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  1. #26
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    Disclaimer: I'm not a lawyer.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lubeca View Post
    The attorney went by what is in the Whois. What else should he have done?
    Every time I do a whois query I see a long disclaimer telling me the information may not be accurate and is provided "as-is" and without any guarantee. That unreliable information is inconvenient for the attorney doesn't change that it's still just that: unreliable information. To threaten someone based on this information without so much as checking if the phone number works is unprofessional.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lubeca View Post
    And no, unfortunately the OP can't simply ignore the letter (that's really bad advice you've given there!).
    He sure can. That you think he shouldn't is a different matter and maybe you're right - I don't know.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lubeca View Post
    The OP is the victim of identity theft.
    Is he? Typically identity theft requires that the criminal obtains a "means of identification". I doubt that information you can get from the phonebook qualifies. It only looks like identity theft because the attorney thinks he identified someone - but he did so using a data source which is known to be unreliable and even qualified as such by its publisher.

  2. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by stub View Post
    You could always use Google Translate to translate your message into Chinese.
    I already did. I contacted "Cyber Police" in China at xmmail@xiamen.cyberpolice.cn although I am not sure if they really are the right police.

    In fact, just received most of the reported domains were REJECTED by ICANN'T for no good reasons and those domains are NOT deleted nor suspended! Here's one of the email that ICANN'T sent me:

    Dear Sir/Madam:

    ICANN appreciates you taking the time to complete a Whois Data Problem Report regarding the domain *****************.com. However, your complaint was rejected because the Whois inaccuracy claim was found invalid and the domain falls
    under one of the following categories:

    1. Client Hold: Domain is On Hold
    2. NOT FOUND: Domain is not existent
    3. Pending Delete, Domain Suspended or Deleted

    The Whois Data Problem Reporting System only forwards valid Whois inaccuracy
    complaints directly to the registrar for review.

    For further information on what is required of registrars upon notification
    of an inaccuracy in Whois data, you may wish to view the ICANN Advisory
    located online at http://www.icann.org/announcements/advisory-03apr03.htm.

    Kind regards,

    ICANN Services

    ========================================================

    Most or all domains were REJECTED this way! My Whois inaccuracy claim was found invalid!!?? I spent 20 hours on reporting just about 15-20 domains! There are ~75 of them right now that are using my identity! What's going on?

    I respond to their statement of reasons:

    1. Client Hold: Domain is On Hold - NO, IT IS NOT!
    2. NOT FOUND: Domain is not existent - DOMAIN EXISTS IN WHOIS!
    3. Pending Delete, Domain Suspended or Deleted - IT IS NOT SUSPENDED!

  3. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Techno View Post
    If the domain portion of the registrant's email addy doesn't exist then you can register that domain and get the emails.
    It's googlemail.com or gmail.com.... but the first portion does not exist.

  4. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Lubeca View Post
    I noticed .ws was mentioned in several posts.

    Are some of these domains .ws ones?

    If so... I should mention that ICANN rules (about Whois etc) only apply to GTLD domains but not to ccTLD ones. Country code registries operate under national law (Western Samoa law in this case). ICANN gets a say in who runs country code registries, but not in how they are run. And you can't file a Whois data inaccuracy report for ccTLD domains.
    Most are .COM domains and some are .NET and one so far is .BIZ

  5. #30
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    As Lubeca asked - can you confirm that these are gTLD domains? not ccTLD's? If they are the latter, ICANN won't do much for you and you'll have a better chance contacting the relevant organisation in that particular country.

    UPDATE: never mind - just saw your reply :-)

  6. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by xnpu View Post
    You're not the registrant of the domain, so it's a matter of a wrongly addressed letter. You can simply return or discard it.

    Besides, the attorney obviously didn't spend much thought or time on the issue - why would you?
    Because someone is using those domains for scams, fraud, spamming and shady deals, which damages my reputation. Perhaps it is done on purpose by someone more than just online spammers. Some quite good domains are registered and are put on my name and address and since the email and phone listed is non-existent, this smells like its being done on purpose to damage my reputation. Even ICANN seems to be involved since they rejected most of my applications (reports) and those domains remain registered and bearing my name and address. That is very much illegal, but perhaps we are now under FASCIST STATE?

