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  1. #1
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    Web Hosts, Be Careful and Check Your TOS - PayPal made changes

    Just sending this out to others in case they didn't recieve the email.

    Important changes to PayPal Seller and Buyer Protection



    We’ve expanded the PayPal Seller Protection program to give you even greater coverage on your transactions almost anywhere in the world.* We’d also like to update you on key changes to our Buyer Protection program that may impact your transactions. Here’s what’s changing:


    Seller Protection now covers transactions even when the buyer’s address is unconfirmed. We’ve removed the ‘confirmed address eligibility’ requirement. That means we’ll cover millions of additional domestic and international transactions so you can sell to more customers and know your eligible transactions are protected.

    • If you use the PayPal account filter that blocks unconfirmed addresses, that filter has been turned off allowing more transactions to be eligible for Seller Protection coverage. Make sure you ship the item to the recipient’s shipping address on the Transaction Details page.



    • Buyers now have up to 180 days to file a dispute. In addition, custom-made products will be eligible for PayPal Buyer Protection coverage if the item was not received. Make sure to retain proof of delivery and other evidence of your transaction for at least 180 days to be eligible for Seller Protection. If you receive a claim from a buyer, keep these updates in mind and respond in the Resolution Centre as usual. For more detail on all of the User Agreement changes, take a look at our Policy Updates page.




    Personally, I've had no issues with PayPal. There was one time, but overall they work 98%. No rocket science involved. They process the payment for a Client or customer. I don't have to worry about "losing" information I never had. I know some will argue about PayPal, but nothing is 100%. Even with an offline business, banks run into issues too.

    But these two changes alone could cause some issues. I won't say the negatives since anyone with common sense should immediately see the issues at hand...but I will say two things that could help customers and hosts;

    1. Customers. DO YOUR RESEARCH BEFORE SIGNING UP WITH A HOST. When an issue arises, some hosts would leave you hanging for about 45 days to see if you'll play along and play the waiting game with them.

    2. Hosts. Go over your TOS NOW. That "nice" customer of today...........June.....that's all I'm saying.


    If you give customers good service, you "should" have no issues.

    Take Care Everyone

  2. #2
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    180 days is a long refund period for sure, something that will be abused by bad customers. It definitely will apply pressure to sellers that aren't offering an acceptable level of service/support post sale.
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by 48-14 View Post
    If you give customers good service, you "should" have no issues
    Yup. As long as you provide adequate service and support you shouldn't have any issues, for the most part. We all know there's no such thing as a 100% satisfaction rate (try as we might), but avoiding issues starts with providing good service.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle-HostMetro View Post
    Yup. As long as you provide adequate service and support you shouldn't have any issues, for the most part. We all know there's no such thing as a 100% satisfaction rate (try as we might), but avoiding issues starts with providing good service.
    Don't know what world you're in right now, but this is earth lol You can treat a customer great and he will still blame you when he messes everything up.

    Look at most of the negative review threads if you don't believe me.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by @Jesse View Post
    Don't know what world you're in right now, but this is earth lol You can treat a customer great and he will still blame you when he messes everything up.

    Look at most of the negative review threads if you don't believe me.
    I suppose I should have said you shouldn't have *many* issues. There will always be unhappy customers even when you bend over backwards to help them. It's the nature of pretty much any business.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle-HostMetro View Post
    I suppose I should have said you shouldn't have *many* issues. There will always be unhappy customers even when you bend over backwards to help them. It's the nature of pretty much any business.
    Sadly some are like that. Use it for two months happily, then want their money back for some unknown reason.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by @Jesse View Post
    Sadly some are like that. Use it for two months happily, then want their money back for some unknown reason.
    ^^^^ Exactly. Two months, depending on the account...not so bad to write off a problematic customer. It's always easier to say "you know what, were not the right fit, here's your $xx for two months, and thank you". But to do this for a 6 month account is a scam waiting to happen

  8. #8
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    Yeah I got this email today also. Where is paypal's Seller Protection? These days I seen more buyer scams than seller scams lol. Mind you I've only every had 2 paypal disputes, and it was because of fraud sales that got through fraud checks. I knew it was and refunded, but for some reason the dispute was still opened a month after I already refunded lol.

