View Poll Results: Does it annoy you?
- Voters
- 36. You may not vote on this poll
-
Yes, it makes me mad!
18 50.00% -
erm :/ I dunno!
6 16.67% -
Not really I love it!
12 33.33%
Results 1 to 19 of 19
-
02-18-2012, 04:56 PM #1Web Hosting Evangelist
- Join Date
- Nov 2009
- Location
- Scotland
- Posts
- 456
Why are there so many negative people here?
As the title says.
It's bug me to have to sit here and see others putting others down.
Someone wants to start a new business and people put them down, why not show some support?
We all started somewhere!
Rant over█ | AuzzHosting - Coming soon!
█ | 24/7 Support, Small Enough To Care, Quality Networks, Instant Setup.
█ | Europe | Uk |More Locations Coming Soon
-
02-18-2012, 05:45 PM #2
Most businesses in this industry are lucky to make it past 6 months. Why? No dedication from the owner. Why, therefore should a community that's been around more than 10 years be all about support for those who don't want to put the time and money into their own survival?
Tom Whiting, WHMCS Guru extraordinaire
Linux problems? WHMCS Problems? Give me a shout
Check out my WHMCS Addons
-
02-18-2012, 06:14 PM #3Web Hosting Master
- Join Date
- Jul 2003
- Location
- Brussels, Belgium
- Posts
- 1,325
Voted "erm :/ I dunno!" because this comes closest to my real answer.
Those who are on this forum and ask serious questions, give serious advise, ... don't seem to be bashed or to be responded in a negative or provocative way. I don't see too many negative people here whose responses are inpolite, provocative or negative per definition. Maybe a handful of people, true, but that's inevittable on a forum with a large number of members.
Negative is sometimes equal to realistic. Take the domainname forum as an example: some people keep on asking about .co.cc without realising this is not even a real extention. To respond them and point them to this fact is in my opinion not being negative but just showing this person the reality. Which in my opinion is, even if it burst some illusions now and then, better than bypassing totally unrealistic questions or statements. As long as politeness is always kept (which the majority of members seem to do) I don't see more than a handful of people around here who come across as bitter overall.
-
02-18-2012, 07:24 PM #4Web Hosting Master
- Join Date
- Mar 2004
- Location
- Los Angeles, California
- Posts
- 979
This questions asked constantly it seems for years people have been starting these web hosting businesses as kids and this question gets asked many times.
-
02-18-2012, 07:28 PM #5VP Of Twinkies
- Join Date
- Jan 2004
- Location
- Toronto, ON
- Posts
- 1,104
positive reinforcement sometimes has much worse consequences than telling someone they're essentially an idiot.
I specialize in neck beards
https://thatshirt.com
-
02-18-2012, 08:25 PM #6Rockin' the beer gut
- Join Date
- May 2006
- Location
- NJ, USA
- Posts
- 6,645
we're all a bunch of lovely folk aint we
lots of us sit in offices for days on end, some times with no sleep.. 5 o clock shadow and all
i know after 16 hours in a datacenter i am one real grouchy mother ****er lolAS395558
-
02-18-2012, 08:35 PM #7Web Hosting Master
- Join Date
- Mar 2003
- Location
- Canada
- Posts
- 9,072
I'm one of those people who are less than 'positive' towards others who come here and ask us how to start a business, because they want to do it despite not having any clue on what to do. Most of them can't even manage their own server, never mind running a web hosting business and being in charge of anything of value.
If I told you I was going to start an auto repair business despite my only experience of working with cars being the ability to check my oil level and pump gas, you would think I'm an idiot. Would you not? Any sane person would! So why is it any different that people think they can start a hosting provider without having any real experience outside of using their computer to browse Reddit and Digg? OH! I know why! It's because if you frig up online, you don't have to look the customer in the face and tell them you screwed them over. Their data is gone. Their money is gone. My bad, sorry bro. I'll try again next year when I turn 17.
You know what that does when someone gets burned in this industry? It makes them want to skip the middle man next time and do it themselves, which harms others and myself who are trying to run a legit business. It makes it difficult because everyone is so paranoid that the host is going to disappear in the middle of the night because their last host was ran by some 14 year old who funded the servers with allowance from his mother, hoping he could turn a profit to buy some weed. Not even good weed at that, we're talking mostly shake here. Ugh.
-
02-18-2012, 09:02 PM #8Eternal Member
- Join Date
- Dec 2004
- Location
- New York, NY
- Posts
- 10,710
-
02-18-2012, 09:18 PM #9Disabled
- Join Date
- Apr 2009
- Posts
- 3,262
You'd hope that somebody would do that or at least do many things before learning how to do it.
The best thing to is to learn everything about linux(windows just in case a potential employer requires it), cpanel/whm, security, networking, backups, hardware, sales, communication, marketing, writing, & much more unless you want to hire other people to do the work for you but you have to do something of course to start out. Many things can go wrong behind the scenes.
You have to be top of your game. Asking questions is not alright in a public forum because it makes you look bad but doing it right the first time is better. You should research it first. Like, read books, read these forums, go to college, Google it, & do it.
