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  1. #1

    My webhost refuses to give me fresh IPs. What should I do?

    I've been with this webhost for two months. Their service is good, but they refuse to give me new IPs to replace the faulty IPs they gave me when I started with them.

    Once I requested an IP change, this is what they replied: Unfortunately after speaking with our NOC we are unable to change your IP, as it is against our policy and our agreement with Level 3. Although it's not the solution you expected I once again highly recommend moving your e-mail to Google apps. You can attempt to keep improving the reputation with your current IP set by sending a normal volume of non-spam mail and having your clients mark mail as non-spam, however this takes time.

    I think this is unfair. Should I cancel with them and request a refund for these two months?

    It really pisses me off that they give me faulty IPs and then refuse to change them. And I can't believe they are suggesting that I try to improve my reputation. My IP's reputation would be just fine if they had given me clean IP.

    The sad part about this is that this company is a very highly-reputable host here in WHT.

    So what should I do?

    THanks.

  2. #2
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    The "policy" on changing IPs makes no sense at all. Not sure what Level(3) has to do with their IP assignment policy to the clients.
    If Level(3) had an issue with them changing their customer's IP, they would most definitely have an issue with their IPs being used for spam by the previous client(s).

    You can't really ask for a refund as they did provide you service, but I would move ASAP, IMO.

  3. #3
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    What and where are the IP's black listed at?

    You can clean the IP's if you are not the cause of the problem.

  4. #4
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    How can an IP be "faulty" ?
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  5. #5
    I have no idea how hard it is to change an IP, but considering the fact that they know they are faulty, I would've thought they would make an effort to change them.

    They had been marked by two blacklists on mxtoolbox. Those are all currently clean.

    The problem now is that all my emails are being blocked by gmail, and hotmail is marking them as spam.

    Quote Originally Posted by Techark View Post
    You can clean the IP's if you are not the cause of the problem.
    How can I do this?

    Thanks.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Encrypted View Post
    He means blacklisted.
    But repeatedly says "faulty" (despite mentioning gmail) says nothing of blacklists.

    If this is due to a blacklisting issue, then the OP's is right, many upstreams do not allow the renumbering to get around spam blocks.

    However if the OP is not the spammer, then that doesn't apply, and it's their suppliers fault for reusing "tainted" ip's and they are allowed to renumber - and if the provider flatly refuses, then the only real solution for the OP is to move.
    Last edited by sirius; 05-08-2011 at 11:52 AM.
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  7. #7
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    Did you make sure the PTR record for the IP addresses matches the hostname your mail server uses to identify itself when the SMTP connection is made? If the mail server hostname and PTR record don't match, the big mail services automatically classify the messages as spam regardless of what IP address reputation is.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by vmhatup View Post
    I have no idea how hard it is to change an IP, but considering the fact that they know they are faulty, I would've thought they would make an effort to change them.

    They had been marked by two blacklists on mxtoolbox. Those are all currently clean.

    The problem now is that all my emails are being blocked by gmail, and hotmail is marking them as spam.


    How can I do this?

    Thanks.
    You say they are all clear on the black list at mxtoolbox now?

    Just hotmail and gmail blocking them?
    If so contact gmail and hotmail and be reasonable explain the circumstances ask why they are blocking you and what you can do to get your IP's unblocked.

    They will normally unblock you within 24 hours or so if you follow everything they ask you to do and can provide them with the info they ask for.

  9. #9
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    Who is the provider in question? Don't be scared to mention them here, if anything it sometimes gets them to move things along faster...
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by vmhatup View Post

    How can I do this?

    Thanks.

    You simply need to request the blacklists to remove your IP address. That's a simple process and doesn't take more than 24 hours. Once you get the IPs off blacklist, you still might need to wait 48-72 hours since it takes time for mail service providers to update the current lists.
    That should be able to get your mail into inbox on most providers.

    Or else, choose a new provider.
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  11. #11
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    Did you get the IP's blacklisted or were there blacklisted before you got them?