    The attorney is an IDIOT or these are rather done on purpose.
    The attorney attacked me to injure by stating that I am THE REGISTRANT. The used attack language and not "perhaps sir you could be the registrant, would you confirm or reject for us please" tone. And please note again that the attorney sent the letter on Oct. 10 and gave me to respond until Oct. 17 which includes arrival of my letter to them by Oct. 17. I picked up their letter on the evening of Oct. 17. Perhaps it may have arrived on Oct 15 or so, but I check my mail once a week as I don't receive much mail every day. This is not clean.

  7. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Lubeca View Post
    The attorney went by what is in the Whois. What else should he have done?

    And no, unfortunately the OP can't simply ignore the letter (that's really bad advice you've given there!). The OP is the victim of identity theft. This is a criminal matter, which needs to be reported to the Police. And the OP needs to write back to the attorney with a copy of a document from the Police confirming that he has reported the identity theft.

    Under no circumstances should the OP ignore the letter, or return it.
    There is a special intentionally designated space for attorney's signature, yet it was not signed by the attorney. Shouldn't attorneys hand-sign such letters, especially if there is clearly a signature field? By: _____________________________ (Attorney name)

    How do you report identity theft to your local police, if that theft has occurred in China? I reported it to China Cyber Police online. In the past I attempted to file such reports to my local, state and even federal police and FBI but they all refused to accept my reports stating it was the matter of (kick the ball further)....someone else, such as the police in another state, the police in another country or simply civil matter of small claims court. And I already have experience suing at Small Claims Court, which you end up paying say $80 + XX$ and then its impossible to collect even when you win the case. One police man even told me (he asked me to go outside of their police building into the fresh air for some reason) "Are you a senator? If not, why should we help you?" I am not kidding. This was around 2001 in Wilmington, NC when I received a letter with some white powder in it and all police did was they offered to take it and discard it for me. Talking about conspiracy! The Anthrax hoax was all that it was - a hoax on purpose. Even the police was instructed not to take it seriously!

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeonRider View Post
    As I already mentioned I contacted registrar, but there was no response, no action. Even the "registrar's" email address is weird:

    feedback@longtoponline.com
    hpyi@longtoponline.com
    (and not xxx@bizcn . com)

    I also suspect they do not understand any English.
    This suggests that Bizcn . com may be part of something called the Longtop Group:

    http://www.internic.com/registrars/registrar-471.html

  9. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by xnpu View Post
    Disclaimer: I'm not a lawyer.



    Every time I do a whois query I see a long disclaimer telling me the information may not be accurate and is provided "as-is" and without any guarantee. That unreliable information is inconvenient for the attorney doesn't change that it's still just that: unreliable information. To threaten someone based on this information without so much as checking if the phone number works is unprofessional.



    He sure can. That you think he shouldn't is a different matter and maybe you're right - I don't know.



    Is he? Typically identity theft requires that the criminal obtains a "means of identification". I doubt that information you can get from the phonebook qualifies. It only looks like identity theft because the attorney thinks he identified someone - but he did so using a data source which is known to be unreliable and even qualified as such by its publisher.
    DomainTools.com Terms:

    "You may not use the Site or any Services provided through or in connection therewith to: (a) defame, abuse, harass, threaten or otherwise violate the legal rights (such as rights of privacy and publicity) of others;"

    I was threatened by an attorney and was attacked-to-injure threatening me with a fine of up to $100,000 per domain, although the attorney was writing only about one domain, he wrote "per domain" as if it was multiple domains.

    The attorney should have made more research and they should have not attacked me without being sure who the real owner (if any!) of the domain is (who PAID for it), but should have written in more benign, modest language. The attorney seems to be an Associate, young, inexperienced, and I will consider legal action against them for trying to injure an innocent person.

  10. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by xnpu View Post
    Disclaimer: I'm not a lawyer.



    Every time I do a whois query I see a long disclaimer telling me the information may not be accurate and is provided "as-is" and without any guarantee. That unreliable information is inconvenient for the attorney doesn't change that it's still just that: unreliable information. To threaten someone based on this information without so much as checking if the phone number works is unprofessional.
    10. LIABILITY DISCLAIMER AND INDEMNIFICATION

    YOUR USE OF THE SITE AND/OR SERVICES, INCLUDING ANY DATA PROVIDED, IS AT YOUR SOLE RISK. THE ACCURACY, CONDITION AND AVAILABILITY OF THE SITE AND SERVICES ARE PROVIDED ON AN "AS IS" BASIS. DOMAINTOOLS EXPRESSLY DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES OF ANY KIND, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, ANY IMPLIED WARRANTY OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. DOMAINTOOLS MAKES NO WARRANTY THAT: (i) THE INFORMATION ON THIS SITE IS CORRECT, ACCURATE OR RELIABLE;

  11. #36
    I already did. I contacted "Cyber Police" in China at xmmail@xiamen.cyberpolice.cn although I am not sure if they really are the right police.