-
02-18-2012, 09:45 PM #10
I hate to say it, but most of those kids aren't actually relying on dedicated 'servers', but reseller plans, which makes things worse.
I couldn't agree more. Before I even dared to offer services as an admin, support tech, or anything else, I actually immersed myself in Linux. For years, I ran nothing but Linux (no Windows, no anything else), programmed, wrote functioning code (php, c, a small bit of html), figured out what was what, broke my own servers (deliberately), fixed them, debugged the living crap out of things.
Even then, I hardly considered myself an expert worth being paid hard cash. I opened a thread and said "hey, I will work for you, you give me a server", close to 10 years ago.. It wasn't long after that I started working for myself, but that is neither here nor there.
The point to the whole thing is that yes, you must at least have a pretty decent understanding about what is what in your field.
We'll have to agree to disagree there. Personally, I have no problem with people asking questions here, as long as they're not after a detailed, step by step, how do I do this kind of answer. For that, you need to pay for an expert's time.
The problem is that your average WHT consumer considers $35/month for server administration a "fair price", sooooo, what does that say about them as a whole? If you want to run a good, productive business, you must actually pay for good, productive services, not cheap out wherever you can.Tom Whiting, WHMCS Guru extraordinaire
Linux problems? WHMCS Problems? Give me a shout
Check out my WHMCS Addons
-
02-19-2012, 02:33 AM #11Web Hosting Master
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
- Posts
- 4,533
I personally have been holding my tongue the past few months with users and stopped being negative, well cut down at least.
Heres the thing, I see weekly or even daily "Hey guyz i want to host vps servers I am hoppin that you guys let me know how many people i can host. Here are the specs, 32gb ram 2x 1tb drive in raid 1. Looking host about 60 people on this"
These people WILL fail if they aren't even smart enough to do some basic research or smart enough to post the cpu and or don't know what i/o means. Yesterday I read a post with someone running a single drive and said something like " I expect to get 400MB read and write off this drive and will give everyone 20Mb capacity"
These people are going to start a business, screw people over (Sometimes hundreds) screw their family's when the child or clueless person gets sued, endanger peoples personal information by installing some billing software usually nulled or outdated containing credit card data etc and then come here and ask for help after.
Showing them how to get started is more harmful and negative than politely telling them they are an idiot.
I have made some questionable threads at times but I don't do shared hosting, vps hosting and any other type of hosting other than an internship I did which turned out as me working for free for a year and getting all backend information without a contract (I didn't do anything with it obviously but still). I currently work for a decent sized host to help the owner deal with some of his daily tasks along with local backups which I can do rather well, I cannot put the company on a resume and the pay is meh.
I'm waiting to open my own company but not until a few things happen:
- I learn more at the current company.
- Take some college courses and learn linux in and out along with college.
- Get a decent sized investment to do things right, not cheap.
- Make sure I lose some weight and increase my health so I can truly dedicate to the business.
- Improve my grammar skills along with trying to obtain a more professional appearance. Not doing so will hamper my business goals and cause slower growth which also affects any employees that would be hired.
- Find a decent development team so I can get my own niche idea programmed out that I have seen demand for but have seen 0 hosts do. Rather basic too and similar uptime as a redundant cloud.
- And finally, see what is going to happen with SSD drives. When these get cheaper they will more than likely heavily change the hosting industry with the amount of customers per server and general loading speed where server optimizations won't be noticed as much and the cheapest host that is profitable is going to succeed. This is the turning point in hosting where I think it will start going heavily down hill.
If I can wait to start a business why cant all these other randoms actually take their time to use this thing called google or even learn what kind of virtualization software they need. I even saw this the other day "I can't get openvz working with this host" Someone responded with "Try KVM or Xen" and then the op had responded with " So this will allow me to get my openvz working?"
Encouraging that guy or girl is not good for anyone. Being negative in my opinion is the only true way to get through to people like this.
-
02-19-2012, 04:52 AM #12The VPS Specialist
- Join Date
- Aug 2003
- Location
- Edinburgh/London
- Posts
- 5,789
As a fellow Scot, it surprises me you've asked this question. We're the cliche grumpy folk, cheap and clueless. I would have to agree with Patrick and techjr and. I bite my virtual tongue constantly along with others but can't help feel that in doing so I'm actually damaging my own businesses by letting these people go ahead and flood the market with crap.
I've lost count of the number of times customers have asked if we're going to vanish overnight. What does that say about the industry?
-
02-19-2012, 06:45 AM #13
I think a lot of the grumpiness stems from people trying to rush into things too soon. It's like they read about selling web hosting one day, and the next day they want to open up shop. There are a lot of people who frequent these forums who are very successful in the industry and who have excellent advice to give, but the average 16 year old wanting to make "big bux" on his $12/Mo reseller account doesn't always listen to reason. Some will ask for help, get very good sincere and honest advice from someone who knows their stuff, and then that advice is completely ignored.
[ IncogNET LLC ] Privacy By Design [Liberty Lake, WA][Kansas City, MO][Allentown, PA][Naaldwijk, NL]
[ Web Hosting | KVM VPS | Dedicated Servers | Domain Names | VPN | Censorship Resistance ]
Services provided in the United States and Netherlands with privacy and freedom of speech being our top priority.
