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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Mi
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    208

    Too spend or not too spend...the 5000 dollar question

    HI, I was looking into getting subtilize.com to do my site design. after looking at some of the work they have done for nexuswebs and hostrocket they seem to have what i am looking for, but the cost for the site i wanted to be built that would focus on reselling dedicated servers through nocster aswell as my current virtual hosting biz is going to run me around 5000 to get it done.

    My question is do you think it is better to get the site built or put this money in something like advertising? Does having a nice site really mean alot?

    I would really like to hear from some of the older hosters here and maybe Nexdog since he has a site by them....

    Thanks
    www.saveserver.com<-- Ask me about low cost dedicated servers
    AIM=cooltjn1

  2. #2
    Join Date
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    Australia
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    I don't think you'd get much from them for 5k.
    Last edited by Aussie Bob; 03-23-2004 at 03:23 AM.
    WLVPN.com NetProtect owned White Label VPN provider
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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
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    Mi
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    HI, Bob

    They actually quoted me less for what i asked for but said it would be extra for some other development i was looking for. so i figured about a 1000 base on the current quote.
    www.saveserver.com<-- Ask me about low cost dedicated servers
    AIM=cooltjn1

  4. #4
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    I thought Ceonex.com built Hostrocket and HostNexus. I thought you were referring to Ceonex, in regards to building your site.
    WLVPN.com NetProtect owned White Label VPN provider
    Increase your hosting profits by adding VPN to your product line up

  5. #5
    Join Date
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    Mi
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    Yeah I guess they merged. I emailed subtilize.com for a quote and Ceonex replied.

    Thanks
    www.saveserver.com<-- Ask me about low cost dedicated servers
    AIM=cooltjn1

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Seattle
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    You would be better off getting a templatemonster.com template and buying the exclusive rights to it IMO.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Chicago
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    1,135
    Ceonix's work is amazing. And a good design is all about credibility.

    If you are willing to invest in your site then your potential clients will see
    this and invest in you.

    Keep in mind, there are many other designers in the world. Shop around
    a bit, there may be some designers willing to do similar, or equally good
    but different-styled work for a better price.

    Regardless, best wishes.

    Dan
    ---
    Dan Ushman
    Co-founder & CMO
    SingleHop, Inc.

  8. #8
    Just out of curiosity how did Ceonix become so popular with hosting companies?

    Did their degin with Modern Bill push this or were they well known before?
    Primal Blue Software, Inc.
    primalblue.com

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
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    Australia
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    Originally posted by Primal Blue
    Just out of curiosity how did Ceonix become so popular with hosting companies?

    Probably just word of mouth through communities such as WHT. They do work for one host, and other hosts like the design etc . . . etc.
    WLVPN.com NetProtect owned White Label VPN provider
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  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Chicago
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    Linking yourself at the bottom of all the sites you design is a very
    good way to promote yourself in an industry like hosting. Name a
    single host that has not heard of them by clicking their link at the
    bottom of HostRocket or Dinix or someone else they designed. They
    are not just designers, but excellent marketers.

    Time to goto bed
    ---
    Dan Ushman
    Co-founder & CMO
    SingleHop, Inc.

  11. #11
    Join Date
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    Location
    Mi
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    I really have never heard of them before but have visited subtilize before and seen post about them here quite a bit.


    Thanks guys for your feedback. i was acutally just browsing Ceonex.com and they have done some really nice work.

    Dan do you have any suggestions of companies to take a look at that would be comparable to Ceonex.com.
    www.saveserver.com<-- Ask me about low cost dedicated servers
    AIM=cooltjn1

  12. #12
    Their site looks really cool!

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
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    Above The Clouds
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    Ceonex gained popularity with webhosts after the original HostRocket design about two and a half years ago. Of course they were known as PixelBrick back then.

    Ceonex won't do a site for below $20k but PixelBrick is starting up again to provide great work at a more affordable rate (starting at $5,000). They are currently working on a new brand for us which should be launched in April.

    Subtilize Media has done alot of work for us. Andrei did NexusPortal and then NexusWebs and he has also tweaked parts of the HostNexus site. I love working with him on projects but it looks like he is not accepting anymore work as he now has other very large and important commitments.

    There is a relationship between Andrei of Subtilize and Ceonex but I'm not at liberty to discuss that at the moment.
    Laurence Flynn @ HostNEXUS.com
    Managed WordPress Hosting Solutions
    Focused on speed. Obsessed with security.

  14. #14
    Originally posted by NexDog
    Ceonex gained popularity with webhosts after the original HostRocket design about two and a half years ago. Of course they were known as PixelBrick back then.

    Ceonex won't do a site for below $20k but PixelBrick is starting up again to provide great work at a more affordable rate (starting at $5,000). They are currently working on a new brand for us which should be launched in April.

    Subtilize Media has done alot of work for us. Andrei did NexusPortal and then NexusWebs and he has also tweaked parts of the HostNexus site. I love working with him on projects but it looks like he is not accepting anymore work as he now has other very large and important commitments.

    There is a relationship between Andrei of Subtilize and Ceonex but I'm not at liberty to discuss that at the moment.
    NexDog,

    Was adding the Ceonex link to your website part of the deal, something standard, or you just being a good guy?
    Primal Blue Software, Inc.
    primalblue.com

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    New York
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    55
    It should be noted that Pixelbrick offers entry-level solutions from 4-5k, whereas full-service Ceonex solutions start at 10-15k. This is not to say that an entry-level Pixelbrick solution is of inferior quality, it simply does not include many of the features which increase price such as high-impact flash presentations which incoporate external motion graphics effects created in AfterEffects, Combustion, 3D Studim, etc., copy writing/marketing strategy, product develpment and control panel customization, backend development, etc.

