Results 1 to 18 of 18
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Exotic
    Posts
    1,068

    Virtuozzo compared to OpenVZ.

    I have had a few OpenVZ VPS and they have all been quite unstable (but good enough for personal/testing purposes), which is why I generally favour Xen for important hosting. I have had nothing but good experiences with Xen.

    However, I have not - that I can recall - been on a Virtuozzo VPS.

    Aside from overselling and overpopulated nodes which are host-side issues, in terms of stability, independence, and flexibility, how does Virtuozzo compare to OpenVZ and Xen?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    1,435
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr X View Post
    I have had a few OpenVZ VPS and they have all been quite unstable (but good enough for personal/testing purposes), which is why I generally favour Xen for important hosting. I have had nothing but good experiences with Xen.

    However, I have not - that I can recall - been on a Virtuozzo VPS.

    Aside from overselling and overpopulated nodes which are host-side issues, in terms of stability, independence, and flexibility, how does Virtuozzo compare to OpenVZ and Xen?
    Very similar. Perhaps a tad-bit more stable.

    Usually providers having Virtuozzo are a bit more stable in structure as far as the company goes. Nothing else.

  3. #3
    Virtuozzo is based on openvz but with better control panel and kernel hacks.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Exotic
    Posts
    1,068
    Quote Originally Posted by InfiniteTech View Post
    Usually providers having Virtuozzo are a bit more stable in structure as far as the company goes.
    How do you mean?

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    5,849
    Virtuozzo allows hosts the option of using SLM memory management, and most take it. This eliminates the need for all that burst memory nastiness and gives users reasonably accurate estimates of their usage in top and free, instead of wildly inaccurate figures based on allocated memory. So with identical systems and usage you'll see (looking at the -/+ buffers/cache line) Virtuozzo and Xen showing similar memory usage while OpenVZ shows much higher numbers.

    For me, that's enough in itself to put Virtuozzo far ahead of OpenVZ; the fact that many of the more reputable providers here choose it is just a bonus!
    Chris

    "Some problems are so complex that you have to be highly intelligent and well informed just to be undecided about them." - Laurence J. Peter

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    1,435
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr X View Post
    How do you mean?
    Parallels requires contracts with minimum commitments in business volume, etc before issuing you a license.

    If a provider can invest (although that is a small amount; $30k~/yr) that much in software contracts; it atleast 'appears' to be a little more serious than a provider using OpenVZ.

    Same with XenSource vs Citrix XenServer

    You can still go horribly wrong here. My statements are very broad and cannot be upheld in every scenario. I know a lot of XenSource and OpenVZ providers who are brilliant at what they do.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    2,752
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr X View Post
    I have had a few OpenVZ VPS and they have all been quite unstable (but good enough for personal/testing purposes), which is why I generally favour Xen for important hosting. I have had nothing but good experiences with Xen.
    IMO it is false the assertion OpenVZ bad experience, Xen good experience. or OpenVZ unstable, Xen stable, ... It is more a matter of bad providers, good providers, skilled users, clueless users.

    Quote Originally Posted by InfiniteTech View Post
    Parallels requires contracts with minimum commitments in business volume, etc before issuing you a license.

    If a provider can invest (although that is a small amount; $30k~/yr) that much in software contracts; it atleast 'appears' to be a little more serious than a provider using OpenVZ.

    Same with XenSource vs Citrix XenServer

    You can still go horribly wrong here. My statements are very broad and cannot be upheld in every scenario. I know a lot of XenSource and OpenVZ providers who are brilliant at what they do.
    Agreed 100%
    You will only find out how good a provider is when the going gets tough

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Indiana, USA
    Posts
    19,196
    Quote Originally Posted by turbovps View Post
    Virtuozzo is based on openvz but with better control panel and kernel hacks.
    It was my understanding, however I may be wrong, that OpenVZ was essentially an "open" version of Virtuozzo and not the other way around. If Virtuozzo is indeed based on OpenVZ and not the other way around, somebody do feel free to set me straight on this. I mean, it doesn't really matter, but it's one of those "good to know" sort of things.

    Quote Originally Posted by dotHostel View Post
    IMO it is false the assertion OpenVZ bad experience, Xen good experience. or OpenVZ unstable, Xen stable, ... It is more a matter of bad providers, good providers, skilled users, clueless users.
    Indeed - it's just like those who say "overselling is bad" - it's not overselling that is bad but the poor server management at the company where you had an issue with overselling in most cases

    You can have a good experience or a bad experience with the same hardware + plans at two different providers just because one may know what they're doing and the other may be total crap.
    Michael Denney - MDDHosting.com - Proudly hosting more than 37,700 websites since 2007.
    Ultra-Fast Cloud Shared and Pay-By-Use Reseller Hosting Powered by LiteSpeed!
    cPanel • Free SSL • 100% Uptime SLA • 24/7 Support
    Class-leading support that responds in minutes, not days.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    942
    A few big differences:

    1) SLM (previously mentioned) - Gives accurate number for RAM usage, the OpenVZ method is based on total pages (privvmpages/VSIZE), which is not very accurate at all. SLM is based more on RSS (actual RAM usage).

    2) I/O Limits - Virtuozzo supports hard limits on disk I/O usage. When providers utilize this it keeps I/O in check and prevents overloaded systems. In our experience so far this is a "magical" feature, it makes a huge difference. This along with proper CPU limits will eliminate 90%+ of "load spikes" that plague so many VPS providers these days.

