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  1. #1
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    15K SAS Drives are Good?

    Dear,

    On so many forums like WHT , many of the users disliked the 15K SAS drives.

    Please give your expert opinion about this one.
    Should we go for it or should use SCSI/Normal Sata H.D.D's


    Thanks!

  2. #2
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    There's no way to answer this without knowing what you're doing. 15K SAS drives are the best hard drives for high IO workloads.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orien View Post
    15K SAS drives are the best hard drives for high IO workloads.
    What about SSD drives?
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by nokia3310 View Post
    What about SSD drives?
    Those are solid state drives.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by IHC-HOST View Post
    Dear,

    On so many forums like WHT , many of the users disliked the 15K SAS drives.

    Please give your expert opinion about this one.
    Should we go for it or should use SCSI/Normal Sata H.D.D's


    Thanks!
    SAS is obviously better than SATA.
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  6. #6
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    Yes we know that SAS is better.But heard that it got complaints.

    Means more complains then Sata?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orien View Post
    There's no way to answer this without knowing what you're doing. 15K SAS drives are the best hard drives for high IO workloads.
    wE have clients with MYSQL usage with VoIP termination etc

  8. #8
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    SAS are great, but of course if you can(budget wise) why not go for some SSD?

    Also running/planning any type of RAID Config?

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  9. #9
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    I don't hate SAS 15K. Still a good drive for me.

    Specially 4 U
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  10. #10
    I'd even prefer SAS 15k than SSD (good server grade ssd is still pretty expensive)

  11. #11
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    That's right, you have to go with SAS and even better with RAID.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by IHC-HOST View Post
    Dear,

    On so many forums like WHT , many of the users disliked the 15K SAS drives.

    Please give your expert opinion about this one.
    Should we go for it or should use SCSI/Normal Sata H.D.D's


    Thanks!
    15 sas is great when you need a lot of writes and a medium amount of space and more iops than 7200rpm sata can handle. I've yet to find a use case that has these properties.

    Sata works great for lots of data lots of writes and the least amount of iops.

    Consumer SSD's are great for lots of reads and bursts of writes they can not handle lots of writes without being replaced frequently. And yes we have already run into this and had to adjust our contracts to penalize clients that wanted to abuse consumer level ssd's.

    Enterprise SSD's great for everything but amounts of space for the price and price in general.

    The most common use case we see are servers that need bursts of rapid IO's or lots of iops to a small amount of there overall data. A mixed use of cache or hybrid ssd storage, cache is a good fit for the busty and hybrid for the constant hot data. Besides replacing SAS drives that failed or direct customer requests were not buying sas drives. They are not the best fit for any use case we can come up with.

    The performance difference that a couple hundred bucks for a pair of Intel 311's adds to a typical 4 drive raid 10 of sata drives has them outperform a similar number of sas drives for nearly anything but a 100% data random read and write pattern that's consistent 24/7.

  13. #13
    SAS drives are good

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by IHC-HOST View Post
    Yes we know that SAS is better.But heard that it got complaints.

    Means more complains then Sata?
    Where have you read complaints about 15K SAS?

    Generally, these hard disks are pretty highly regarded both in terms of performance and reliability. We use 15K SAS on the majority of our servers currently and have no complaints. You may also want to look at SSDs, but depending on your needs 15K SAS is not a bad choice.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by layer0 View Post
    Where have you read complaints about 15K SAS?

    Generally, these hard disks are pretty highly regarded both in terms of performance and reliability. We use 15K SAS on the majority of our servers currently and have no complaints. You may also want to look at SSDs, but depending on your needs 15K SAS is not a bad choice.
    This ^ is my view.

    FusionIO > SSD > SAS > SATA > anything else

    Both in price and performance so chose what makes sense for your budget and needs. If you don't need ultra high iops then why pay for it.
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  16. #16
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    Running a database on SSDs = stupid.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by IHC-HOST View Post
    Yes we know that SAS is better.But heard that it got complaints.

    Means more complains then Sata?
    I have not heard any complaints about SAS drives. Mind linking specifically where people are complaining about them?


    SAS drives usually provide about double the performance with half the access time and is generally noticeable. The only real reason a lot of providers don't use them is they are trying to make as much profit as possible and try to offer the world for a penny and can't afford them. I'm actually running two 15k SAS drives in raid 1 and am getting pretty awesome performance compared to a raid 10 sata setup. While not identical it is pretty nice.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wintereise View Post
    Running a database on SSDs = stupid.
    What is stupid about it? As long as backups are made and raid is used it can be cheaper. Some people are replacing 16+ drives for a couple of ssd's and getting amazing performance out of them. The only major reliability issues should be from people buying low end drives.

  18. #18
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    Consumer level SSDs (MLC devices, specifically) have a limited number of writes in their life time, so that is one reason to shy away from using those particular devices over something tried and tested like an array of 15K SAS drives.

    SLC devices (e.g. Intel X-25E) and FusionIO is a different matter, but it's not economically feasible to use those in all but the most specialised of circumstances (we have clients using them, but they are heavy database users).
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wintereise View Post
    Running a database on SSDs = stupid.
    Because you do not like at least an order of magnitude better io performance? Do you mean consumer grade MLC SSD's? I'll agree with that. Otherwise people that needed fast databases have been running them on solid state storage since the 90's at least. A lot of what made EMC, IBM and other big boy SAN's as fast as they were was a pile of solid state cache.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Wintereise View Post
    Running a database on SSDs = stupid.
    Making grandiose comments with little or no thought = stupid.

    SSD's are in many ways ideal for databases, this includes some 'consumer' grade drives. It's all a matter of proper planning.

  21. #21
    Your post would be the first I have heard of people not liking 15k SAS. Please show me links to all the complaints you speak of. They are about the best there is for reliability and performance. Ssd will be faster but reliability is still somewhat still to be proven on a broad scale based on their newness.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by HivelocityGM View Post
    Your post would be the first I have heard of people not liking 15k SAS. Please show me links to all the complaints you speak of. They are about the best there is for reliability and performance. Ssd will be faster but reliability is still somewhat still to be proven on a broad scale based on their newness.
    i have my iodrive slc for 4 years now serving 20gb data of database of one single website. So far me the ssd has been very stable.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by IHC-HOST View Post
    Yes we know that SAS is better.But heard that it got complaints.

    Means more complains then Sata?
    I find that hard to believe, A decent SAS will wipe the floor with any SATA drive
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  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by cd/home View Post
    I find that hard to believe, A decent SAS will wipe the floor with any SATA drive
    LOL.

    Pick your fastest 'SAS' drove

    [Though I do agree that calling SAS unreliable is odd.]

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by silasmoeckel View Post
    The performance difference that a couple hundred bucks for a pair of Intel 311's adds to a typical 4 drive raid 10 of sata drives has them outperform a similar number of sas drives for nearly anything but a 100% data random read and write pattern that's consistent 24/7.
    And would that help more than a 15k SAS if you have many people writing at the same time?

    Let say with 4 HDD SATA 7.2k RAID 10 you'd have 200MB/s shared among 10 people
    with 4 HDD SAS 15 k RAID 10 400MB/s shared amond 10 people.

    In those cases the write speed would be more or less divided by the number of people writing, right?

    Now imagine than with the SSD cache you'd have (with 2x311 RAID 1) 100MB/s - how would that react to 10 people writing at the same time? Good I/O speed or would it be divided by 10 (for example)?

    (I'd like to test that myself but don't have the gear available)

    Thanks!

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