    All Ceonex work adheres to the same standards of exceptional quality, the difference in price lies only in the scope of features provided. You cannot get a 100+ page site with 5-10 unique flash presentations, custom copy writing, custom control panel development, etc (i.e. HostRocket or DINIX) for 5k from Ceonex, Pixelbrick or anywhere else, but you can get a site that is designed to the same industry-leading standards that just doesn't include a lot of those extras.

    Such solutions are perfect for companies not looking to spend 10k+ on a web presence who still want famous, highly-effective, sales-increasing design work from the Ceonex/Pixelbrick team.

  16. #16
    A lot of designers have in their contracts the right to have a credit link at the bottom of their page.

    I am not sure it this is the case with Ceonix, but it appears to be.
    "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" -- Ben Franklin
    Twice Tied Laces

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Australia (Crikey)
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    lol, I am getting my hosting website designed including the following:

    1. Flash elements
    2. WHMAP intergration
    3. Logo designed
    4. Forum skinned to match rest of site

    The site that will be made for me is going to cost around $1500, but I'm getting it for free, thats right FREE!

    The designer is just starting out (he has done some very good work and has even designed a website for (I think) a GNAX division.

    I think $5000 is a lot to spend, pay less for the design, and put say $2500 into advertising, you will get more customers that way

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Posts
    542
    I looked at hostrocket and thought it was another monstertemplate.com site.

    I wouldn't pay that kind of money for a site that looks like the generic hosting site templates.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    55
    Spiv,

    HostRocket only has elements similar to a TemplateMonster site because TemplateMonster designers shamelessly rip and copy work from Ceonex designs. They have been doing it for years.

    It should also be pointed out that a lot more than just design goes into a high-level Ceonex solution such as HostRocket. Sure TemplateMonster can give you a poor rip off that other people on the web are using, but they can't give you the advertising strategy, backend functionality, industry analysis, copywriting, or even overall quality and consistency of design that Ceonex can. And those are the things that will make you money.

  20. #20

    STOP

    hostrocket, looks like mastertemplate template, i think that i have see one just like that.

    Find a less expensive work or buy a template and do it yourself.

    5000 $ its lot of money, just for the design ?

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    55
    sergiorocha,

    It's not just design, my friend. Carefully read my posts and you'll see that explained.

    Also, any templates you see that look like reputable web designs are in just about every case copied or even have elements directly ripped. So the comparisson should be "wow that template sure looks like a rip off of HostRocket", not "wow HostRocket sure looks like this $10 template I found".

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Azaloth
    HostRocket only has elements similar to a Template Monster site because Template Monster designers shamelessly rip and copy work from Ceonex designs. They have been doing it for years.
    Without getting into a who ripped who debate, there are some past/present designers from Ceonex that moonlight by creating templates for Template Monster. I think that could explain some similarities between some of the TM templates and a few of the Ceonex designs. Designers all have their own identifiable styles. That's why it's so easy to pick out a Ceonex design. It's only logical to understand that if one of those same designers does work for another company the designs will have similar elements. Sure it's ok to question why two sites have similarities, but to jump straight to the conclusion that one is ripped simply because the other site is a Ceonex design is ridiculous. In fact it could even be the other way around, Ceonex was using someone else's copyrighted music in their *unique* designs at one point. Ask ModernBill about that...

    As for the $5000.00 question;

    The most important aspect of any web hosting business is the clients, followed closely by the provision of services that those clients pay for. Your first priority should be to make certain that you offer the best services you can for the market you are targeting. Once the services are in place and supported, you need to obtain clients. The question becomes this; what is the most cost effective way to obtain clients?

    I highly doubt that a $5000 web design is anywhere near the top of the list. Our conversion rate is absurdly high, the reason is simply that visitors going to our site are not doing so to have a look around, they are going to sign up. In most cases they have already spoken to someone here and have decided to use our services. This is accomplished by using local advertising and it is much more cost efficient than simply sinking large sums of cash into designs and online advertising in my opinion.

    At the point where we had our most extensive online advertising campaigns going, we also had the largest number of accounts failing our fraud/spammer reviews and our conversion rate dropped to a ridiculously low number.

    For some people starting out, sinking thousands of dollars into online advertising and flashy site designs works for them. For us, we would rather follow Pair.com's example. They grew to be one of the oldest and most reputable hosts out there with one of the most *un-trendy* sites there is. (No offense Pair, the new site is nice..). we'll grow slow and steady without sinking thousands of dollars into something clients won't even look at after they become clients. We would rather spend the money on services, resources and local advertising.

    My two cents worth....
    Last edited by Mark_YH; 03-24-2004 at 01:15 PM.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Posts
    1,227
    I've heard insider details that some of the designs from Ceonex was going for around $3000 or lower. Apparently they give you a 'real' quote and also a quote you can use to tell others.

    E.g. "To design you website it cost $3000".
    Everyone else: "Ceonex designed my site for $20,000."

    It benefits both companies. The host company gets a better reputation for spending such a large amount on their web site, the design company gets a good reputation for being a high class quality design firm.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Boston, MA
    Posts
    21
    In Boston going to any reputable company and asking for an impressive site design along with lots of content and back-end work will cost significantly more than $3,000. This amont would pay for just the first week's development time. There's often so much involved with a web site that people just don't realize.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Above The Clouds
    Posts
    7,223
    Originally posted by universal2001


    E.g. "To design you website it cost $3000".
    Everyone else: "Ceonex designed my site for $20,000."
    It's more like:

    E.g. "To design you website it cost $20000".
    Everyone else: "Ceonex designed my site for $50,000."
    Laurence Flynn @ HostNEXUS.com
    Managed WordPress Hosting Solutions
    Focused on speed. Obsessed with security.

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