    3) VZFS - Allows same programs across VPSs to share the same memory, helps improve overall system performance (reduces effects of overselling, or if no overselling allows more RAM to be used for cache).
    Matt Ayres - togglebox.com
    Linux and Windows Cloud Virtual Datacenters powered by Onapp / Xen
    Instant Setup, Instant Scalability, Full Lifecycle Hosting Solutions

    www.togglebox.com

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Exotic
    Posts
    1,068
    Quote Originally Posted by dotHostel View Post
    IMO it is false the assertion OpenVZ bad experience, Xen good experience. or OpenVZ unstable, Xen stable, ... It is more a matter of bad providers, good providers, skilled users, clueless users.
    I was under the impression that an OpenVZ solution is more susceptible to negative impact from other containers on the node, while this is less of a problem with Xen (and Virtuozzo), and that this is a software limitation and not something the host can do anything about. I excluded overselling and overpopulated nodes in my first original post.

    Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    2,752
    Unfortunately software can't help if the provider don't know how to use its options correctly / wisely or/and when the provider thinks a SAS 15Krpm (300 IOPS) is only an expensive drive a bit faster than a SATA 7.2Krpm (100 IOPS); ECC RAM is not that important; etc.

    My point is the "bad or good experience" results more from the provider's decisions (hardware,data center,configurations,TOS,plans/prices,etc) than the software used.
    Last edited by dotHostel; 05-16-2011 at 09:46 AM.
    You will only find out how good a provider is when the going gets tough

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    1,435
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeDVB View Post
    It was my understanding, however I may be wrong, that OpenVZ was essentially an "open" version of Virtuozzo and not the other way around. If Virtuozzo is indeed based on OpenVZ and not the other way around, somebody do feel free to set me straight on this. I mean, it doesn't really matter, but it's one of those "good to know" sort of things.
    Parallels develops a feature and puts it into OpenVZ. Does testing on OpenVZ. If its good to go, plugs it into Virtuozzo. Although, not all features go like this.

    OpenVZ is more like a beta product and VZ being a final release.

    If you see most OpenVZ developers are Russians/SWSoft (Parallels former name) developers. There are almost no "native" OpenVZ devs.

    Quote Originally Posted by dotHostel View Post
    Unfortunately software can't help if the provider don't know how to use its options correctly / wisely or/and when the provider thinks a SAS 15Krpm (300 IOPS) is only an expensive drive a bit faster than a SATA 7.2Krpm (100 IOPS); ECC RAM is not that important; etc.

    My point is the "bad or good experience" results more from the provider's decisions (hardware,data center,configurations,TOS,plans/prices,etc) than the software used.
    This combined with clueless users gives you a lethal dose of something very bad.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    2,752
    Quote Originally Posted by InfiniteTech View Post
    This combined with clueless users gives you a lethal dose of something very bad.
    Agreed but most of the clueless users are due provider's decision to launch plans and prices with strong appeal for new/inexperienced users.
    You will only find out how good a provider is when the going gets tough

  14. #14
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    San Francisco
    Posts
    7,325
    It's interesting to note that Servint actually chooses to use the privvmpages model rather than SLM due to stability reasons.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Dallas, Texas
    Posts
    355
    I personally state that you should stick with OpenVZ as Virtuozzo in my book, overall sucks. :/

    But others might feel different, it really depends on what your require or like better. I personally like OpenVZ better, and XEN over OpenVZ
    FusionNET Solutions - US/UK Locations | Adult/IRC Allowed! | DDoS Protected Networks!
    Fusion Powered: Web Hosting - Virtual Servers - Dedicated Servers | Native IPv6 Available!
    202-505-HOST | LiteSpeed Support! | Live Web Chat!

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by InfiniteTech View Post
    Parallels develops a feature and puts it into OpenVZ. Does testing on OpenVZ. If its good to go, plugs it into Virtuozzo. Although, not all features go like this.
    So sort of like Fedora vs. RHEL...
    raindog308
    LowEndTalk administrator, LowEndBox editor

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    1,785
    WiredTree and KnownHost both use Virtuozzo. That's good enough for me.
    Hosting is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    176
    Quote Originally Posted by TheJoker View Post
    WiredTree and KnownHost both use Virtuozzo. That's good enough for me.
    What I find really interesting is the budget hosts have gone to OpenVZ. The older premium managed hosts use Virtuozzo. The new cloud hosts use Citrix Xen sever. And the unmanaged hosts use Xen.

    What I'm wondering though is if the older manged VPS hosts (Knownhost,Liquid Web, Wiredtree, Future hosting,and ServInt)will ever move from Virtuzzo? I'm curious if xen or Citrix Xen Server would suit them better. Or give them more flexibility?

    I'm sure they use Virtuzzo for a couple of reason, support, discount price, good customer panel (Virtuzzo Power Panel).

    But I do wonder for example what Wiredtree could do with Citrix Xen Server and their own customer panel. They already have a nice custom built customer portal.

    Interesting possibilities.

Similar Threads

  1. OpenVZ or Virtuozzo
    By Cosget in forum VPS Hosting
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 04-19-2010, 02:58 PM
  2. Replies: 7
    Last Post: 02-17-2010, 03:07 PM
  3. OpenVZ or Virtuozzo?
    By JFSG in forum VPS Hosting
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 10-28-2008, 10:55 AM
  4. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 08-31-2008, 12:24 AM
  5. Virtuozzo / OpenVZ
    By dkitchen in forum Hosting Security and Technology
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 08-31-2006, 12:03 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •