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  1. #1

    Experience in Cloud Setup

    Hello,

    I'm looking for someone who I can email or PM about a Cloud setup I am working on. I need some input on the hardware setup from someone who has worked in the field before.
    If you wouldn't mind sparing sometime to help, that would be great.

    Thanks, Charlie

  2. #2
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    You're probably better off posting here what you're trying to do then everyone can chip in.
    HostGuard.net - VPS Control Panel
    Automating and monitoring your hosting business.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Katatonic View Post
    You're probably better off posting here what you're trying to do then everyone can chip in.
    Not a bad idea.
    Ok, this is the basic setup we have running in our heads.
    (Using Onapp as software)

    - Control Panel server [Easy, nothing to it]

    - Hypervisor server(s)
    - Supermicro TwinBlade Enclosure
    - Supermicro TwinBlade

    - Data store [SAN]
    [Using 15k SAS drives. What would be the best option for SAN setup? eg. Dell/Supermicro etc..]

    - Backup Storage [No trouble there]

    There is a basic setup but where I am getting in trouble is networking.
    What is the best/easiest to use [10GbE/Infiniband/Fiber]
    On Supermicro TwinBlade they offer
    "Supermicro AOC-IBH-XDD - Dual 4x DDR 20Gbps Infiniband or Dual 10GbE Ethernet"
    What would you suggest?

    Thanks, Charlie

  4. #4
    This will be interesting to see more posts.

  5. #5
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    Here's OnApp's own (brief) requirements:
    http://onapp.com/get-onapp/hardware-requirements

    You should speak to Ditlev - OnApp/VPS.net are running 100+ SANs themselves and have a lot of experience with the hardware and know what works best with their software, although it can pretty much run on any thing.

    I would personally go down the Supermicro route simply because it is very cost effective and with a highly scalable application like OnApp you save even more.
    HostGuard.net - VPS Control Panel
    Automating and monitoring your hosting business.

  6. #6
    Thanks for the help with that link.

    Just a question for someone.

    What OS or software should be used for the SAN(s)?
    Also, what should I use for network switches

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by VirtualRain View Post
    Thanks for the help with that link.

    Just a question for someone.

    What OS or software should be used for the SAN(s)?
    Also, what should I use for network switches
    really depends. If you use sanmelody or starwind you'll have to run windows on your SAN's. Others are based on Solaris and guys like open-e has their own OS (linux based).


    D
    Ditlev Bredahl. CEO,
    OnApp.com + Cloud.net & CDN.net

  8. #8
    Thanks eming.

    Another thing, suggest a drive.
    256GB SSD SATA 6.0Gbps
    vs
    600GB 15k RPM SAS (6.0Gps)

  9. #9
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    I looked at open-e but now im leaning more toward openfiler.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by DataShack View Post
    I looked at open-e but now im leaning more toward openfiler.
    What kind of application are you going to be running on this Cloud? What is the value of that environment? How about yours (or whoever is managing this) time valued per hour?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by CloudWeb View Post
    What kind of application are you going to be running on this Cloud? What is the value of that environment? How about yours (or whoever is managing this) time valued per hour?
    Are you saying those questions would make a difference between one or the other? If so, how?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by DataShack View Post
    Are you saying those questions would make a difference between one or the other? If so, how?
    I think it's fair questions really.
    I mean for some applications you may need very fast disks and plenty of I/O, other usecases would be fine with what ever.
    Some cloudplatforms are less turnkey than others, so if the OP is a busy guy it might make sense for him to go with a platform that ready to run and easy to manage, rather than an open framework that needs a lot of messing around with to work.


    D
    Ditlev Bredahl. CEO,
    OnApp.com + Cloud.net & CDN.net

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by DataShack View Post
    Are you saying those questions would make a difference between one or the other? If so, how?
    The design of an infrastructure's cost can vary wildly depending on what the infrastructure is used for, just as anything can in life. But it's all about value and if the infrastructure can afford downtime, and has a lower budget then free SAN software may work alright. But if it's a multimillion dollar infrastructure or high-profile site that would cost tens of thousands (or more) in damages per hour of downtime I wouldn't even consider it.