-
02-19-2012, 01:56 PM #14Web Hosting Evangelist
- Join Date
- Nov 2009
- Location
- Scotland
- Posts
- 456
I'm actually English (but yeah your right they are grumpy people here) as of every where!
I have learned all my stuff over the years (this post isn't for me but for what i have read around here)
I understand people come and go and make new business off mummy and daddys money.
But when I see someone asking for some advice (nothing to do with the business side of things but little things he's unsure about) what is the need to put him down!
I love this forum and i have read some decent stuff over the years but honestly some people on here are very rude! and i would hate to deal with them in real life.
Yeah these hosting companies that go bust are usually reseller accounts (from what I've heard).
I feel that some posts here are "aimed" at myself, well I have been doing hosting and playing about with servers for some time now and have been learning stuff since i was 15 (and still am to this day!).
I wish people the best of luck on these forums.
However i understand some reply's here about "kids" yeah that's true but isn't there kids starting all sort of online businesses?
Especially game servers that's even worse than hosting, but some people make a success and know there stuff!
Anyway, I can only hope that the "real" ones trying to make a success really do well for themselves - we're not all so lucky to have family and friends to support us and this is the BIGGEST web hosting forum on the net! so maybe they come here for support? who knows what goes on in some peoples heads?Last edited by AuzzHosting; 02-19-2012 at 02:01 PM.
█ | AuzzHosting - Coming soon!
█ | 24/7 Support, Small Enough To Care, Quality Networks, Instant Setup.
█ | Europe | Uk |More Locations Coming Soon
-
02-19-2012, 02:27 PM #15VP Of Twinkies
- Join Date
- Jan 2004
- Location
- Toronto, ON
- Posts
- 1,104
Giving someone advice on how to just make something work, or just do the bare minimum (which is what happens) to just get 'started' but not have other people to support them is much worse than saying "bad idea, walk away, don't waste your time, you're an idiot if you pursue this".
You risk jeapordizing their income, their money, customers money, customer satisfaction, creating jaded clientbase floating around...
People come up with stupid reasons like "this guy did it, so can I".. such a bad attitude when going on anything, because so many people blindly look at its face value and nothing more..
I'm not even in the hosting business, this applies to any entreprenuer in any sector.
I'm going to buy the tools, the truck and start a construction business.. by the way, how do I build a standard deck guys? any recomendations?
I'm going to buy 10,000 units of this product and sell it online because storefront costs to much... do you guys know how to build a website?
My dad left me his old mechanics shop, is $110 too much to charge per hour? Do I really need journeyman mechanics? Or can I get my friends to do the work...
It's simple... knowing what you can and cannot do.. If you're unable to provide technical knowledge for a company, you find somoene who will provide that.. not a good salesman? you find one.. Otherwise, don't do it.
I've turned down huge projects (and job offers) in the past because I didnt feel I'd be able to handle it, or do it to my standards.. knowing when to walk away or say no is very important.Last edited by mg-; 02-19-2012 at 02:30 PM.
I specialize in neck beards
https://thatshirt.com
-
02-19-2012, 03:14 PM #16Web Hosting Master
- Join Date
- Jan 2011
- Posts
- 884
I always thought people were too nice to the random people looking to startup a business they have no clue about, yet don't mind getting in over their head and harming businesses who ignorantly sign up for their services. I guess it all depends on your perspective.
-
02-19-2012, 04:03 PM #17Web Host Reviewer
- Join Date
- Feb 2006
- Location
- Kepler 62f
- Posts
- 16,703
|| Need a good host?
|| See my Suggested Hosts List || Editorial: EIG/Site5/Arvixe/Hostgator Alternatives
||
-
02-19-2012, 04:48 PM #18Web Hosting Master
- Join Date
- Jun 2005
- Posts
- 2,752
Great answers so far.
Many people naively see lack of entry and exit barriers in a business as an opportunity ignoring that anything you don't have some knowledge, experience and resources to succeed actually is not a real opportunity for you.You will only find out how good a provider is when the going gets tough
-
02-20-2012, 01:17 PM #19Web Hosting Master
- Join Date
- Nov 2007
- Location
- Dallas, TX
- Posts
- 9,064
I think many people start hosting businesses for the wrong reason, which may relate to the negativity then sometimes expressed toward them.
-mike
Similar Threads
-
People with FORUMS on their biz website -- what do you do with negative posts?
By AnmolTech in forum Running a Web Hosting BusinessReplies: 25Last Post: 04-18-2006, 09:41 PM -
LUDICROUS History: An interactive tale chosen by the people, for the people.
By Bacon of Destiny in forum Web Hosting LoungeReplies: 7Last Post: 02-26-2005, 09:51 PM -
Designers, Flash people, Programers, website people needed!
By albc15 in forum Employment / Job OffersReplies: 1Last Post: 07-16-2004, 05:27 PM -
CRAZY, Sales people needed, Sane people need not apply
By mark pearce in forum Employment / Job OffersReplies: 0Last Post: 10-30-2003, 10:08 PM