    I could see a company saying well you don't get to spam, get blacklisted and get new ips to do it again.
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  12. #12
    Can we know the ips so we can look into whether or not you have contributed to the current reputation of those ips? If the ips have dings against them since after you have received them then I can understand your DC not wanting to give you new ones.
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  13. #13
    Thanks for all the replies.

    I'm not going to post their name unless they refuse to do something about it. I've gone through all the proper channels, and finally will contact their rep here in WHT privately if their help center refuses to do what's right.

    If they don't do what they should've done two months ago, then I'll post a negative review here.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by othellotech View Post
    But repeatedly says "faulty" (despite mentioning gmail) says nothing of blacklists.


    Because unlike you I wanted clarification from the OP to understand the actual problem faced by them.

    If this is due to a blacklisting issue, then the OP's is right, many upstreams do not allow the renumbering to get around spam blocks.

    However if the OP is not the spammer, then that doesn't apply, and it's their suppliers fault for reusing "tainted" ip's and they are allowed to renumber - and if the provider flatly refuses, then the only real solution for the OP is to move.

    If this isn't blatantly obvious I don't know what is...

    You can attempt to keep improving the reputation with your current IP set by sending a normal volume of non-spam mail and having your clients mark mail as non-spam, however this takes time.
    My IP's reputation would be just fine if they had given me clean IP.


    Anyway, like the webhost stated.. you can easily clean the IP's up within a month with a little work.

    Contact MXtoolbox, they can probably help you get your IP's whitelisted.

    http://mxtoolbox.com/BlacklistSuggestions.aspx?ip= [<------enter your IP there]
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Encrypted View Post
    If this isn't blatantly obvious I don't know what is...






    Anyway, like the webhost stated.. you can easily clean the IP's up within a month with a little work.

    Contact MXtoolbox, they can probably help you get your IP's whitelisted.

    http://mxtoolbox.com/BlacklistSuggestions.aspx?ip= [<------enter your IP there]
    Hmm I read it as the host was blaming them for the blacklisting and they were saying it wasn't them but which is the truth.

    Perhaps I am still not reading it right.
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  16. #16
    I purchased their server on Feb. 26. On March 2, I created a ticket stating that all emails sent from my server were being marked as spam by both hotmail and gmail. Also on March 2, my IP was marked by two blacklists in mxtoolbox.

    They know it's their fault, but like I had previously mentioned, they say that "we are unable to change your IP, as it is against our policy and our agreement with Level 3".

    I know I can clean up my IP so it's whitelisted within a month, but why would I want to do that? What will happen to all the customers that I get in that month?

  17. #17
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    Hi

    Dont see why they cannot re allocate your ip's, If they were marked bad before you got the server, but if you are the cause of the blacklisting then I can see there objection.

    Good luck.

  18. #18
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    "Also on March 2, my IP was marked by two blacklists in mxtoolbox."

    So the IPs got marked bad AFTER you were delivered the server?
    Sounds like your fault then??

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by CGotzmann View Post
    "Also on March 2, my IP was marked by two blacklists in mxtoolbox."

    So the IPs got marked bad AFTER you were delivered the server?
    Sounds like your fault then??
    I'm not a network specialist, so once I found out about mxtoolbox, I plugged in my IP, and it was marked. Plus Hotmail and gmail have their own blacklists, so they were also marked there.

    As I have mentioned several times in this same thread, the host already recognizes their IP is bad. Besides, it's all in the tickets I opened.

    To make things clearer, the first two emails that were sent from my domain to hotmail and gmail were sent to SPAM and blocked, respectively.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by vmhatup View Post
    To make things clearer, the first two emails that were sent from my domain to hotmail and gmail were sent to SPAM and blocked, respectively.
    Have you setup SPF records?

  21. #21
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    As has been said if you are not the cause of the spam it takes about 24 hours to clean your IP if you contact gmail and hotmail and ask why and what they need to clear you.

    A heck of a lot less trouble than replacing IP's.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Techark View Post
    As has been said if you are not the cause of the spam it takes about 24 hours to clean your IP if you contact gmail and hotmail and ask why and what they need to clear you.

