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04-03-2004, 07:55 PM #1Junior Guru Wannabe
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Question about types of programmings
I know nothing about programming, but if say,just an example, you wanted to create an application like napster..what type is it? does it need a PHP expert? mysql...or what type of programmer and language would it need? I just need to create an application and need to know where and for who to look, thanks.
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04-03-2004, 08:39 PM #2Junior Guru Wannabe
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Napster is a windows application. It's an "exe" executable that runs on a client computer. It's written in something like C or C++ (or maybe Delphi or VB, but these are less common for efficient apps)
PHP is an HTML scripting langauge. It allows you to add dynamic programming to a web page or web-based application. It cannot exist outside of a browser.
If you want something to run in Windows, outside of a browser, you'll need something like the 4 languages listed first.
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04-03-2004, 11:45 PM #3Web Hosting Master
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Yeah they are most likely in C or C++
They use databases, just not mysql.webmaster A T 420th.com
What is my Itunes playing? Visit 420th.com/nowplaying.jsp to find out.
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04-04-2004, 04:14 AM #4Web Hosting Master
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To create an application, you need to find out what environment you'll be deploying it on.
For example, if you are creating a console Linux/Unix application, you might consider C++/C with ncurses.
For a Linux/Unix X-based application, you might look at C++ with QT or GTK bindings.
If you want to create an application that runs on both Linux and Windows, consider Java and its Swing (or the new SWT toolkit) for a consistent look and feel across platforms.
If you are developing PURELY for Windows, C# (or maybe VB.NET) is the way to go. It will run best on Windows.
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04-04-2004, 11:09 AM #5Web Hosting Master
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Originally posted by brianbloom
PHP is an HTML scripting langauge. It allows you to add dynamic programming to a web page or web-based application. It cannot exist outside of a browser.
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04-04-2004, 12:21 PM #6Junior Guru Wannabe
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Programing
Brenden, or any other experts interested in creating an application? can you create a program that can interact with google,yahoo, half.com or ebay and get information from these sites and present them in its own window, with some added bells and whistles? it would be a PHP lang. right?
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04-04-2004, 02:10 PM #7Web Hosting Master
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Most any language with network support could do that. PHP would work if you wanted it web based or command line, but PHP is not the best for GUI programs (AFAIK, maybe it is possible to write GUI programs in PHP).
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04-05-2004, 07:00 AM #8Junior Guru Wannabe
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(or maybe Delphi or VB, but these are less common for efficient apps)
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04-05-2004, 08:57 AM #9Web Hosting Master
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Originally posted by brendandonhu
Most any language with network support could do that. PHP would work if you wanted it web based or command line, but PHP is not the best for GUI programs (AFAIK, maybe it is possible to write GUI programs in PHP).
I certainly wouldn't describe PHP as an HTML scripting language because it simply isn't. HTML doesn't even have to come into it. The PHP group describe it as a general-purpose scripting language especially suited for web development and can by embedded into HTML
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04-05-2004, 09:33 AM #10WHT Addict
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Last time I checked Delphi used the Pascal syntax but that was a long time ago. I didn't know it was a language in itself.
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04-05-2004, 09:57 AM #11Disabled
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delphi is pascal.
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04-05-2004, 12:54 PM #12Junior Guru Wannabe
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Originally posted by leight
Before you slate a language, make sure you get your facts right. VB, yea, utter sh*te, but Delphi is quite comparable to a C/C++ program on a win32 platform (speaking from an efficiency point of view), plus you have the far quicker compile times with delphi apps, and superior database integration from the offset.
I said "less common for efficient apps".
Delphi = efficient, but less common than C/C++
VB = more common, but not efficient.
Trust me, I'm not "slating" Delphi. I love Delphi and have programmed in it for years. But if you are looking at your average app that you downloaded off the net, odds are not that great that it was written in Delphi. And if it's not an efficient app, it's probably written in VB.
And to respond to Jake and unlucky1, Delphi technically uses "object pascal", an object-oriented extension of the original langauge. The syntax is the same as "plain" pascal since it's basically a subset of Object Pascal.
And Scuzzy, many of the major sites offer APIs (application programming interfaces) where they basically publish "calls" into their systems that you can make from your program to retrieve data. It's easier and cleaner than "screen scraping" (visiting a web page and parsing it looking for specific content). You might hear the "SOAP" protocol get mentioned as its one of the techniques used for this.
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04-05-2004, 12:59 PM #13Junior Guru Wannabe
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Originally posted by Rich2k
I certainly wouldn't describe PHP as an HTML scripting language because it simply isn't. HTML doesn't even have to come into it. The PHP group describe it as a general-purpose scripting language especially suited for web development and can by embedded into HTML
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04-05-2004, 04:01 PM #14Web Hosting Master
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That's how it was originally designed but PHP bears very little resemblence to the original PHP1.x line.