    But in any case paypal is maybe trying to make people leave to another payment gateway. Because 180 days is very unreasonable. To me a buyer should not have to wait as long as 180 days. If they don't get a product or service within 30 days they should get all the money back. So there is no reason to have anything more than 60 days in my opinion. Buyers just need to less be trusting and don't let someone give you the run around. Give them a reasonable time frame than dispute. That would solve 99% of real issues.

    Would paypal actually refund someone that used 6 months of hosting service? I've honestly never had a dispute like this. Normally I just give a 30 day money back. Since it's a noraml standard in business to do so. I don't need a reason. Although it would be nice to know so you know where you need to improve in your business. But other than that, anything else is unreasonable. Unless it's prorated services.

    My 2 cents.
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  9. #9
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    The reason for this is their old time for disputes if it was passed they had to tell customers to talk to the credit card companies which ends in charge backs which are not won as easy.
    With the 180 days now they can "deal" with it without referring people to the credit card companies which is a big win for us hosting providers.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Purevoltage View Post
    The reason for this is their old time for disputes if it was passed they had to tell customers to talk to the credit card companies which ends in charge backs which are not won as easy.
    With the 180 days now they can "deal" with it without referring people to the credit card companies which is a big win for us hosting providers.
    Is it a win because a hosting provider would often lose against a credit card dispute, but have a better chance with paypal?
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by srpurdy View Post
    Is it a win because a hosting provider would often lose against a credit card dispute, but have a better chance with paypal?
    Good point since the time to file chargeback is shorter. All the host has to do is keep the person waiting on a lease until the credit cards period runs out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Purevoltage View Post
    With the 180 days now they can "deal" with it without referring people to the credit card companies which is a big win for us hosting providers.

    I'm not sure if it's any better. If a host (or any company) takes 45 days to resolve an issue...that's already 44 days too long....but to keep a messy situation for half a year.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by @Jesse View Post
    Sadly some are like that. Use it for two months happily, then want their money back for some unknown reason.
    True which is why we need to choose carefully too especially avoid those countries with plenty of fraud.

    Choose and choose wisely.

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  13. #13
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    you are so wrong there is no time limit on amx chargebacks sure if its older then 6 months its hard to do but there is no specific limit.



    Quote Originally Posted by 48-14 View Post
    Good point since the time to file chargeback is shorter. All the host has to do is keep the person waiting on a lease until the credit cards period runs out.




    I'm not sure if it's any better. If a host (or any company) takes 45 days to resolve an issue...that's already 44 days too long....but to keep a messy situation for half a year.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyberhouse View Post
    you are so wrong there is no time limit on amx chargebacks sure if its older then 6 months its hard to do but there is no specific limit.
    Some banks do have limits, or people would be doing chargebacks all the time and claiming all sorts of excuses.

    Two banks have it listed;

    If the merchant is not cooperative, you should turn to your credit card company. You need to dispute a charge shortly after it appears on your statement. If you dispute a charge after you paid the credit card bill, it may be too late to reverse the charge.

    You should advise the Bank within a 30 calendar day period of any discrepancies. Claims for disputed transactions over 30 calendar days old may not be accepted by Loss Prevention.

    The others, not in those exact words, but still within a reasonable amount of time.

    It's only common sense. Anyone that doesn't look at their monthly statement is going to end up with issues down the road. I've lost count on the amount of times I've gotten credits on any service related account because of errors or improper charges. I work for my money and have a family. I'm going giving it away.

    If I paid my Credit Card bill (or any bill) without looking at it;

    1. it means I'm a fool and cannot manage money
    2. it means I acknowledged the charges of the money I borrowed or I wouldn't pay for it

  15. #15
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    different banks have different rules.

    my point was only that amx has no charge back limit.

    thats the reason ever paypal purchase i make is using my amx never paypal balance.


    Quote Originally Posted by 48-14 View Post
    Some banks do have limits, or people would be doing chargebacks all the time and claiming all sorts of excuses.