    A heck of a lot less trouble than replacing IP's.
    I'm just wondering--if the OP is not the cause of the spam, why can't the web host be responsible for the problem and either 1) get him new IPs or 2) do the legwork to quickly fix the issue?

    If I rented a new server, I would expect my IPs to be delivered to me clean, regardless of who can fix the problem. Time is money.
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  23. #23
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    The host should be helping him clean the IP's if they are tainted, but if it is an unmanaged server then he may need to do some things on the sever like SPF records proper DNS entries etc.
    He said there were 2 listings on the mxtoolbox for his IP's which have since been cleared.
    So it sounds to me like his IP's are now clean he says he had two messages sent to gmail and hotmail that ended up in a spam folder.
    So his IP's are not blocked by gmail or hotmail his message itself may have been labeled as spam because the subject line or the header set off a spam filter.

    Until he writes to gmail and hotmail to see why and if his IP is even blacklisted with them it is kind of fruitless to change IP's and be complaining here about.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nich View Post
    if the OP is not the cause of the spam, why can't the web host be responsible for the problem
    I purchased their server on Feb. 26.
    on March 2, my IP was marked by two blacklists in mxtoolbox.
    The OP _is_ the source of the spam complaints, so the server provider is correct, it's against their upstreams rules to renumber it to "bypass" the processes.
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by othellotech View Post
    The OP _is_ the source of the spam complaints, so the server provider is correct, it's against their upstreams rules to renumber it to "bypass" the processes.
    No, you're just reading it differently. It looks like the OP is _not_ the source of the problem and received bad IPs. The OP explains later on:

    Quote Originally Posted by vmhatup
    I'm not a network specialist, so once I found out about mxtoolbox, I plugged in my IP, and it was marked. Plus Hotmail and gmail have their own blacklists, so they were also marked there.

    As I have mentioned several times in this same thread, the host already recognizes their IP is bad. Besides, it's all in the tickets I opened.

    To make things clearer, the first two emails that were sent from my domain to hotmail and gmail were sent to SPAM and blocked, respectively.
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  26. #26
    Incredibly enough, this host gave me another set of blacklisted IPs. Unfortunate and frustrating, but true.

    The host contacted Windows Live Hotmail Domain Sender Team and this is what they replied. For those wanting to blame me, keep in mind that I have only sent a handful of emails just to check that the emails are not being blocked/spammed:

    From Windows Live Hotmail Sender Support Team:
    ----------------------------------------------------
    My name is Shirley and I work with the Windows Live Hotmail Sender Support Team.

    I have identified that messages from your IP(s) () are being filtered based on the recommendations of the SmartScreen® ( http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/f...pamfilter.mspx ) Filter Technology. After reviewing the information you provided and in compliance with our mail policies, we regret to inform you that we are unable to offer any kind of mitigation at this time.
    ----------------------------------------------------


    From Windows Live Hotmail Sender Support Team:
    ----------------------------------------------------
    First of all, we understand the importance of this issue. Unfortunately, we can't provide any mitigation on your IP even though that the IP was just recently purchased by a new client and there might be a compromise on this IP by the previous owner.

    One explanation for this is that emails from IP's are filtered based upon a combination of IP reputation and the content of individual emails. The reputation of an IP is influenced by a number of factors. Among these factors, which you as a sender can control, are:

    · The IP's Junk Mail Reporting complaint rate
    · The frequency and volume in which email is sent
    · The number of spam trap account hits
    · The RCPT success rate
    ----------------------------------------------------

    We are a new startup business, and I refuse to work my way up to an acceptable reputation.

    Myers

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by vmhatup View Post
    Incredibly enough, this host gave me another set of blacklisted IPs. Unfortunate and frustrating, but true.





    We are a new startup business, and I refuse to work my way up to an acceptable reputation.

    Myers
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  28. #28
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    Time to write that review you were talking about earlier.
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  29. #29
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    It's not hard at all to allocate new IPs..They should be doing this right away.

