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  1. #1

    Need help with IP's

    My thread might not be completely appropriate for this section, sorry about that.
    My question is, where do companies get IPv4 allocations from? Or just leased IPv4 addresses from?
    I want to get something around 32 to 256 IPv4 addresses available either as a direct allocation(purchased that is), or on a monthly lease. I know you can get IPv4 addresses for something around $1.50 each for an allocation, but I don't know if that's completely correct.
    I have never purchased an IP before, so I have no idea what to do.
    I have a dedicated server, and I want to add IP's to that, but the provider provides IP's at a big cost. I thought perhaps I could get the IP's from somewhere else and then use them on my server. If I do that, I don't have any idea on how to go about doing it as well.

  2. #2
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    You should go directly to your ISP for additional IP space. Chances are good that even if you purchased them for cheaper elsewhere, your ISP would likely charge you an additional fee to route them for you, making it not worthwhile. How much does your ISP charge for additional IP space? If it's -that- expensive, you may want to simply look into switching to a different host. Pricing per IP varies per host, but anywhere from $0.50/IP to $2/IP is fairly standard. Keep in mind that prices will likely only go up, as the amount of available IPv4 space is quickly being depleted.

    To answer your first question, ISPs get IP space from RIRs (regional internet registries). In the United States and Canada, that is ARIN (arin.net). In Europe, that is RIPE (ripe.net).

  3. #3
    I have a dedicated server, but no connection to the ISP. Where can I get IP's for $0.50/IP? And can I route them to my dedicated server using a tunnel or something, like you do with tunnelbroker?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by dhamaniasad View Post
    I have a dedicated server, but no connection to the ISP. Where can I get IP's for $0.50/IP? And can I route them to my dedicated server using a tunnel or something, like you do with tunnelbroker?
    The ISP is the company you're renting the server from.

    If you purchased IP space from elsewhere, you'd have to get an LOA (letter of authorization) from the company that owns the IP space, and then your ISP would need to announce the prefix on their network/to their upstreams. Like I mentioned though, chances are good that they'll charge you to do this, which would probably make it just as expensive as going directly through your host.

  5. #5
    If I get a /22 from arin, can I use that on the ISP's network then? And I see there's a $500 registration fee plus a $100 yearly fee, is that all?

  6. #6
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    You would not qualify for a /22 - you would need to be multihomed (ie: purchasing bandwidth from a third party and having it connected to your dedicated servers). The smallest prefix that ARIN will assign without being multihomed is a /20, and you would need to show current utilization of at least a /21.

  7. #7
    Oh, thats sad.

  8. #8
    migrate the server to somewhere having cheaper IPs. solved the probm. for /24, $1.5 or $2 per IP leading to $128 difference per month.
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  9. #9
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    its hard to get ip's now. and the price is going up almost in every month.

  10. #10
    What is it that you are trying to achieve with all these IPs?
    Why do you need them all at once?

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by oneboredman View Post
    What is it that you are trying to achieve with all these IPs?
    Why do you need them all at once?
    Trying to start a VPS business.

    Where can I get cheaper IP's then?

  12. #12
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    You have to get them from your provider
    and you will need to justify them

    So ask your provider for the IP space
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by dhamaniasad View Post
    Where can I get IP's for $0.50/IP? And can I route them to my dedicated server using a tunnel or something, like you do with tunnelbroker?
    You can use a GRE tunnel to get IPs from another DC. But you will need to consider latency and other things.

    Explain your situation to your provider and see if they will help you with price considering you are a start up.

    One option I would consider is asking for a /28 for your server and then ask for /27 once you start growing then ask for another /27 then possibly /26 then boom you will be at /24 worth of IPs at some point. Keep in mind the provider can route those smaller blocks to your server.

    Keep in mind providers have to see some justification and must adhere to ARIN policies and RFC2050.
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  14. #14
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    Re: Need help with IP's

    The other problem to consider with gre tunnels would be stability. You might have 99.9% SLA with your provider and effectively 0% with whoever owns the IPs. I can't see how it would be an acceptable risk even for the cheapest hosting. How would you support your customers if they pulled the plug and those IPs were gone?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by ocosa View Post
    You can use a GRE tunnel to get IPs from another DC. But you will need to consider latency and other things.

