Web Hosting Talk : Web Hosting Main Forums : Running a Web Hosting Business : Buying IP blocks from RIPE

[jtnire]

HI Everyone,

We run a VPS hosting business and we presently buy IP space from our upstream provider (our colo provider).

I notice that there are 2 ways to buys IP addresses from RIPE. Either become an LIR, which involves getting an AS number and setting up a multi-homed network. Or, you can buy blocks on their own as an "end user" and get these routed to you over your upstream's AS network.

Just wondering what the common approach is in the industry? If you buy blocks on their own, there is a term in the contract that says that you're not supposed to allow other to use these IPs. However, my DC advised me that this only means that you're not allowed to re-route these blocks over the internet again, however assigning them to a VPS or dedicated server should be ok.

If it is common to become an LIR and multi-home, how does one go about this? Presently, our upstream is the only PoP in the DC we are in (as they own the DC), but they do allow others to bring in connections to our rack for free (Of course, we'd have to pay for the leased line to peer with someone else)

Any advise is appreciated

Thanks

[rnts]

Hi,

First of all, in a normal situation with RIPE you dont "buy" the resources, you merely pay for either managing and the ability to request resources (LIR) or to request resources once (DA).

If your business is big enough I advice that you 1) become a LIR and request PA-assignments for both v4 & v6 and an ASN, 2) become multi-homed. This looks more professional in the eyes of a knowledgeable customer.

Or you could go for the one-off DA and do the exact same request/paper-work but pay once instead of recurring and lose the ability to request more resources on your own behalf.

Remember that when you are requesting addresses with DA you most often get PI-addresses (Provider Independent) which is harder to justify and not guaranteed to be globally routable, if you become a LIR you will be your own "provider" and get PA (provider aggregatable) addresses which you can announce/route however you want. You will also have to provide two "sponsoring" LIRs for PI-addresses, which, is what you always want in the case you don't want to be a LIR, or your current provider "owns" the addresses and may/will take them back if you would like to switch provider/ISP/transits.

//T

[jtnire]

Thanks for the advice. I wasn't aware that DA addresses were only allowed to be requested once. Interesting.

Well then, what is the best and easiest way to become "multi-homed"? We are able to buy transit from our current colo-provider and run BGP with them, but what would be the steps to get someone else as well? Would I have to buy a leased line from our location into an Exchange point in London?

Thanks

[rnts]

You are welcome. You can of course request DA-resources more than once but you will have to pay the DA-fee each time.

You can "cheat" the system a bit and ask for PI-addresses & ASN before you actually are multi-homed. Talk to a local provider (or ask your ISP if they know someone) and ask if they would reply yes to a question if you are peering with them, then you add two peering-contacts in the request.

You could also mention that you are going to hook up to LINX in the "near future" (tm) as well, as that is enough to request an ASN.

Note: I don't advice to cheat the system, I merely point out that it's possible.

//T

[jtnire]

Originally Posted by rnts

You are welcome. You can of course request DA-resources more than once but you will have to pay the DA-fee each time.

You can "cheat" the system a bit and ask for PI-addresses & ASN before you actually are multi-homed. Talk to a local provider (or ask your ISP if they know someone) and ask if they would reply yes to a question if you are peering with them, then you add two peering-contacts in the request.

You could also mention that you are going to hook up to LINX in the "near future" (tm) as well, as that is enough to request an ASN.

Note: I don't advice to cheat the system, I merely point out that it's possible.

//T

This is exactly what our co-lo provider told us In fact, they said that they could host our new ASN "on our behalf" on their current hardware, meaning we don't need to run BGP at all between our rack and them!

Of course, I do want to grow our business to the extent where multihoming becomes an advantage.

Thanks

Jonny

[QuickWeb-Roel]

Originally Posted by jtnire

This is exactly what our co-lo provider told us In fact, they said that they could host our new ASN "on our behalf" on their current hardware, meaning we don't need to run BGP at all between our rack and them!

Of course, I do want to grow our business to the extent where multihoming becomes an advantage.

Thanks

Jonny

i'm sure they meant announcing your IP prefixes for you not ASN because it requires exclusive use of router, it is not possible to use more than one ASN per network/router, otherwise they need to dedicate a router for you.

[jtnire]

Originally Posted by QuickWeb-Roel

i'm sure they meant announcing your IP prefixes for you not ASN because it requires exclusive use of router, it is not possible to use more than one ASN per network/router, otherwise they need to dedicate a router for you.

No, they actually meant announcing the ASN as well. Are you sure there isn't a way to logically split a Cisco router so that it can announce more than one ASN??

[rnts]

Originally Posted by jtnire

No, they actually meant announcing the ASN as well. Are you sure there isn't a way to logically split a Cisco router so that it can announce more than one ASN??

One can announce as many ASNs one want. Cisco example;

router bgp 123
network 1.2.3.0/21
neighbor 4.3.2.1 remote-as 321
...

router bgp 321
network 3.2.1.0/24
neighbor 1.2.3.4 remote-as 123
...

Juniper also has the ability to announce multiple ASNs, for example;
neighbor 1.2.3.4
peer-as 123
local-as 321
...

neighbor 4.3.2.1
peer-as 321
local-as 123

Don't worry, it's perfectly fine. If the provider says it's possible then you should listen to them, since they probably work with stuff like this every day.

//T