remove ANY and ALL traces of the offending material immediately upon reconnection and agree to allow us access to the server to confirm that all material has been COMPLETELY removed. Severe violations may result in immediate and permanent removal of the server from our network without notice to the customer. Any server guilty of a second violation WILL be immediately and permanently removed from our network without notice.
    From experience I know that there may be incidents where spamming may occour from ones server due to insecure scripts hosted on it (formmail etc). It's almost impossible to be 100% protected against such episodes. To me, the above seems a bit strict. Even though I fully understand the need to take spam problems seriously, taking a server offline could easily cause severe economical problems or put a small hosting company out of business.
    Last edited by polarbear; 04-20-2004 at 04:33 PM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    933
    NAC is more bark then bite. They are really strict, but they aren't as mean as it seems. They are very strict though. We had some problems with them and IRC applets (not actually IRC just applets to run irc from a users computer). I would suggest you look somewhere else if you think its going to be a problem. The only thing I like about NAC is their Good Hardware replacement, and great speedy network. It all comes at a price though...

    As far as the other guy thing goes, I have found the I-know-a-guy things to turn out better then you expect. Look more into that.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    5,512
    $70 for Savvis is pretty decent. They must have at least a 45 megabit commit.

    Yes, NAC is quite strict. Their network is excellent, but we were forced to leave them some years ago due to disagreements with policy (other issues, not relating to spam.)

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    85
    Hello guys, and thanks for the feedback. I guess I am most worried about how their practise their policies. As for spam, that can happen to any webhost (and probably will, sooner or later).

    As for Savvis, it's not $70, but $70 more than NAC, in this case for a P4 single processor with identical specs. I still don't find the pricing unreasonable.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    42
    It shouldn't bother you that they want to stay out of the XBL and other lists. It's sort of like renting an apartment...they don't want you to burn things down and ruin things for everyone else.

    If you're a responsible and attentive host, it isn't a concern. Don't worry about it, and make sure you keep good contact info on your clients. The more you know about them, the less likely they are to mess with you. Verify their contact information, and make your policy about no spam clear. If they realize you mean business, they won't try and take advantage.

    Close the server to an open relay, and don't allow mail to be sent from PHP scripts and the like. That will stamp out 99.99% of chances of someone using you to send spam.

    The XBL list is a three strikes list. That is, it's pretty darn hard to get on it unless you're a flagrant SPAM abuser. So, I wouldn't worry about it. You just have to understand that a huge ISP like NAC has to protect themselves.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
    Posts
    4,974
    I would go with NAC due to the fact that they are 24/7 manned, compared to A GUY who will COLO in someone's facility.

    If you are keen in the latter option, consider:

    1. do you have access to DC (call in for some problem, it could be unmanaged but you could get first hand info at the soonest.
    2. how long would the guy take to replace your hardware.
    3. mail NAC about that policy, they might explain to you better.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    933
    Actually, if they have a phone number, try doing what UUN just said but call. You always get a better responce when calling instead of emailing.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Parsippany, NJ
    Posts
    40

    Offical response from NAC...

    Some notes on this thread...

    In regards to the policy regarding disconnection because of SPAM, etc. This is primarily to address people who have a continual issue with SPAM, and don't address it. We are realists, and understand the plight of the webhost, etc. What we care about is that if you have a SPAM issue, and it is NOT FIXED IN A REASONABLE/TIMELY fashion, we will take measures needed to protect ourselves and our network. If you are good about it, you will not catch our attention.

    In regards to being 'strict', also, if you are a DOS magnet, we don't want you in our datacenter. Meaning that, if you are going to be the target of many DOS attacks, NAC is not a place for you.

    NAC's operations center is 24 x 7, fully staffed, on-site -- not out of the country.
    Alex Rubenstein, AR97, K2AHR, [email protected], latency, Al Reuben
    Net Access Corporation, 800-NET-ME-36, http://www.nac.net http://www.15minuteservers.com

    Once you go NAC, you never go back!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    New York, NY
    Posts
    376

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    42
    I don't work for NAC, but I can agree with the above sentiment.

    All of my dealings with NAC have been resoundingly positive. I would highly recommend them for dedicated servers and/or co-location. You won't regret it.

    Just be an attentive administrator. Having a dedicated server isn't a game.

  11. #11
    We've been with 15minuteservers/NAC for about a month now. Just got my bill for the 2nd month yesterday actually, lol. Anyway... service, uptime, and everything else is excellent. No complaints here.

    I had actually PM'd Alex regarding the spam section of the TOS and his response (similar to the one posted above) reassured me.

    Good luck with whomever u choose.
    Michael @ Qualserv Networks
    www.qualserv.net - quality hosting since 1998!

    Bringing Web Hosting to a Personal Level

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    85
    Thanks guys for what I've just read, NAC seems like the logical choice. Especially appreciate the official response from NAC placed by arubenstein. It's not that my company don't address spam issues as high priority issues (we've had two of them during the last two years, both handled within six hours), but just the fact that internet is a very insecure place to do business and in the event of something like this happening, it's an absolute necessity to be sure that the DC is on our side, not against us, while handling the problem.

    I should add that the spam issue has affected one box twice, but my companys other four boxes has never been affected. For what it's worth

    Asynja: All managing is taken very seriously. That's why it's oursourced to a reputable company

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Posts
    1,044
    Uptime and quality is excellent from both.
    ReliableServers.com
    Dedicated Servers | Colocation | Cloud Servers | CDN
    1000 Gbps Network | New Jersey DataCenter
    973-849-0535

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    257
    Yes NAC is great no complaints here at all!
    eXeGaming : Professional Gaming Organization

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    2,780
    I'll take Savvis over NAC. The staff on site and C and W DC are excellent. Network is very strong to start, and their staff actually does knows much more than just hitting a reboot button.

  16. #16
    Originally posted by Mfjp
    I'll take Savvis over NAC. The staff on site and C and W DC are excellent. Network is very strong to start, and their staff actually does knows much more than just hitting a reboot button.
    fom personal experience, the noc techs at nac know their stuff. i can attest to same at CW.

    paul
    * Rusko Enterprises LLC - Upgrade to 100% uptime today!
    * Premium NYC collocation and custom dedicated servers
    call 1-877-MY-RUSKO or paul [at] rusko.us

    dedicated servers, collocation, load balanced and high availability clusters

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