Results 1 to 23 of 23
  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    11

    Unlimited Hosting & WebHostingTalk.com

    I know there has been a lot of talk about unlimited web hosting here but just wanted to try to breathe some new light on the issue.

    DISCLAIMER: I do not own any type of web hosting company so WebHostingTalk's rule of not advertising unlimited hosting doesn't affect me in any way - this is just stuff I was personally thinking about.

    WebHostingTalk doesn't advertise it, but you can have unlimited posts on the forum - assuming they all follow the forum rules. However, if someone made 100 million posts on the forum, it would most likely cause significant issues with disk space, the database, and cause a high load if done all at once. Obviously this isn't something that WebHostingTalk has to worry about due to the fact that it would be impossible for that to happen while still following the rules; unless of course you somehow have learned to type so fast that you could make that many posts within a few days.

    To sum it up: you can make unlimited posts here, assuming you follow the rules because those rules are what prevent the server from spiraling out of control.

    I would look at unlimited web hosting the same way. Every major hosting company has rules setup for user and as long as they don't overpack their servers then they could offer unlimited space and bandwidth. You can always add more disk drives, memory, etc. to the server and most huge hosting companies aren't server-limited on bandwidth, they pull from a bandwidth pool for their entire network.

    Even in the worst case scenario where a customer is literally using tons of space and you can't add anymore drives, you could just move them to an entirely different server.

    But when it comes down to it: who could really use up 1000 GB of space if they are on shared hosting that doesn't allow websites such as video hosting, image hosting, file hosting, repositories, etc. If your website is actually using 1000 GB of space then you most likely have built up an enormous website that is getting significant traffic which means you are already exceeding one of the resource policies and will be forced to upgrade for that reason.

    Hope you get my drift, feel free to leave your opinion if you want. Thanks for taking the time to read and have a great day!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Kepler 62f
    Posts
    16,703
    You can always add more disk drives, memory, etc. to the server
    Not true. You can't always add more. Even in cases where it is possible, it comes with the consequence of paying to add more, at no cost to the overusing user. Therein lies the primary failure of shared "unlimited" hosting (or shared hosting, in general, when poorly maintained).

    Pick a web host based on hosting needs, not impossible promises.
    Last edited by kpmedia; 05-18-2011 at 01:04 AM.
    || Need a good host?
    || See my Suggested Hosts List || Editorial: EIG/Site5/Arvixe/Hostgator Alternatives
    ||

  3. #3
    Yeah and even WHT will not let you sell unlimited plans. "No unlimited/unmetered space, unlimited/unmetered bandwidth, or lifetime plan offers."

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by kpmedia View Post
    Not true. You can't always add more. Even in cases where it is possible, it comes with the consequence of paying to add more, at no cost to the overusing user. Therein lies the primary failure of shared "unlimited" hosting (or shared hosting, in general, when poorly maintained).

    Pick a web host based on hosting needs, not impossible promises.
    That is why in the sentence below the one you quoted I said: "Even in the worst case scenario where a customer is literally using tons of space and you can't add anymore drives, you could just move them to an entirely different server."

    If you want to say that unlimited is impossible, I definitely understand that - but it isn't fair to say that applies to strictly space and bandwidth. By those terms, any company that offers reseller hosting with the ability to created "an unlimited number of cPanel accounts is lying". If you put me on a reseller plan and I ran a bot to create 1 million cPanel accounts then you would definitely suspend/terminate my account - even though you advertise that on your website. Also, that same philosophy goes for the number of databases, email accounts, FTP accounts, etc.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    544
    Yes there some failings in the logic of the OP, the main one being conceptual. Fast typing - If each post took only 10 seconds it would take ~32 years to add 100 Million posts (and that does not take into account the required time between posts.)

    Marketing of cheap web hosting depends on economies of scale and Internet growth. In the same time that it would have taken to enter the OP's posts, the Internet has grown from relatively few nodes to over 6 Billion nodes today. Those wasting time wondering if others are marketing correctly are missing opportunities today.

    Things may not be unlimited but people's inability to conceptualize numbers makes the argument irrelevant.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by CraterHost View Post
    Yeah and even WHT will not let you sell unlimited plans. "No unlimited/unmetered space, unlimited/unmetered bandwidth, or lifetime plan offers."
    Yes, that is correct. Thank you for pointing at what this entire thread is about

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by srfreeman View Post
    Yes there some failings in the logic of the OP, the main one being conceptual. Fast typing - If each post took only 10 seconds it would take ~32 years to add 100 Million posts (and that does not take into account the required time between posts.)

    Marketing of cheap web hosting depends on economies of scale and Internet growth. In the same time that it would have taken to enter the OP's posts, the Internet has grown from relatively few nodes to over 6 Billion nodes today. Those wasting time wondering if others are marketing correctly are missing opportunities today.

    Things may not be unlimited but people's inability to conceptualize numbers makes the argument irrelevant.
    True, but imagine how quickly it could be done if you could run a bot on WebHostingTalk that made 10 posts every second. It wouldn't take too long to really screw some things up.

    Of course, that would effect other people on WHT, so they would ban you for doing it.

    Web hosting is just the same. Abusing the services effects other customers and you're forced to upgrade - it's all about whether or not your people abide by the rules.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    10,629
    Generally people are not going to create "Unlimited" e-mail addresses, or even databases, and hence why a lot of companies will allow you to use them. When you look at it in short view you are only going to be restricted on what you can send and hold anyways so no matter if you offered 50 accounts or unlimited accounts with e-mail you are still pretty much going to be bound by the values set out anyways.

    I disagree with unlimited webhosting, never liked it, I have used providers who have offered it and only one of those providers really turned out to be at least a little worthwhile, the rest were worthless.

    In reality it all comes down to marketing and how a customer interprets the deals and offers on hand, it is a little bit like shopping really
    l Dedigeeks Shared Wordpress Dedicated Established 2006
    l Leading AUSTRALIAN Hosting Provider Sydney & Melbourne Datacentres
    l cPanel/WHM R1Soft Backups 24/7/365 Support SMS Hosting Alerts*
    l www.dedigeeks.com Managing Director Service Superstars

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    544
    Quote Originally Posted by StartMySales View Post
    True, but imagine how quickly it could be done if you could run a bot on WebHostingTalk that made 10 posts every second. It wouldn't take too long to really screw some things up.

    Of course, that would effect other people on WHT, so they would ban you for doing it.

    Web hosting is just the same. Abusing the services effects other customers and you're forced to upgrade - it's all about whether or not your people abide by the rules.
    How many hours a day do spend just thinking of ways to break rules?

    A secret you may not have heard - they can all be, and are made to be broken - sshhhhhh..... don't tell anyone.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Kepler 62f
    Posts
    16,703
    Quote Originally Posted by StartMySales View Post
    That is why in the sentence below the one you quoted I said: "Even in the worst case scenario where a customer is literally using tons of space and you can't add anymore drives, you could just move them to an entirely different server."
    So a shared host should continue to support heavy use of somebody that should really be on a VPS or dedicated server? No, sorry, cannot agree with that. That's simply not a reasonable situation. That's why "unlimited" is a farce. Servers are not unlimited, and somebody has to pay for them (hardware, licensing, energy).

    Again, pick hosting based on your needs, not wild promises.
    || Need a good host?
    || See my Suggested Hosts List || Editorial: EIG/Site5/Arvixe/Hostgator Alternatives
    ||

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Modesto California
    Posts
    6,858
    Oh no.. not another post about unlimited hosting

    Cant we all agree that at this point there is no new light to be shed on this matter? I'm pretty sure the "unlimited" debate has been debated from every angle possible. Personally, im tired of hearing about it here on WHT, but that's just my two cents
    Looking for an awesome VPS Offer? CLICK HERE

    "Knowing is not enough, we must apply. Willing is not enough, we must do." – Bruce Lee

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by kpmedia View Post
    So a shared host should continue to support heavy use of somebody that should really be on a VPS or dedicated server? No, sorry, cannot agree with that. That's simply not a reasonable situation. That's why "unlimited" is a farce. Servers are not unlimited, and somebody has to pay for them (hardware, licensing, energy).

    Again, pick hosting based on your needs, not wild promises.
    Exactly. All 'Unlimited' hosting does is create a section of the market that demands everything for nothing. It's not the client's fault though, they're just used to seeing 'Unlimited' all up in their face when searching for providers outside of WHT.