  30. #30
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    It sounds like they have been hosting too many spammers and the reputation of their IP blocks may be beyond repair. Give serious thought to moving to another provider.

  31. #31
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    is it possible to tell us the companys name so we all can avoid in future?

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by vmhatup View Post
    I've been with this webhost for two months. Their service is good, but they refuse to give me new IPs to replace the faulty IPs they gave me when I started with them.

    Once I requested an IP change, this is what they replied: Unfortunately after speaking with our NOC we are unable to change your IP, as it is against our policy and our agreement with Level 3. Although it's not the solution you expected I once again highly recommend moving your e-mail to Google apps. You can attempt to keep improving the reputation with your current IP set by sending a normal volume of non-spam mail and having your clients mark mail as non-spam, however this takes time.

    I think this is unfair. Should I cancel with them and request a refund for these two months?

    It really pisses me off that they give me faulty IPs and then refuse to change them. And I can't believe they are suggesting that I try to improve my reputation. My IP's reputation would be just fine if they had given me clean IP.

    The sad part about this is that this company is a very highly-reputable host here in WHT.

    So what should I do?

    THanks.

    Hi vmhatup,

    Isn't the issue more about your domain names being blacklisted rather than your IPs?

    As if its just about IP addresses, then purchasing a new block of IPs might be an easier solution,
    as opposed to trying to prove to the various organisations which maintain the lists that you are, in fact,
    a good person.

    Alternatively, if you are planning to send out a high volume of Email on a regular basis,
    you could look into a Mail Gateway service, like Amazon SES.

    Mail originating from such gateways is generally considered legitimate, due to the security
    checks that the providers perform, so you are less likely to end up in a similar predicament.


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  33. #33
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    Oh My God! vmhatup, Why are you not answering the questions people have asked?

    When you recieved the ip's originally were they blacklisted? If they were not that means you sent spam email, and your actions are the cause of the ip's being blacklisted. Did you send spam emails? The 2nd set of ip's the provider gave you, were they blacklisted before you sent any emails? If MSN/Hotmail told you the ip's were blacklisted due to a filter they have, did you ask why the filter is blocking the mail? Is it the content inside, an attatchment, or what?

    Have you tried purchasing a new ip from the datacenter/hosting service, and try it? Also, If you do try this. As soon as they tell you the new ip do a check on the ip immediately as soon as you get it, before sending any emails from the ip.

    If they then give you a new ip after you purchasing it, and it being blacklisted, and they not wanting to do anything about it your only choice is to leave them as it would be a good indication of them hosting spammers, and basically wanting you/their customers to do the dirty work of getting the ip's clean again instead of them dealing with it themselves.

    PS: I have a feeling this is BurstNet issue, but I may, or may not be wrong.. Please do not come lash out on me BurstNet if it isn't, or is you/BurstNet.
    Last edited by bluemer; 05-18-2011 at 06:12 PM.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluemer View Post
    Oh My God! vmhatup, Why are you not answering the questions people have asked?

    When you recieved the ip's originally were they blacklisted? If they were not that means you sent spam email, and your actions are the cause of the ip's being blacklisted. Did you send spam emails? The 2nd set of ip's the provider gave you, were they blacklisted before you sent any emails? If MSN/Hotmail told you the ip's were blacklisted due to a filter they have, did you ask why the filter is blocking the mail? Is it the content inside, an attatchment, or what?

    Have you tried purchasing a new ip from the datacenter/hosting service, and try it? Also, If you do try this. As soon as they tell you the new ip do a check on the ip immediately as soon as you get it, before sending any emails from the ip.

    If they then give you a new ip after you purchasing it, and it being blacklisted, and they not wanting to do anything about it your only choice is to leave them as it would be a good indication of them hosting spammers, and basically wanting you/their customers to do the dirty work of getting the ip's clean again instead of them dealing with it themselves.

    PS: I have a feeling this is BurstNet issue, but I may, or may not be wrong.. Please do not come lash out on me BurstNet if it isn't, or is you/BurstNet.
    The OP already stated numerous times that the IPs were already blacklisted when they received them. They even got a 2nd block that was also already blacklisted.

    Although, if you contact Hotmail and Gmail and tell them that these are new IPs for you, they should delist them. Your host should help you with that as well.

    If your host is unable to do anything, then you may want to move providers.
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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by ayksolutions View Post
    The OP already stated numerous times that the IPs were already blacklisted when they received them. They even got a 2nd block that was also already blacklisted.

    Although, if you contact Hotmail and Gmail and tell them that these are new IPs for you, they should delist them. Your host should help you with that as well.

    If your host is unable to do anything, then you may want to move providers.

    I first thought that, but I didn't actually see a blatant statement of the OP saying they were blacklisted when he/she got them. If someone was planning on doing e-mail I would think checking the ip's would be one of the first things they do. Although I have idiot moments myself, and wouldn't blame the OP for it if he/she is actually getting a startup going because I can imagine there is 100 other things he/she is working on aswell..

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by vmhatup View Post
    We are a new startup business, and I refuse to work my way up to an acceptable reputation.
    Then get out of business. You don't "start" with an acceptable reputation, you start as an unknown and work your way up. THAT is how it is.

    As far as "faulty ip's", no ip is "faulty". If it's in a blacklist, get it off of there. MOST will take you out of there after X amount of time as a non spammer. Don't blame the host, it's not THEIR fault ipv4 is in a shortage right now.
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  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by linux-tech View Post
    Then get out of business. You don't "start" with an acceptable reputation, you start as an unknown and work your way up. THAT is how it is.

    As far as "faulty ip's", no ip is "faulty". If it's in a blacklist, get it off of there. MOST will take you out of there after X amount of time as a non spammer. Don't blame the host, it's not THEIR fault ipv4 is in a shortage right now.
    Err .. think about this from another point of view.

    He isn't getting IP's with NO reputation and has to build it up. He is getting IP's with NEGATIVE reputation and has to correct it from what the previous owner did with it.

    I don't think this is the OP's task to do so and it isn't unreasonable to say that he is a start up and doesn't want the associated hassles of cleaning up someone else's mess while trying to do their best to build their business.

    It is very much the host's fault. They can't provide ONE IP that isn't blacklisted? If they can't this customer should move. You and I have the time and knowledge to clean up reputation but this isn't a service provider they just want to send mail.

    Just think about it from the customer point of view.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coolraul View Post
    Err .. think about this from another point of view.

    He isn't getting IP's with NO reputation and has to build it up. He is getting IP's with NEGATIVE reputation and has to correct it from what the previous owner did with it.

    I don't think this is the OP's task to do so and it isn't unreasonable to say that he is a start up and doesn't want the associated hassles of cleaning up someone else's mess while trying to do their best to build their business.

    It is very much the host's fault. They can't provide ONE IP that isn't blacklisted? If they can't this customer should move. You and I have the time and knowledge to clean up reputation but this isn't a service provider they just want to send mail.

    Just think about it from the customer point of view.
    I do agree and feel the hosting company should release the IP's and assign the client new IP Addresses.

    This will allow the company to get the IP's whitelisted again then be able to give them to future customers starting with no reputation.

    I do wish you luck on resolving this, and really feel you will win this battle. Worse come to worse there are other hosts out there!

  39. #39
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    Personally, if it took them two months to issue you new Ips (which were also blacklisted), I would simply cancel and move onto a different provider. Also, the initial response they gave you regarding the IP's is unacceptable in my opinion (that in itself would have been enough to convince to move to a different provider).
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  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluemer View Post
    PS: I have a feeling this is BurstNet issue, but I may, or may not be wrong.. Please do not come lash out on me BurstNet if it isn't, or is you/BurstNet.
    How can we not drop in here once you say you think it is us?

    It's not us. The original response kinda sums it up. We have no "Level 3", whatever that means.

    Could it possibly be a reseller of ours? Sure. But we help with IP's all the time. Dunno why we would deny this one IF our reseller came to us.

    Lack of data makes this a moot point, however. But please don't speculate in the future unless it's something GOOD.

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