    In fact, just received most of the reported domains were REJECTED by ICANN'T for no good reasons and those domains are NOT deleted nor suspended! Here's one of the email that ICANN'T sent me:

    Dear Sir/Madam:

    ICANN appreciates you taking the time to complete a Whois Data Problem Report regarding the domain *****************.com. However, your complaint was rejected because the Whois inaccuracy claim was found invalid and the domain falls
    under one of the following categories:

    1. Client Hold: Domain is On Hold
    2. NOT FOUND: Domain is not existent
    3. Pending Delete, Domain Suspended or Deleted

    The Whois Data Problem Reporting System only forwards valid Whois inaccuracy
    complaints directly to the registrar for review.

    For further information on what is required of registrars upon notification
    of an inaccuracy in Whois data, you may wish to view the ICANN Advisory
    located online at http://www.icann.org/announcements/advisory-03apr03.htm.

    Kind regards,

    ICANN Services

    ========================================================

    Most or all domains were REJECTED this way! My Whois inaccuracy claim was found invalid!!?? I spent 20 hours on reporting just about 15-20 domains! There are ~75 of them right now that are using my identity! What's going on?

    I respond to their statement of reasons:

    1. Client Hold: Domain is On Hold - ACTUALLY, IT IS ON HOLD, BUT IT STILL APPEARS ON WHOIS AND UNTRAINED EYE WILL NOT FIND "ON HOLD" STATEMENT SINCE IT IS IN ANOTHER FOLDER)
    2. NOT FOUND: Domain is not existent - DOMAIN EXISTS IN WHOIS!
    3. Pending Delete, Domain Suspended or Deleted - IT IS NOT SUSPENDED!

  12. #37
    Just noticed someone updated the name and address to another guy, with a fake address as well, since the city does not match the state and the zip. The "new" phone they just posted on ALL domains is "disconnected or no longer in service!"

    Now another sizif's work for me is to visit all the forums where I was being called a scammer (or similar) and ask them to remove all those posts!

    BIZCN(dot-com), Inc. registrar must be kicked out by Internic-ICANN!

    Still, I must find out who does all this and sue them, even if they are in China.

    I doubt that ICANN will go after BIZCN, Inc. registrar (let alone the criminal who does this!) as long as no "registrant" or "lawyer" complains about it!

    I hope the "Cyber Police" in China is a real one and will take my complaint seriously!
    Last edited by NeonRider; 10-19-2011 at 03:32 PM.

  13. #38
    I wrote to the attorney and asked them for a written apology letter.

  14. #39
    Guess what else? Since the email on the whois record is non-existent, how did the criminals find out I was reporting them yesterday? Somehow they were informed either by ICANN or by BIZCN (yet I did not contact BIZCN!!) and all they did was they replaced my name and address with another fake address and fake phone (I just verified it is out of service) and fake email address! Now I suspect this BIZCN, Inc. "registrar" (approved by ICANN!!!)must be the criminals themselves! And that makes ICANN look less than reputable as well! Since BIZCN was doing this at least since 2008-2009 and I am sure that ICANN must have been informed by someone else about BIZCN's activities years ago and yet did nothing to stop their shady practices! These companies and corporations and even entire countries have no respect, no self-respect and no dignity!
    Last edited by NeonRider; 10-19-2011 at 03:56 PM.

  15. #40
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    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    896
    There is no conspiracy here.

    It's normal for spammers to change the address in their whois record to avoid being tracked down. Normally it's easier to use an address that really exists instead of trying to make up a fake one. Especially if they are unfamiliar with the address layout for the country they are pretending to be in.

    I think ICANN pass complains to the registrar. So the domain registrant doesn't need a valid email address in the whois to be notified. The registrar likely has other means of contacting their client.
    I could tell you a joke about UDP. But I'm not sure you would get it!

  16. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan541 View Post
    I think ICANN pass complains to the registrar.
    That's actually exactly how the invalid WHOIS report link "partly" works. I say partly because not only do they forward that report to the sponsoring registrar, but they also collect them to keep track.