    Oh, so you just downloaded a free social media script from HotScripts and going to start the next Facebook? You expect 500,000 members in 3 months? I hate to break it to you, it's not going to happen and you don't 'need' unlimited resources.
    [ IncogNET LLC ] Privacy By Design [Liberty Lake, WA][Kansas City, MO][Allentown, PA][Naaldwijk, NL]
    [ Web Hosting | KVM VPS | Dedicated Servers | Domain Names | VPN | Censorship Resistance ]
    Services provided in the United States and Netherlands with privacy and freedom of speech being our top priority.


  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by kpmedia View Post
    So a shared host should continue to support heavy use of somebody that should really be on a VPS or dedicated server? No, sorry, cannot agree with that. That's simply not a reasonable situation. That's why "unlimited" is a farce. Servers are not unlimited, and somebody has to pay for them (hardware, licensing, energy).

    Again, pick hosting based on your needs, not wild promises.
    Yes, that is exactly what you should do. As a business owner if you decide to offer something unlimited, then you need to provide that as long as the customer stays within your guidelines. If they violate any of your guidelines then you can of course force them to upgrade. But, if you say you're going to give someone something unlimited then you should be prepared to do that.

    If you told a customer you were going to give them something, wouldn't you?

  14. #14
    Well that is one of looking at it, heh.
    HostXNow - Shared Web Hosting | Semi Dedicated Hosting | Enterprise Reseller Hosting | VPS Hosting

  15. #15
    There's no such thing as unlimited hosting. Nothing in life is unlimited you know.

  16. #16
    You only get yourself LIMITED with the new web hosting term UNLIMITED.

    Its all over UNLIMITED, that because hosting ran out of space of the numerous 00000000000GB so to cut it short, call it UNLIMITED.
    █▌ Cheapest Domain Registration Service & Shared Hosting Solutions .
    █▌ Skrill, Perfect Money, AdvCash, Webmoney,Monero, Neteller, BitCoin, Payeer, Crypto.
    █▌ Instant Domain Name Registration - Over 700+ Extensions x3reg.com!

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    544
    Quote Originally Posted by StartMySales View Post
    Yes, that is exactly what you should do. As a business owner if you decide to offer something unlimited, then you need to provide that as long as the customer stays within your guidelines. If they violate any of your guidelines then you can of course force them to upgrade. But, if you say you're going to give someone something unlimited then you should be prepared to do that.

    If you told a customer you were going to give them something, wouldn't you?
    The concepts are sometimes hard to grasp without training and experience. Just waiting to see what you can come up with next is not a worthwhile strategy.

    Start a hosting company, see what works for you and let us know the results after 5 years.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    New York City, NY, USA
    Posts
    358
    (UN)Limited means WITHOUT Limits....so to say unlimited as long as you stay within the limits is an oxymoron at best..a scam at worst.
    Maurice W. Evans, Best-selling author & Marketing Consultant
    Powernality™ Certified Master Trainer | Meta Certified Community Manager
    Certified Guerrilla Marketing Coach (Jay Conrad Levinson) | Certified John C. Maxwell Leadership Team

  19. #19
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by afam4eva View Post
    There's no such thing as unlimited hosting. Nothing in life is unlimited you know.
    Ummmm.... they why are you owning/advertising the company in your signature that offers unlimited space and bandwidth if you believe it isn't possible?

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    California
    Posts
    2,786
    Quote Originally Posted by StartMySales View Post
    WebHostingTalk doesn't advertise it, but you can have unlimited posts on the forum - assuming they all follow the forum rules. However, if someone made 100 million posts on the forum, it would most likely cause significant issues with disk space, the database, and cause a high load if done all at once. Obviously this isn't something that WebHostingTalk has to worry about due to the fact that it would be impossible for that to happen while still following the rules; unless of course you somehow have learned to type so fast that you could make that many posts within a few days.

    To sum it up: you can make unlimited posts here, assuming you follow the rules because those rules are what prevent the server from spiraling out of control.
    There are at least two errors in your analogy, in my view. One is that you are comparing something impossible (typing in 100 million posts) with something entirely possible (filling up a hard disk with data.)