    Two banks have it listed;

    If the merchant is not cooperative, you should turn to your credit card company. You need to dispute a charge shortly after it appears on your statement. If you dispute a charge after you paid the credit card bill, it may be too late to reverse the charge.

    You should advise the Bank within a 30 calendar day period of any discrepancies. Claims for disputed transactions over 30 calendar days old may not be accepted by Loss Prevention.

    The others, not in those exact words, but still within a reasonable amount of time.

    It's only common sense. Anyone that doesn't look at their monthly statement is going to end up with issues down the road. I've lost count on the amount of times I've gotten credits on any service related account because of errors or improper charges. I work for my money and have a family. I'm going giving it away.

    If I paid my Credit Card bill (or any bill) without looking at it;

    1. it means I'm a fool and cannot manage money
    2. it means I acknowledged the charges of the money I borrowed or I wouldn't pay for it

  16. #16
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    Honestly don't think it will cause a high increase of issues, unless your the worst host on the planet.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by 48-14 View Post
    Some banks do have limits, or people would be doing chargebacks all the time and claiming all sorts of excuses.

    Two banks have it listed;

    If the merchant is not cooperative, you should turn to your credit card company. You need to dispute a charge shortly after it appears on your statement. If you dispute a charge after you paid the credit card bill, it may be too late to reverse the charge.

    You should advise the Bank within a 30 calendar day period of any discrepancies. Claims for disputed transactions over 30 calendar days old may not be accepted by Loss Prevention.

    The others, not in those exact words, but still within a reasonable amount of time.

    It's only common sense. Anyone that doesn't look at their monthly statement is going to end up with issues down the road. I've lost count on the amount of times I've gotten credits on any service related account because of errors or improper charges. I work for my money and have a family. I'm going giving it away.

    If I paid my Credit Card bill (or any bill) without looking at it;

    1. it means I'm a fool and cannot manage money
    2. it means I acknowledged the charges of the money I borrowed or I wouldn't pay for it
    Lol it's true. But you would be surprised how many people ignore it and just pay they're bill. One time I ordered Chinese food at a place, and they double charged me. So I called my credit card company the day I saw it listed on my transactions (online) The lady on the other end. Was like no problem we will remove the double charge, but than said. "If only more people paid that much attention to they're accounts like you have"

    I laughed....

    Sometimes if I ever pay interest, which is not often. I calculate the interest myself. I don't trust anyone. I've seen well respected companies try to hide fake charges on all kinds of different bills knowing full well that most people it seems like don't even question it. lol

    I've seen a telephone company for example offer $100 for TV internet and phone. only to change the price in 3 months to twice that. Than when called to complain they lower back to the $100 again to only increase it again to $200+ in 3 months again, and so on. While all they're marketing and normal prices are lower than this. It's just plain theft, but seems like these companies get away with it. It comes down to the TOS and they most likely have a clause for price increases that allows them legally do this.
    Last edited by srpurdy; 01-09-2015 at 07:45 AM.
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  18. #18
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    Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the buyer protection worthless for intangible goods (i.e. hosting)?

    I solved all PayPal disputes where no credit card was involved simply by mentioning that the payment was for an intangible good (hosting).

    As for the new policy in general, I find 180 days ridiculous... It will only attract dishonest customers who use a product for months and then file an unreasonable dispute.
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by MH-Stefan View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the buyer protection worthless for intangible goods (i.e. hosting)?

    I solved all PayPal disputes where no credit card was involved simply by mentioning that the payment was for an intangible good (hosting).

    As for the new policy in general, I find 180 days ridiculous... It will only attract dishonest customers who use a product for months and then file an unreasonable dispute.
    Well at least if they file a dispute, we'll have their home address and can take care of business the ole fashion way.



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  20. #20
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    They now have protection for us sellers for intangible items I talked with a few people at Paypal about this and my thoughts are pretty good with it after speaking with them.
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  21. #21
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    We've never really had any issues with Paypal.. In all the time we've been utilizing Paypal I've only received 3 disputes, all of which ended in our favor.

  22. #22
    Yeah , Just yesterday Ive talked with them about something ,and they updated me that they are Changed the rule from 40 days , to 180 days!

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