    Explain your situation to your provider and see if they will help you with price considering you are a start up.

    One option I would consider is asking for a /28 for your server and then ask for /27 once you start growing then ask for another /27 then possibly /26 then boom you will be at /24 worth of IPs at some point. Keep in mind the provider can route those smaller blocks to your server.

    Keep in mind providers have to see some justification and must adhere to ARIN policies and RFC2050.
    Ok, and would you suggest some provider with cheap IP's then? Incero offers 1024 IP's for $40 something.

  16. #16
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    Re: Need help with IP's

    Quote Originally Posted by dhamaniasad View Post
    Ok, and would you suggest some provider with cheap IP's then? Incero offers 1024 IP's for $40 something.
    Remind me not to host with you, this is a recipe for disaster

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by ngardiner View Post
    Remind me not to host with you, this is a recipe for disaster
    Well, I don't get what you're pointing at, but this is only for offering free VPSes, and I'd rather not spend a lot of money on a free service. For paid hosting, I'd colocate and get the IP's from the colo provider itself, and once I qualify, I'll get an ARIN assignment. But I'm not asking you to host with me.

  18. #18
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    Re: Need help with IP's

    Sorry, I wasn't aware that was the case. If you were taking people's money to host on IPs with a /22 at that cost (ie mail spam IP provider) then I'd say there were serious ethical concerns for customers but given it's a free service, why not

  19. #19
    Just found out its 253 IP's, not 1024, my bad. If I were taking people's money, I'd get IP's from either the provider or through ARIN. But Incero has a rather good reputation IMO. Many providers colocate with them.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by dhamaniasad View Post
    Ok, and would you suggest some provider with cheap IP's then? Incero offers 1024 IP's for $40 something.
    I prefer the approach of getting the IPs in smaller subnets (/28, then maybe a /27 so forth) from the DC you are in. But if you can deal with the latency and other issues then go for it. After all it's a free VPS service as you mention so give it a try.
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  21. #21
    Yeah, even though its a free service, I'd rather get IP's from the provider, that way, when I want, I can give ARIN justification and get my own allocation as well.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by dhamaniasad View Post
    Ok, and would you suggest some provider with cheap IP's then? Incero offers 1024 IP's for $40 something.
    these Ips would be black listed I guess.

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by dhamaniasad View Post
    Incero offers 1024 IP's for $40 something.
    IPv4 or IPv6?
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  24. #24
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    If you did not require exactly Europe location, go for ip's to US provider, cause they are cheaper like European providers, in Europe you can get C block for like 140 eur per month, in US price is 40-50% better

  25. #25
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    I think mention this in another post, go to this thread has the information you need http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showpo...3&postcount=12

  26. #26
    Its IPv4, but only 128 or 256. Not 1024.

    I don't require Europe, I prefer US. How many IP's are there in a C block?

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by dhamaniasad View Post
    Its IPv4, but only 128 or 256. Not 1024.
    Your updates make sense for the IPv4 market, but still on their website I only see options up to 128 IPs.
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  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Amanah Tech Inc View Post
    Your updates make sense for the IPv4 market, but still on their website I only see options up to 128 IPs.
    So its 128 then. I said 128 or 256, as I wasn't sure about which one it is.

  29. #29
    For a free service you could consider setting up a NAT. With some clever port forwarding you can give all users ipv4 access.
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  30. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by woktron View Post
    For a free service you could consider setting up a NAT. With some clever port forwarding you can give all users ipv4 access.
    I'm having problems doing that, I don't know how to use NAT very well.

  31. #31
    It depends on the virtualization tech you're using.

    For OpenVZ you could try following this guide:
    https://openvz.org/Using_NAT_for_con...th_private_IPs

    If you're running into problems you should double-check your iptables configuration and ensure the correct ports are opened and you've correctly setup masquerading. You should also ensure that the correct iptables modules are loaded.
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  32. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by woktron View Post
    It depends on the virtualization tech you're using.

    For OpenVZ you could try following this guide:
    https://openvz.org/Using_NAT_for_con...th_private_IPs

    If you're running into problems you should double-check your iptables configuration and ensure the correct ports are opened and you've correctly setup masquerading. You should also ensure that the correct iptables modules are loaded.
    Alright, I am using OpenVZ, will have a look at that guide. Hopefully it'll work for me.

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