    On a mobile phone, the term "unlimited minutes" for calling is physically limited to the number of minutes in a day. No matter what, you can't talk more than 1,440 minutes per day. That's the limit in an unlimited scenario. But that's OK, because it meets our expectations of what the term "unlimited" means. And that's where the second error I see comes in: failure to consider the customer expectations.

    "Unlimited disk space" is obviously not possible, so the host has other, hidden limits to trick the customer. They are limits on "inodes", or other measurements, to limit the GB of data or the number of files allowed. To compare it to WHT, you would have to see if WHT had a limit on the number of lines you could have in a post, or a number of characters available. You type in your 50th post, and a mod comes on and tells you that while you can have unlimited posts, you have exceeded your character allotment. Or, the number of commas you have used exceed the limits clearly spelled out in the TOS you never saw until AFTER you signed up.

    That is the game the unlimited hosts play. Instead of telling the customer that they have a limit on what they can store on-line, they tell them its "unlimited!" When they hit their limit, mid-sentence in our analogy, they find out they have used too many commas, and they are banned from the forum.

    Back to our real-world, every day happening in web hosting. The customer feels that he has been lied to. Like the victims of Bernie Madoff, it doesn't help that people will tell them they shouldn't have been greedy and should have realized it was "too good to be true". Their site is growing, and just at the time when they need their host the most to help them continue growing, they are abandoned and kicked off the server.

    I may have used too many commas, though, so I'll quit now. I don't want to run up against the limit in my posts.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by fshagan View Post
    There are at least two errors in your analogy, in my view. One is that you are comparing something impossible (typing in 100 million posts) with something entirely possible (filling up a hard disk with data.)
    100 million posts would be entirely possible if you don't follow the rules. You could setup ****** to run on your server making just 100,000 posts a day and after 1000 days you would have 100 million posts. Obviously that would be against the rules to spam even close to that.

    The same logic applies to shared hosting. A lot of big companies don't allow multiple back, file hosting websites, video/music hosting, and other things which use a lot of disk space.

    This is the basics of what I am saying:

    If the hosting company limits in other ways, they don't necessarily have to limit the space/bandwidth. I am not saying that you could possibly have no limitations at all. I am simply referring to space and bandwidth.

    I also see your point on space, but how can you justify the fact that unlimited bandwidth is impossible? Huge hosting companies can pay for unlimited bandwidth because although one customer may be using a lot more than their share, most customers on the same server aren't even going to be coming close to using their share of bandwidth.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Bharat
    Posts
    4,808
    So, this rant is about unlimited hosting or WHT rule not allowing to post such offerings?

    If it is about unlimited hosting, you can do unlimited discussion on this topic but the fact is there is no such thing as unlimited hosting.

    If you are pointing out WHT rule, then they do not advertise "unlimited posts" themselves and do not allow others to advertise "unlimited hosting" on this board.

    BTW instead of discussing this, better try to practically consume unlimited inodes/space, consume unlimited traffic/bandwidth, consume unlimited RAM and CPU and what not on an unlimited host and then come back with your findings.
    Vinsar.Net - Quality Web Hosting at Economical Price on USA & European Servers
    Offering domains, shared, reseller & VPS hosting.
    Reliable Domain Reseller Account Resell Domains with Confidence

  23. #23
    "In reality it all comes down to marketing and how a customer interprets the deals and offers on hand, it is a little bit like shopping really "

    It is exactly like shopping, companies know most will not use a lot of space because they are not the geeks, they know some are geeks and will use a lot which they will let them do and then there is a small fraction that are abusers which are taken care of. Also as you said it is is Marketing and if you look only the big companies offer unlimited service in general, most small companies don't because they are afraid to for a number of reasons such as abusers, growing to fast, etc. If you choose to target a customer group in which does not understand the market then you need to go unlimited however if you choose to target educated hosting people then this would be a bad move as they would not even sign up with you, they would also fear signing up with a company that offers a lot of disk, they would prefer signing up with companies that are 1,000-5,000mb. Don't even try and mention the word gb if it is $2-$3 they will run!

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 09-04-2010, 04:51 PM
  2. GetFreeLancer&WebHostingTalk hosting!!
    By Muhammad Mustafa in forum Managed Hosting and Services
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 11-18-2006, 08:39 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •