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  1. #1

    Hosting Customer Black List

    Hi,

    As all here know, anyone with a grudge can go onto WHT and slam a hosting company regardless of the truth or anything else vaguely related to the service that was actually rendered.

    I just spent the last hour defending ourselves in WHT from a customer who first bullied us into giving him a complete refund regardless that he did not deserve one & now is trying to extort additional funds to make him go away (he has done this to several hosting companies).

    What I am proposing is a forum where hosting companies can post warnings about customers who defraud, defame, or undertake malicious attacks on hosting companies so that reputable hosting companies are forewarned of these individuals (this particular customer has cost us $100s in lost time, etc).

    Just a suggestion but I am tired of wasting time with customers who have gone from one host to another causing havoc. I am sure there are other hosting companies that feel the same.

    Thank you.
    Curtis

  2. #2

    Not interested

    As I would never divulge information on a customer publicly regardless of the circumstances, I don't see any professional hosting company having an interest in so doing.

    Yes, the case you refer to is disgraceful. However, frankly, I see your response to his posts as reflecting more negatively on your company than the posts themselves.

    So, no, I will not be a part of such a black list. Also, I would suggest any involved hire their attorney now, as you will need one, because someone will take you to court over such a list.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    387
    As all here know, anyone with a grudge can go onto WHT and slam a hosting company regardless of the truth or anything else vaguely related to the service that was actually rendered.

    Note that when other people are searching for hosting companys there first stop is not always webhosting talk.

    I just spent the last hour defending ourselves in WHT from a customer who first bullied us into giving him a complete refund regardless that he did not deserve one & now is trying to extort additional funds to make him go away (he has done this to several hosting companies).

    What I am proposing is a forum where hosting companies can post warnings about customers who defraud, defame, or undertake malicious attacks on hosting companies so that reputable hosting companies are forewarned of these individuals (this particular customer has cost us $100s in lost time, etc).
    Posting customer information whether they defraud'ed you or not is illegal and if you have a privacy policy on your website im sure it says you do not share there information.IMO you should of just told him "i dont care go post as you please".When you run a bussiness you should always be prepared to lose money on some customers that think things should be the way they want them.

  4. #4

    You are right!

    Thank you to both of you - and you are right but these nut cases are a real nuisance - he kept bugging everyone here on the phone and via LiveChat - we finally blocked his IP.

    BTW, I would wonder what HS reaction would have been to the libelous comments made by this person.

    Again, thank you especially for reminding me that no matter what the character of an ex-customer and that they are free to post anything they feel like here on WHT, their privacy is guaranteed.

    Still it would be nice if these people were not able to foist themselves on the next unsuspecting webhost.

    Curtis

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    429
    I'm not sure that a black list for customers who just give a host grief is a good idea, partly for reasons of confidentiality as listed by the poster above. If the customer has not broken the law then his privacy should be protected.

    However, a black list for fraud is a different matter. A list of names, addresses, passwords, credit card numbers and other details that have been used in fraudulent transactions would be useful. I'm not sure how practical it would be to create such a thing, but I would guess that it's legal.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Leesburg, VA
    Posts
    3,209

    Re: You are right!

    Originally posted by ccurtis

    BTW, I would wonder what HS reaction would have been to the libelous comments made by this person.
    You mean like this thread :

    http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showth...hreadid=170081

    Rackshack gets beat up on this forum all time, and a lot of untrue things are said about them. It is very rare that HS does anything, and we are rarely asked by RS staff to close a RS-bashing thread.

    Unfortunately, it is a part of life on the Internet that people are going to beat up companies and everyone around here knows it. How the hosting company responds is usually a sign of their level of quality.

  7. #7

    You guess?

    However, a black list for fraud is a different matter. A list of names, addresses, passwords, credit card numbers and other details that have been used in fraudulent transactions would be useful. I'm not sure how practical it would be to create such a thing, but I would guess that it's legal.
    Guess again! Just a few of the reasons you shouldn't guess about something like that...

    1-Privacy Policy Violations
    2-Violations of Credit Card Agreement
    3-Fraud is a serious charge...if you can't prove it, you could encounter major problems. If they haven't been convicted, it is not a terminology you should really use.
    4-You may be posting the wrong information. Think about it. Do most commit credit card fraud using their own card? No. They use stolen information or cards, so you could be posting information on the innocent person who was as much a victim as you.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Ottawa
    Posts
    959
    Posting the information is a violation of a number of principles I hold to dear to me . However I what about this:
    We create an API , you can send the information to a central server , everything is stored in a one way hash similiar to that of passwords , and if there is a match it returns a warning , based on the number of matches.
    Any one with me on this idea?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    429

    Re: You guess?

    Originally posted by Incognito
    Guess again! Just a few of the reasons you shouldn't guess about something like that...

    1-Privacy Policy Violations
    2-Violations of Credit Card Agreement
    3-Fraud is a serious charge...if you can't prove it, you could encounter major problems. If they haven't been convicted, it is not a terminology you should really use.
    4-You may be posting the wrong information. Think about it. Do most commit credit card fraud using their own card? No. They use stolen information or cards, so you could be posting information on the innocent person who was as much a victim as you.
    They're all fair points Incognito - particularly point 4 (although posting a fraudulent card number would be okay, if not names and addresses of innocent victims of theft) - which is why I wondered at the practicality of it.

    Item 3 on your list could be a point of contention. If I could find a customer who had defrauded me and I posted information about him or her to that effect, I might be prepared to take my chances at any backlash from that accusation.

    In the end I guess you have to live with it.

    I recently had a perfectly valid transaction (made 4 months ago) charged back against me because it turns out the card was stolen. The customer who got their card stolen gets their money back, the bank who the card belonged to gets their money back, the credit card processing firm isn't out of pocket either. My company, on the other hand, has lost a sale, 4 months of time spent on support and been hit with chargeback fees for the privilege.

    Like I said, that's the way this 'online' business works and we have to live with it, but I can still afford myself the luxury of feeling bitter about being out of pocket when I haven't actually done anything wrong.

    Fortunately, I've found such circumstances to be quite rare, otherwise I doubt I'd still be in an online business!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,284
    It isn't just online businesses either. Any business ends up absorbing the costs associated with fraud. Part of the problem can be layed at the door of whatever card processor you use to screen cards for not catching the fraudulent cards.

    And it isn't just credit cards. A business that gets paid in counterfiet ends up losing the money when the bank detects it as it is confiscated. The only winners are the scam artists, at least until they get caught.
    "Obsolesence is just a lack of imagination."

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Here...always
    Posts
    323
    I feel your pain!!
    We had a customer sign up for a year, paid in full.

    Never talked to this person, they just signed up and checked the box that they read our TOS. then they broke 3 rules in our TOS in the first 27 days and crashed the server and had it locked up for 24 hours. We lost money on the accounts that were on that box that could not access there site.

    We terminated the account with no refund!

    Just waiting for the bad mouthing to start..........gotta love it!
    Our most important Customer is You !
    AIM: TLP SimOps | MSN: Sales@SimOps.com
    E-Mail: Sales@SimOps.com
    Always read everyone’s TOS, You get what you Pay for!!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    London, UK
    Posts
    9,039
    Defending yourself against people like this is all part of forum life. You cant expect everything to stay rosey 24/7 on a public forum, take the rough with the smooth.
    Matt Wallis
    United Communications Limited
    High Performance Shared & Reseller | Managed VPS Cloud | Managed Dedicated
    UK www.unitedhosting.co.uk | US www.unitedhosting.com | Since 1998.

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