Like all good things it evolves. and as I mentioned above, PHP doesn't actually have to come into contact with HTML at any time at all even in a web environment
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04-05-2004, 10:05 PM #15Junior Guru Wannabe
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Programs
Ok, after reading what you all said I think I will give up on what language for what application, at least one of you tell me where to go to have them create an application from scratch for me with any type of language they see fit. Please just give me couple of wbesite with reputation you can trust.
Thanks
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04-05-2004, 11:59 PM #16Junior Guru Wannabe
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Scuzzy, I'll repeat what I said earlier: if you want it to run in a browser, PHP is a fine language to use. Your server can connect to the various sites you mentioned and either "scrape" the data from the http (web) output, or you can investigate calling APIs to each site which should make for cleaner code than the scraping idea, but then not all sites offer a direct "doorway" into their content.
Delphi is a great language if you want to make a standalone windows application. As easy to use as Visual Basic but nowhere near as kludgey. But it's not free. You can buy Delphi 7 Personal Edition for around $90 or so. That version also won't have all the networking widgets you need out of the box, but the best set of these is free anyway: ICS from http://www.overbyte.be/frame_index.html I've written many network apps using these components and they make it easy (they include example apps for most functions).
Let me shy you away from C or C++ for your first language. These are pretty unforgiving and require a good grounding in programming before I can recommend anyone use them. Yes, they give the best performance, but they are also somewhat frustrating to debug.
Java has more networking functionality built into it and might provide the best overall solution (since you can get it for free, there's a fair amount of example code out there, and it should do what you need) But making GUIs with Java is significantly harder than either Delphi or VB (which are truly drag-n-drop in that respect)
or plain HTML.
So my final answer again comes back to suggesting either delphi (if you want a windows app) or php if you want a browser app. If you pick the Delphi route, I recommend Cantu's "Mastering Delphi" books. With PHP you can probably get by with the php website which has tons of reference material. (http://www.php.net/manual/en/) For quick and dirty, those will be top bets. For grace and sophistication, later you can upgrade to a more elegant language...
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04-06-2004, 04:44 AM #17Web Hosting Master
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You can program good and highly complex, fast software in PHP, but granted it's also very easy to write quick and dirty scripts in it too
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04-06-2004, 07:19 PM #18Junior Guru Wannabe
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Brian
Thank you Brian for your complete and helpful respond. I am not going to write the program myself, now that we decided for delphi or php , I needed a reputable and affordable company that would create the program and tailor it the way I need, a custom made application. If you have any suggestions on that too please advise.
Regards
Bob
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04-06-2004, 07:28 PM #19Web Hosting Evangelist
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OT: C# is only good for the latest Windows version, being 2000 and XP. I will question if C# runs better on Windows NT or the 9x series than C/C++.
Last edited by mno; 04-06-2004 at 07:31 PM.
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04-08-2004, 07:39 AM #20Junior Guru Wannabe
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OT: C# is only good for the latest Windows version, being 2000 and XP. I will question if C# runs better on Windows NT or the 9x series than C/C++.
C# for UNIX
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04-08-2004, 10:05 AM #21Web Hosting Master
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With any .NET application -- you need to install the .NET runtime files -- which can take up a lot of room.
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04-08-2004, 11:05 AM #22WHT Addict
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Delphi is an awesome programming language.
It has fast executable, can be compile on Linux if you use CLX classes.
It also have the ease of use of VB.
Syntax is ****, but well it's the results that count.
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04-08-2004, 12:28 PM #23Junior Guru Wannabe
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Re: Brian
Originally posted by Scuzzy
I am not going to write the program myself, now that we decided for delphi or php , I needed a reputable and affordable company that would create the program and tailor it the way I need, a custom made application. If you have any suggestions on that too please advise.
Regards
Bob
You might try running an ad somewhere, like ComputerBits (a free tabloid that serves Oregon and Arizona, see http://computerbits.com/dept/classifieds.html) or maybe something local to where you are. I think the litmus test for someone I'd trust is a programmer who can show me an attractive app that he's already designed and can demonstrate that he/she coded it (not just one of a team of like 12 or something). If their prior work impresses you, they can probably be trusted to do it again.
But I would point out that if you're contracting this out, most of the language suggestions I and others have made are kinda moot. My recommendations were for a programming newbie just starting out. If you're hiring an experienced developer, then pretty much any language they are competent in should suffice.
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05-04-2004, 12:31 PM #24New Member
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Easy application development
Something you might try is a graphical development environment like Skyway Builder from Skyway Software, Inc. You draw the process and logic graphically. Then Builder produces Java code, compiles it, and deploys it on the application server. But you don't have to know Java to build useful applications with it.
There is a free download available for a "Personal Edition". It's worth a look.