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  1. #1

    Buyvm vs. Quickweb experience

    I was looking for an affordable replacement for my Quickweb VPS recently. Stability has been rock solid but their disk i/o has been a bit disappointing at times. It is usually around 125MB/s but seems to get down to 50MB/s occasionally.

    I was persuaded by all the positive hype to sign up with Buyvm. I thought I was lucky to get in when they recently released stock and was very impressed by their consistently high disk i/o (~350MB/s). This is the highest I've ever seen on a VPS and even higher then some Hostdime and Liquidweb dedicateds I've worked on.

    This morning I was surprised to be alerted by Pingdom that my new Buyvm VPS was unreachable. I logged a ticket with Buyvm but did not receive a response for 4 hours. I tried their IRC only to get jested by a fanboy "why was I expecting 24/7 hour support for so cheap?" I guess because I've been spoiled by Quickweb.

    Apparently the node my Buyvm VPS was on locked up and needed to be rebooted. Buyvm's justification for the 4 hour delay was they had some ticket back log and their monitoring system failed due to solely relying on ping requests, which is not always an accurate determination of service interruptions.

    Luckily I did not cancel my Quickweb VPS yet so moving back to them is easy. I had a few issues and they have always fixed them within 20 minutes, which is what they advertise. I am thinking the extra $6/mo for a more reliable but slightly slower service might be worth it in my case of hosting SMB clients who depend on their website yet have a tight budget.

  2. #2
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    Sorry to hear your bad buyvm experience.

    One thing to note with the disk speeds you are getting with quickweb is less than 50MB/s is really only an issue if you are running large streaming or file sharing sites. IOP's matter more than straight single file transfer speeds more often than not.

    Cloud hosting for example depending on the setup will show you 30MB/s speeds and could give better website performanec than a host with 350MB/s speeds.

  3. #3
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    So how long have you been with them?

    You had a few issues and probably haven't even been with them a week and you are already judging?

    /facepalm

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by reflexiv View Post
    SMB clients who depend on their website yet have a tight budget.
    What do you define as "tight budget"...
    UK Based Proactive Server Management.
    Zabbix Enterprise 24/7 Monitoring.

  5. #5
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    Our 128MB nodes (what node08 was) normally run around 8M - 9M inodes and that can take a bit to FSCK.

    The vast majority of our nodes are well into the 80 - 200+ day range with the 80's only there because we rebased everything.

    If your IO is lower than what it should be (most people are in the 200 range) then you should log a ticket Some nodes will get into the 400MB/sec range.

    Your node wasn't dropping pings so it didn't throw off any alerts, it was simply deadlocked.

    I apologize if it hasn't quite met your expectations within the first week, things have been a zoo and with us processing the amount of orders we've had We've been going through each node that was opened for sales and checking for any abusive users and either terminating them or putting them on a box running 2.6.32 so we can rate limit their usage.

    Francisco
    BuyVM - OpenVZ & KVM Based VPS Servers - Chat with us
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  6. #6
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    D'oh, missed the editing window:

    Looks like i'm wrong and node08 got redesignated to 1024/2GB plans. If you're actually on node08, this is from our side:

    (14:19:32) node08:~ root: dd if=/dev/zero of=test bs=64k count=16k conv=fdatasync
    16384+0 records in
    16384+0 records out
    1073741824 bytes (1.1 GB) copied, 3.33719 s, 322 MB/s
    It's quite possible your I/O dip was a lead up to the blow out. I'll bring it up with Anthony and see if he had anything on the KVM that would be useful
    BuyVM - OpenVZ & KVM Based VPS Servers - Chat with us
    - All popular VPN methods supported
    - Affordable offloaded MySQL & DDoS protection
    - 5GB backup space, unmetered private LAN bandwidth & native IPv6 included. All with a strong serving of pony

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeltaAnime View Post
    D'oh, missed the editing window:

    Looks like i'm wrong and node08 got redesignated to 1024/2GB plans. If you're actually on node08, this is from our side:



    It's quite possible your I/O dip was a lead up to the blow out. I'll bring it up with Anthony and see if he had anything on the KVM that would be useful
    I believe the i/o dips being spoken of was from quickweb not buyvm

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by techjr View Post
    I believe the i/o dips being spoken of was from quickweb not buyvm
    Oh?

    If that's the case, my mistake Half asleep right now.

    Francisco
    BuyVM - OpenVZ & KVM Based VPS Servers - Chat with us
    - All popular VPN methods supported
    - Affordable offloaded MySQL & DDoS protection
    - 5GB backup space, unmetered private LAN bandwidth & native IPv6 included. All with a strong serving of pony

  9. #9
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    Fanboys' on their IRC channel, noooo - I don't believe that . Annoying if I say so myself.

    I've been with BuyVM myself, but to only host non-mission critical services. Mostly used for storage/backups. For the sake of your sanity don't move your websites back to BuyVM. Don't cut corners.

    I've never personally been with QuickWeb (but I have heard good things), but I would recommend Hostigation (Tim is a BEAST... he cannot be human, seriously). Just started hosting a few blogs with SecureDragon (128) and haven't had any issues (been VERY impressed, if this keeps up, it will replace my #1 spot for budget VPSs).

    QuickWeb is fine though... it's impossible to fill that 50MBps disk speed on a 100 megabit port. Or a 1 Gbps port would be half saturated before you bottle neck the drives. Now with disk IO, that's where you'll bottleneck and feel FAR before you run out of disk speed. So don't worry about your disk speed.

    If it makes you feel any better my drives only push out 120 MBps and I run SSDs in my servers.
    Last edited by Noopy; 04-06-2012 at 01:55 AM.

  10. #10
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    as the OP stated he hits 50MB/s occasionally and is definitely not the case on majority of our servers we even have SSD nodes if sustained high i/o performance is a requirement, there could be many reason why it went that low some time and abusers are mostly the reason as some people apparently having fun running the i/o test and bench marking which they don't know is definitely affecting the server's performance rather than let server do something productive for everyone.

    Thanks for praising our support that's where we are putting all of our energy and efforts even at the barrel bottom price, people should be entitle for timely support from host.

    Have a good easter everyone.
    QuickWeb™ -We Host Servers Like a Boss!
    New Zealand - USA - UK - Germany Virtual Servers
    Worldwide hosting provider with proven 24x7 and 25-Minute Support!
    www.quickweb.co.nz

  11. #11
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    BuyVM is fine for production usage. You need to understand that '**** happens', and it does at rackspace too.

    Have a recovery plan and you'll be fine.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wintereise View Post
    BuyVM is fine for production usage. You need to understand that '**** happens', and it does at rackspace too.

    Have a recovery plan and you'll be fine.
    Lol stop fooling yourself. If you honestly host a website with them that makes more than $20/day, I feel sorry for you.

    Recovery plan is a must always regardless your provider. But personally I would rather work with a company that provides better/faster/friendlier support + better uptime and snappier nodes.

    I would also rather not host with a company where a spammed hard refresh crashes/hangs my VPS for a minute.

    Don't bother with the hassle... don't cut corners.

    I'm not saying BuyVM is terrible (trust me for 15 bucks a month, wow). If you never need to open a support/billing ticket and it's a non-critical business/project -- go with them. But consider another provider if you would rather not worry if your VPS is up or down, responsive or not, etc. I would suggest your try these providers yourself and be the judge.
    Last edited by Noopy; 04-06-2012 at 06:09 AM.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by DeltaAnime View Post
    It's quite possible your I/O dip was a lead up to the blow out. I'll bring it up with Anthony and see if he had anything on the KVM that would be useful
    Francisco, my Buyvm disk speed has always been phenomenal. Now if you just took some of your skill and applied it towards your monitoring system, you would have an unbeatable product. Why are you monitoring nodes with just ping responses? Why not do something a little more reliable like setup a dummy VPS with web server on each node just for monitoring and use Nagios, Zabbix, or related app to check http response on that dummy VPS?

    Quote Originally Posted by gigist View Post
    it's impossible to fill that 50MBps disk speed on a 100 megabit port. Or a 1 Gbps port would be half saturated before you bottle neck the drives. Now with disk IO, that's where you'll bottleneck and feel FAR before you run out of disk speed. So don't worry about your disk speed.
    Thanks gigist, I hadn't considered that 125MB/s would be adequate. How are you differentiating between disk io and speed? I thought they were pretty much the same.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wintereise View Post
    BuyVM is fine for production usage. You need to understand that '**** happens', and it does at rackspace too.
    That's why I hesitate to recommend providers. I hate to recommend a provider that I've had a good experience, then have that same provider start having performance issues. It can happen to any provider.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by gigist View Post
    Lol stop fooling yourself. If you honestly host a website with them that makes more than $20/day, I feel sorry for you.

    Recovery plan is a must always regardless your provider. But personally I would rather work with a company that provides better/faster/friendlier support + better uptime and snappier nodes.

    I would also rather not host with a company where a spammed hard refresh crashes/hangs my VPS for a minute.

    Don't bother with the hassle... don't cut corners.

    I'm not saying BuyVM is terrible (trust me for 15 bucks a month, wow). If you never need to open a support/billing ticket and it's a non-critical business/project -- go with them. But consider another provider if you would rather not worry if your VPS is up or down, responsive or not, etc. I would suggest your try these providers yourself and be the judge.
    If you have a backup plan, than I see no problem with hosting a site that makes more than $20/day with them. If you know what you're doing, than you won't need any support except for billing. What's the issue with maximizing profits?

    BuyVM honestly has better speed, uptime, and support than most other VPS companies.
    My personal blog -- rubiverse.net

  16. #16
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    @ OP , what services are you running on your Quickweb VPS that temporary 50MB/s access to your disk is not fast enough?

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by flam316 View Post
    If you have a backup plan, than I see no problem with hosting a site that makes more than $20/day with them.
    Backing up isn't going to protect you from outages or slow service. Downtime and overselling seem to be the biggest problems with budget VPS hosts.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by reflexiv View Post
    Francisco, my Buyvm disk speed has always been phenomenal. Now if you just took some of your skill and applied it towards your monitoring system, you would have an unbeatable product. Why are you monitoring nodes with just ping responses? Why not do something a little more reliable like setup a dummy VPS with web server on each node just for monitoring and use Nagios, Zabbix, or related app to check http response on that dummy VPS?
    We had much better monitoring before we re-rolled things to debian We had a zabbix box setup that monitored everything. In our big rebase/upgrades we never had the chance to re-roll all of that.

    With that being said, it's likely going to be my weekend project.

    Francisco
    BuyVM - OpenVZ & KVM Based VPS Servers - Chat with us
    - All popular VPN methods supported
    - Affordable offloaded MySQL & DDoS protection
    - 5GB backup space, unmetered private LAN bandwidth & native IPv6 included. All with a strong serving of pony

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by ajonate View Post
    Backing up isn't going to protect you from outages or slow service. Downtime and overselling seem to be the biggest problems with budget VPS hosts.
    True, to an extent. Backups will protect you from outages; that's kind of the point of a backup.

    Of course, this is irrelevant because BuyVM doesn't have any of these issues.
    My personal blog -- rubiverse.net

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by flam316 View Post
    True, to an extent. Backups will protect you from outages; that's kind of the point of a backup.
    I suppose it depends on what "outage" means to you. If your VPS goes down for a few hours, how is a backup going to help you?

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajonate View Post
    I suppose it depends on what "outage" means to you. If your VPS goes down for a few hours, how is a backup going to help you?
    Backups that are mirrored to another VPS with automatic DNS failover.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orien View Post
    Backups that are mirrored to another VPS with automatic DNS failover.
    We wouldn't call that a backup. That would be replication. I have a replicated pair of servers. That's pretty advanced stuff.

  23. #23
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    Thanks for the kind words

    People just want us to improve the proactive monitoring we do on the nodes themselves, not just for abuse on them. Crashes aren't a common thing on our 2.6.18 kernel nodes but still, it has happened.

    Either way, what I can say is that a full outside monitoring setup is in testing already, we're just finalizing what we like the most. All goes as planned we'll have it in full production for Monday.

    Francisco
    BuyVM - OpenVZ & KVM Based VPS Servers - Chat with us
    - All popular VPN methods supported
    - Affordable offloaded MySQL & DDoS protection
    - 5GB backup space, unmetered private LAN bandwidth & native IPv6 included. All with a strong serving of pony

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by DeltaAnime View Post
    Thanks for the kind words

    People just want us to improve the proactive monitoring we do on the nodes themselves, not just for abuse on them. Crashes aren't a common thing on our 2.6.18 kernel nodes but still, it has happened.

    Either way, what I can say is that a full outside monitoring setup is in testing already, we're just finalizing what we like the most. All goes as planned we'll have it in full production for Monday.

    Francisco
    That sounds awesome and should help a lot. Just wish you guys had an east coast local. 85ms is a tad to much for a MC server for my tastes.
    My personal blog -- rubiverse.net

  25. #25
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    Can't comment on quickweb, but i use buyvm as well for some projects and they're excellent for their price especially on bandwidth quota and internal ip access on each VPS. They're unmanaged and didn't expect much on that front for price paid. Would love it if they elaborated and updated their wiki on KVM setups, got my first ever KVM recently and had to jump on IRC (don't use it at all usually) to get help.

    Only problem i had with buyvm was when they moved some VPS of mine to different nodes (on 3 or 4 occassions), as I loose internal ip connectivity until I reboot all VPSes.

    But I have 100% uptime, as I have 5x VPS all load balanced (4x buyvm (3x openvz + 1x kvm) + 1x other vps with another provider which acts as secondary haproxy load balancer for failover). You can't beat 5x VPS load balanced setup for US$33/month for combined 12 cpu cores and 9,500GB/month of bandwidth

    So high uptime isn't out of the question, you just have to configure and set it up yourself

    Great news on new monitoring system you have planned though
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