    I realize you're angry about this whole thing, OP, but I think you've done what you realistically could under the circumstances. You reported the matter to the appropriate authorities, and you notified the attorney you've nothing to do with it. (with some accompanying proof, maybe...)

    I hate to tell you this, but you're potentially and needlessly frustrating yourself if you're expecting "instant action" addressing these issues. Just do what you can, let the others try to handle the rest on their own, then continue doing what you truly enjoy offline or so.

    Or...you could also try this:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serenity_prayer

    I wish you well on your ventures.

  17. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Zan View Post
    That's actually exactly how the invalid WHOIS report link "partly" works. I say partly because not only do they forward that report to the sponsoring registrar, but they also collect them to keep track.

    I realize you're angry about this whole thing, OP, but I think you've done what you realistically could under the circumstances. You reported the matter to the appropriate authorities, and you notified the attorney you've nothing to do with it. (with some accompanying proof, maybe...)

    I hate to tell you this, but you're potentially and needlessly frustrating yourself if you're expecting "instant action" addressing these issues. Just do what you can, let the others try to handle the rest on their own, then continue doing what you truly enjoy offline or so.

    Or...you could also try this:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serenity_prayer

    I wish you well on your ventures.
    The "rush" has reasons, because I discovered some websites listing me as a (potential) scammer, which damages my business reputation and thus I am trying to remove those defamating pages asap. I'm not concerned about the lawyer thing, just was surprised by his lack of professionalism. Thanks for your response and concerns. I must also note that I am not religious and not into alcohol, drugs etc. much.

  18. #43

    WDPRS REJECTION NOTICE TO REPORTER

    Quote Originally Posted by NeonRider View Post
    I already did. I contacted "Cyber Police" in China at xmmail@xiamen.cyberpolice.cn although I am not sure if they really are the right police.

    In fact, just received most of the reported domains were REJECTED by ICANN'T for no good reasons and those domains are NOT deleted nor suspended! Here's one of the email that ICANN'T sent me:

    Dear Sir/Madam:

    ICANN appreciates you taking the time to complete a Whois Data Problem Report regarding the domain *****************.com. However, your complaint was rejected because the Whois inaccuracy claim was found invalid and the domain falls
    under one of the following categories:

    1. Client Hold: Domain is On Hold
    2. NOT FOUND: Domain is not existent
    3. Pending Delete, Domain Suspended or Deleted

    The Whois Data Problem Reporting System only forwards valid Whois inaccuracy
    complaints directly to the registrar for review.

    For further information on what is required of registrars upon notification
    of an inaccuracy in Whois data, you may wish to view the ICANN Advisory
    located online at http://www.icann.org/announcements/advisory-03apr03.htm.

    Kind regards,

    ICANN Services

    ========================================================

    Most or all domains were REJECTED this way! My Whois inaccuracy claim was found invalid!!?? I spent 20 hours on reporting just about 15-20 domains! There are ~75 of them right now that are using my identity! What's going on?

    I respond to their statement of reasons:

    1. Client Hold: Domain is On Hold - ACTUALLY, IT IS ON HOLD, BUT IT STILL APPEARS ON WHOIS AND UNTRAINED EYE WILL NOT FIND "ON HOLD" STATEMENT SINCE IT IS IN ANOTHER FOLDER)
    2. NOT FOUND: Domain is not existent - DOMAIN EXISTS IN WHOIS!
    3. Pending Delete, Domain Suspended or Deleted - IT IS NOT SUSPENDED!
    UPDATE: I just submitted more reports on more fake domains using my name and I got more rejections from ICANN. Thus I noticed the following pattern:

    1. I go to www.domaintools.com and www.who.is (the latter has more recent info displayed) and check the offending domain's data. It does not show any "ON HOLD" status anywhere.

    2. I submit a report to ICANN: http://wdprs.internic.net/ of the "live" (not on hold) domain.

    3. I receive one email and I copy the URL in it etc. and confirm.

    4. I receive a confirmation of the "accepted" report via email.

    5. I receive "WDPRS REJECTION NOTICE TO REPORTER" (see the above text of it) on all or most domains that I submit. Now that domain shows up as "ON HOLD" but only under "Registration" as "clientHold" which may be just because the criminal is updating the whois with another fake name/address etc.

    6. Then my name/address etc. still listed there or hours later it changes into another obviously fake address-name-phone-email combination, sometimes (in some spots) still bearing either my town name or my name alone in just one or two lines either under Reg, Admin or Tech record. Clearly the criminal is busy and is trying to "hide" and is annoyed having to spend extra time to do the "change".

    Then BIZCN completely ignorant and careless, criminally neglectful I would say, accepts the new fake address, the new fake name, the new fake and dead email and the new fake phone/fax (dead) and does not verify them, of course and ICANN (buddy?) approves all that nonsense. Sounds familiar?

    No reason to REJECT my report other than b/s. Very suspicious activity or should I say execution.

    NOTICE: Those of you who have a short attention span or weak nerves, stop reading (and definitely please do not comment), because I document all this in public to disclose how BIZCN and ICANN executes their business.

  19. #44
    Join Date
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    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,042

    Two things...

    OP...

    1) The report to the Police should have been made in your own country, not to the Police in China. If you're in China, and you get robbed, then the Chinese Police is the right place to go. If you're at home, and someone commits a crime against you, from anywhere in the world, then you go to your own Police and they open an investigation and co-operate with other countries' police forces as necessary.

    2) The ICANN Whois reporting service is largely automated. Your report will almost definitely have been rejected by a robot, not a human. If you have reason to believe that the robot is wrong then you should report this to someone within ICANN's technical department (I don't know how one does this, but I am sure there must be a contact form or contact address on ICANN's web site).

  20. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Lubeca View Post
    OP...

    1) The report to the Police should have been made in your own country, not to the Police in China. If you're in China, and you get robbed, then the Chinese Police is the right place to go. If you're at home, and someone commits a crime against you, from anywhere in the world, then you go to your own Police and they open an investigation and co-operate with other countries' police forces as necessary.

    2) The ICANN Whois reporting service is largely automated. Your report will almost definitely have been rejected by a robot, not a human. If you have reason to believe that the robot is wrong then you should report this to someone within ICANN's technical department (I don't know how one does this, but I am sure there must be a contact form or contact address on ICANN's web site).
    1) Crime has occurred in China since the registrar BIZCN is located in China, Xiamen specifically. US Police is useless or ignorant in such cases as I had multiple experiences in the past, so I tried China for a change. Why would USA police want to chase Chinese criminals.

    2) Obviously, but nothing new. Yet rejecting all carefully crafted reports is not normal, be it a robot or a human or a dog.

    You're not talking to a clueless novice.

  21. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by NotanAngel View Post
    The easiest way will be to contact *domain registrar* and explain them the issue. Most probably they will ask you about some documents proving that you are the one listed as Domain registrant.

    Dealing with ICANN is time-consuming.
    Nice registrar: http://www.rfc-ignorant.org/tools/lookup.php?domain=biz cn.com&full=1

    Remove space between "biz" and "cn" in order to view the link.

    ICANN accredited BIZCN, Inc......

    BIZCN also seems to be blocked on this forum as well. I hope this forum will also block ICANN as well.

  22. #47
    Join Date
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    Location
    UK
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeonRider View Post
    I hope this forum will also block ICANN as well.
    Don't be ridiculous.

    (I had a lot of sympathy to start with, but you're now making a bit of a fool of yourself)

  23. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Lubeca View Post
    Don't be ridiculous.

    (I had a lot of sympathy to start with, but you're now making a bit of a fool of yourself)
    You should have recognised humour and sarcasm in my last post. What happens to an organisation which does not do its job?

  24. #49
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    You made some noise and the whois details ended up getting changed. Good job, well done. You're in the clear now, yes?

    Criminals by definition, are not law abiding and are not afraid of those that are. What more do you expect/want to happen at this point?

    Satisfaction achieved. Redress unlikely.
    Last edited by TDS-chriss; 10-22-2011 at 04:23 PM. Reason: Is it worth pursuing farther?
    424 bits were harmed in the making of this signature.

  25. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by TDS-chriss View Post
    You made some noise and the whois details ended up getting changed. Good job, well done. You're in the clear now, yes?

    Criminals by definition, are not law abiding and are not afraid of those that are. What more do you expect/want to happen at this point?

    Satisfaction achieved. Redress unlikely.
    Do you work for ICANN or for BIZCN? The Whois was not changed; it looked that it was changing, but then most of it was mysteriously reverted by the criminals and now my name and address still appears on the Whois. So what a good well done job are you talking about? Are you seeking comfort? Why comment at all? You need support? Feel lonely? Go talk to your parents then.

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