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  1. #1
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    MS Expression Web - Anyone used it?

    I like having a website, however I don't really code.
    This is probably why I've been a big fan of the GUI based web design packages.
    I settled on FrontPage 2000 and then became an even biiger fan with FrontPage 2003.
    My current main site was done in FP2003 and is fully HTML 4.01 compliant - It just took that little bit of time to make sure my template was OK.
    The reason I like FP2003 - I can do a fair amount of work on my site and pages through the GUI, in fact most of it.
    However if I do want to manually change any code, add in controls for the search software I use etc I can very easily do so.

    I learn't a while back that FrontPage was to be replaced with MS Expression.
    I just wondered if anyone had used Expression Web and could tell me how it compares to the likes of FrontPage?
    I don't mid something a little more complicated, but going too OTT defeats the point for me as the whole reason for something GUI based is to make life easier for me.
    Can anyone tell me what kind of product Expression Web is and if basically it's any good?
    Seems there are some good upgrade (from FrontPage) prices to be had on it.

    Thanks.

  2. #2
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    Yeah I use Expression Web and it's a fantastic editor. It adheres to compliant code too. In fact, it'll show you in real-time if you have HTML errors or non-compliant code.

    You can also attach stylesheets, choose inline styles, or use a CSS and it'll add all your vars to the CSS instead of putting them in the page.

    Take a little getting use to, but I love it.

    Not only that, you can edit sites live and they do not need to be running FP extensions.
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  3. #3
    I tried it, had a Beta version...which wouldn't uninstall. So after faffing around its finally gone. It was a big improvement from Frontpage, with it now having some standards. However i still prefer Dreamweaver.

  4. #4
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    IMO if anyone's going to build more than 2 websites in their lifetime it would be best to learn HTML & CSS. Then if you need to, use Dreamveaver.

    Expressions, just like Frontpage is a joke. Microsoft will never get it right.
    | | i write code

  5. #5
    Both frontpage and dreamweaver have had their own issues. If I had to actually buy something now I would buy expression.

    hehe, how much is it by the way? </duh!>

    James.

  6. #6
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    I didn't want to start any fights on the merit of "learning the code".
    I like life to be easy for me.
    Why use command lines when I can do exactly the same with 2 clicks of a mouse?
    Why do I use half of the software I use - because it makes life easy for me, if it doesn't then it isn't doing it's job so why am I using it?

    In my world there is no point leaning to code, spending time coding if there is an application out there that can do it for me.
    I don't own a cat and expect to catch my own mice.
    I wouldn't own a dog and expect to bark myself....

    I like FrontPage 2003 because it is easy to use and the final results to me are both pleasing on the eye and HTML compliant.
    I personally couldn't get on with Dreamweaver when I first used it, however that was back at Dreamweaver 3 so maybe things have changed now.

    An upgrade from FrontPage 2003 to Expression Web will cost me around £80 all in.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by siforek
    IMO if anyone's going to build more than 2 websites in their lifetime it would be best to learn HTML & CSS. Then if you need to, use Dreamveaver.

    Expressions, just like Frontpage is a joke. Microsoft will never get it right.
    This is a very uneducated answer.

    What are your specific points? what makes it 'a joke'?
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bladerunner
    I didn't want to start any fights on the merit of "learning the code".
    I like life to be easy for me.
    Why use command lines when I can do exactly the same with 2 clicks of a mouse?
    Why do I use half of the software I use - because it makes life easy for me, if it doesn't then it isn't doing it's job so why am I using it?

    In my world there is no point leaning to code, spending time coding if there is an application out there that can do it for me.
    I don't own a cat and expect to catch my own mice.
    I wouldn't own a dog and expect to bark myself....

    I like FrontPage 2003 because it is easy to use and the final results to me are both pleasing on the eye and HTML compliant.
    I personally couldn't get on with Dreamweaver when I first used it, however that was back at Dreamweaver 3 so maybe things have changed now.

    An upgrade from FrontPage 2003 to Expression Web will cost me around £80 all in.
    Yeah it's a good purchase. definitely do it.

    I've used Dreamweaver off and on for years. It's better than FP2003 but that's not the case in Expression Web. Since FrontPage extensions are gone, they finally built this so you can edit your sites live without the extensions. Of course the optimal is to edit locally then publish your changes. which is still possible.

    I highly recommend learning the code. it's very nice to know, and will really save a ton of time when editing pages. There's also certain things that the GUIs (all of them) just won't do. they require manual code.

    Don't be botherd about people who knock GUIs and the bandwagon "microsoft sucks' gig. it's not much different than the people who 'claim' they use notepad only to build sites. Being slow and outdated isn't something to brag about. The tools like these are around because they save a ton of time. You're thinking in the right direction
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bladerunner
    I didn't want to start any fights on the merit of "learning the code".
    I've found that using expression it is easier to work in code... IMO... I also went from frontpage 2003. While I've never had any issues with frontpage on the code side (never used templates, etc), I can see why many people "hate" the product.

    After messing around with CSS, I highly recommend taking an afternoon and looking over some of the new MS templates or templates from free sites with the idea of printing the code and understanding how it works... the basic way css works is simply great... and makes building a site and running a site very simple for the small business owner.

    Expression is a different animal all together from frontpage.... MS produced a very nice product, IMO. With that said, I would recommend that you download the trial version and see where that takes you...

    The only thing negative I could say about the product is the "missing" feature called "includes." Of course, that is an easy fix, if you understand the code or know how to import the feature into a custom script (I think that is the right name). There are sites that show you how to do this....

    I would download and test it... I think you get 30 or 60 days free trial....
    Windows 10 to Linux and Mac OSX: I'm PARSECs better than you. Eat my dust!!!

  10. #10
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    Thank you all for the replies.
    BTW - I wasn't knocking anyone who does code their own sites totally.
    In fact I have a lot of respect for them, to start with for example an empty "Notepad" page and to turn that into a web page does impress me a lot.

    I guess the words I should have used were "for me I can't see the merits of learning everything there is to about code".
    I have my own personal website and there are a couple of extremely small business ventures I'm looking into which will require sites.
    However I don't do it for a living, so all I need is something that looks clean.

    I think I'll give the package ago - I'll get myself a couple of the Expression Web books from Amazon and spend a weekend on it and see how I go.
    I know my copy of FP2003 shouldn't ever just stop working, but it's 4 years old now and MS have obviously killed that product line so I feel it is probably worth while me moving now and in my own time rather than a forced move further down the line.

    Thanks again.

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