    Where I'm getting at is if the infrastructure, time, and value of whatever is running on this is high then the price paid for enterprise SAN solutions is well worth it. We have and do use Openfiler + HA/DRBD for a redundant SAN and this is only done for my budget installations as believe me, they have their issues.

    But for higher profile installations an enterprise SAN is hardly worth the price consideration as the reliability and support is far worth it.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by eming View Post
    I think it's fair questions really.
    I mean for some applications you may need very fast disks and plenty of I/O, other usecases would be fine with what ever.
    Some cloudplatforms are less turnkey than others, so if the OP is a busy guy it might make sense for him to go with a platform that ready to run and easy to manage, rather than an open framework that needs a lot of messing around with to work.


    D
    I agree. Thats why I am leaning toward openfiler. It seems much easier to use and when there are support questions I can get answers from a lot of different places where as open-e doesn't seem so "open". Plus on larger installations it doesn't seem like the pricing structure scales very well. It gets very expensive very fast. A single storage box has 48TB of storage and open-e's model makes the software cost on a single server pretty steep.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by CloudWeb View Post
    The design of an infrastructure's cost can vary wildly depending on what the infrastructure is used for, just as anything can in life. But it's all about value and if the infrastructure can afford downtime, and has a lower budget then free SAN software may work alright. But if it's a multimillion dollar infrastructure or high-profile site that would cost tens of thousands (or more) in damages per hour of downtime I wouldn't even consider it.

    Where I'm getting at is if the infrastructure, time, and value of whatever is running on this is high then the price paid for enterprise SAN solutions is well worth it. We have and do use Openfiler + HA/DRBD for a redundant SAN and this is only done for my budget installations as believe me, they have their issues.

    But for higher profile installations an enterprise SAN is hardly worth the price consideration as the reliability and support is far worth it.
    Yes. My post doesn't mention anything about price. Just because you want to use open source software doesn't mean you want to use it just because it's free. I use lots of open source packages that I pay for service contracts on. For me, the top concerns are, in order, ease of use, support availability and price/performance.

  16. #16
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    in all fairness let me say that Ive never used open-e. Just gone through the features page. If you have experience with it then by all means, share.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by DataShack View Post
    Yes. My post doesn't mention anything about price. Just because you want to use open source software doesn't mean you want to use it just because it's free. I use lots of open source packages that I pay for service contracts on. For me, the top concerns are, in order, ease of use, support availability and price/performance.
    I understand, and I do agree with you. Many of us use various free Linux distributions in production environments and they do work great, and we are or employ very capable engineers to do that.

    From experience though if you put Openfiler arrays in an HA+DRBD environment they will not take first place (or even close) in ease of use, or support. They will be the cheapest if your value of time is low but even then they will take hours to setup, and maintain. Support is sketchy and it will not be within a moments reach.

    So if it's not mission critical then go for it.. it's great as long as it's used properly. If your infrastructure is high priority/high profile/mission critical then just make sure you're aware of the downfalls so you don't end up in a bind when problems happen.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by DataShack View Post
    A single storage box has 48TB of storage and open-e's model makes the software cost on a single server pretty steep.
    you can go with a partner that offers the open-e or starwind solutions on a monthly basis. That will most likely work out cheaper for and it will certainly make it easier on your capex.


    D
    Ditlev Bredahl. CEO,
    OnApp.com + Cloud.net & CDN.net

  19. #19
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    we use open-e and it doesnt do to bad... it has some weird quirks though ... just as any software would. Personally if you need something and your on a budget i would recommend something like the MSA2313i or 2324i (review here http://jpaul.me/?p=413 ) ... they arent bad boxes.... also the HP P4000 line is nice as well... we have may installations out there and they work great.

    i might also mention that the only time that we have had issues with open e is usually when we have a synchronous replication pair that loses power... this breaks the replication and takes a little tinkering to get the volumes to come back online... so just make sure you have great power.

    not too sound too HP oriented (i just have experience with it) but the rebranded Lefthand VSA software is pretty stable too.

    I dont know what kind of power your looking for but when i was looking for better storage for some sites i host and my blog site i found an old HP MSA1000 cheap on ebay and was able to load it up with drives from around the office and have some reliable 2Gb fiber channel storage for my VMWare hosting cluster.

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