I understand that many of you may be sick of this matter by now (please refer to the other thread), but I am now posting to inform everyone that I will be taking this matter further.

Luckily my brother is a Lawyer and he has advised me that I can take Tim Petty from Paradise-Design(s).net to court for “lose of Income”. Tim did promise me money for a design I have done for him (or a client of his) and has yet to date supplied this money (I have ICQ history to support this, along with ICQ’s Head office guarantying this evidence).

The reason I am doing this is not just for the money, but also to prove a point to Tim. His behaviour/business practices should not be tolerated and I will not tolerate it.

I am posting this here as my brother has advised me that if anyone that has dealt with Tim in the past and have been ripped of by him and would like to take action, then here’s your chance. On your behalf we can take your case to court with us and help you regain any lost money for you. We will need an e-mail from you with details of what’s happened, and any evidence you may have to help your case. Please send through e-mails to design@webdefinity.com along with your contact details, so if we need to contact you about your case.

We have contacted paypal.com (as that was where the original complaint was made) and they will also be chasing this matter up. Tim has been given 48 hours to supply the payment/money he owes on the design, and if the money is not received by the time given, then this case will proceed.

Finally, I would like to thank everyone for their support in this matter, I understand that I put myself in this position, however this no excuse for what Tim has done.

I will keep everyone up-to-date on this matter.

Kind Regards,

Tom Macdonald.

...if anyone that has dealt with Tim in the past and have been ripped of by him..

They'll be plenty of those, me included.

Good luck, God bless.

Tim is the son of the devil.

Good luck with your law suit. I'm sure there are plenty of interested parties around these parts who'd be keen on following the outcome of your actions. :agree:

You probably should have discussed the matter with your brother earlier mate. He might have advised you to keep your posts/comments/evidence off of public forums. Not to say you have no right to do that, but I think you'll find it's one or the other.

Good luck in your endeavour though.

Cheers

Gary

If it goes to court, make sure it's on Court TV or Judge Judy or something so the rest of us can watch.

Oprah would have a go at it if Tim can cook... :)

Gary

Are you suing Tim... or his uncle? Since Tim is only 14, I understand, I don't think you can sue him.

But I'm sure your brother told you that.

Is there any proof of Tim's real age, I'm curious

I don't think so.....I heard he was 16 by some random homeless guy in the city :) Everyone knows Timmay :D

even if he was 14,i think he could take him away from his pc or any other box for life :D
or send him back to school.

Good luck. ;)

Originally posted by Lurleene
Are you suing Tim... or his uncle? Since Tim is only 14, I understand, I don't think you can sue him.

But I'm sure your brother told you that.

I have no clue what his age is, but I can tell you thing, working in the collection field as well, you can NOT sue a minor, you can only sue the parent or legal guardian of a minor as they are responsible for the actions of their minor child until the age of 18.

I believe Tim is 16, maybe 17 now. Anyways, some places I think you can sue 17 year olds, either way, he's his parent/guardians responsibility and you can hold them responsible for fraud and all of his actions, regardless of his age.

It would be better in that case anyways, as the parent/guardian has more money, and would personally kick his <you know what> for costing him money.

You just need to work on getting his address/phone number and going from there ....

Good luck. I for one did get payed by Tim, which I'm lucky for I suppose ... but it did take 5 months of nagging.

We understand the law, and we cannot directly sue Tim, As his perants/legal gardian whould have to represent Tim, or stand in for Tim.

Maybe someone could send his parents the board of education.

If he is that young i bet his parents dont even know what is going on so this will come as a big surprise when they get served the lawsuit and a sherrif or policemen walks up to the door with a court order

I wish you the best of luck. When I got jerked around by Tim I was able to get a refund (after threatening to do a chargeback), otherwise I would happily join.

Has anyone seen this blog of Tim's?

http://web.archive.org/web/20010417022046/http://www.blogginaround.f2s.com/

I think the part that scares me the most is that his posts are from early 2001, and he doesn't seem to "know much" (about hosting, whatever) at that time... and now he's doing business? :eek:

Originally posted by goodness0001
If he is that young i bet his parents dont even know what is going on so this will come as a big surprise when they get served the lawsuit and a sherrif or policemen walks up to the door with a court order I'm positive that both Tim's parents and uncle are fully aware of what he's been up to.

Tim is a minor and therefore unable to receive a credit card. From what I know, some transactions have been processed on Tim's side, and they came from his uncle's CC. (I think).

Also, his toll-free number that was used on both Paradise Designs and Earhost re-directed to his household phone. I remember someone on WHT informing us of a discussion he had with Tim's parents regarding his unlawful acts. He asked if they knew what was going on, etc...

A couple of things.

1. Tim was born in 1986, as confirmed by multiple forums he has registered for. Do a google search, its there.

2. Only a year ago Tim had no concept of webhosting, web design, or anything else with the industry. I repeat, NO concept. You can check out the EZBoards he visited where he asks simple questinos such as "How do you build a webpage?" and so on.

3. Tim will most likely refund this angry person the money, and they like many others will just drop the issue and move on. Thats how Tim has gotten so far, he pays when he knows he will be in trouble.

Hope that adds yet another dimension to the messed up life of our good pretty Timmy Petty.

If you really want to stop his nonsense, and your brother is a lawyer, research KY laws and file a criminal complaint with a local authority. I can't believe he continues to do this. Maybe the kid is a front for some conniving adults - someone is putting up money.

Well I hope its on Judge Judy :D... She'd make cream pie out of him! :smash:

I'm glad to hear someone is taking a stand and I wish you luck. Hope it all works out in your favor!

AS I mentioned earlier, Tim has 48 hours to pay the final payment, in which the clock is still clicking. If payment is not recieved by the given time, then yes I have the right to take him to court and will do. However, if the payment is made by that time then I have no case.

Thank you to everyone who has supplied their stories and to people who have helped.

I understand that many people are interested by this topic, so I will keep you informed.

*ahem* here comes my great knowledge from the crazy upper-level Law classes @ UF

If Tim is truely under 18 than he "lacks capacity" to make a decision. Only minors can have their cake and eat it to. Unless his parents actually signed a contract or gave a verbal "thats ok" you are not going to get anywhere. He just has to walk in the court room and say "Under the USA Common Law system I am still an infant (thats what they call everyone under 18) and was unable to understand the contract I was entering into because I lacked capacity due to my lack of age". It's the same idea when your friends in 7th grade used to send in a thing to Columbia Publishing for the 10 free CD's and then wouldnt buy anything. They got to keep the CD's and not have to pay a dime for the exact same thing.

If he says that he will win and you will have wasted your time / money =(.





* Side note.. The only other time you can lack capacity is if you were insane or drunk and with these both they have to prove that the contract was outrageous (because you had the capacity beforehand to make decisions)

hum, at least it'll let his parents know, if i were his oparents id.... DELTED

Originally posted by TheMMIz

2. Only a year ago Tim had no concept of webhosting, web design, or anything else with the industry. I repeat, NO concept. You can check out the EZBoards he visited where he asks simple questinos such as "How do you build a webpage?" and so on.



Who said that he has any concept of business and/or webhosting now? It appears to me that he knows absolutely nothing of good business. When I was a customer of Tim's I got to know him pretty well and he always calls other people and asks them the questions that he does not know which is a lot. He does not even know how to install cPanel.

Originally posted by FloHost



He does not even know how to install cPanel.

:stickout:

Well I hope its on Judge Judy ... She'd make cream pie out of him!

hehehehehe

Now that *would* be funny :D!

Well, someone is finally taking action. However, you won't win. Just drop it now. Cut your losses while you still can.

Well judge judy doesn't allow lawyers, power of attorney does

Maybe they can play the Eminem (Remix Timmy Style) CD that people have been contributing to LOL :D I myself have written Eminem - Scary Movies, Timmy Style and someone has made Eminem - Without Me, Timmy Style in COURT LOL That would be great.

LOL :D :D :D :D

lol omg I was on aim asking Tim for a custom plan and asked if he knew about this post and his age. Hes like how can I help you so IM like can I have a custom plan. then IM like wats your age and he blocked me heheh!:stickout:

Originally posted by Derek
Well, someone is finally taking action. However, you won't win. Just drop it now. Cut your losses while you still can.


Yeah take it from me, I tried to help out people that Tim screwed over and now everyone is accusing me of being Tim's butt-buddy :D

The truth is I hate Tim and if I could I would kill him... oops, did I say that out loud?

We have done our research for this matter, and what jic mentioned about Tim being able to act as a minor is true, HOWEVER from the evidence we have put together we can prove that he has made this dicision and that he was incontrol of this matter and aware of what he is doing.

We can push this in the courts, and along with other peoples statements to prove this point. That's why we have asked for other storys as we need it to prove that Tim has acted in this manner before.

We have gone through every detail here and if we knew we couldn't do this, then we wouldn't be wasting our time. But we can sue Tim, and we will sue Tim.

First off, stop discussing this in a public online forum.

Second, yes, you can take him to court, but why are you taking a person to court, you should be taking the incorporated business to court, and than that in turn should be taking Tim to court as he is CEO, CFO, etc of the company.

You will also need to bring in his parents and his uncle on their own chanrges as well as his parents as guardians of the infant, Tim.

Competence to enter into a legally binding agreement. The main categories of persons lacking this capacity in full are minors, the mentally disordered, the drunk, and corporations other than those created by royal charter.

A minor is capable of making valid contracts for necessaries and is also bound by any beneficial contract of service into which he enters (i.e. any contract of employment or training that is advantageous to him taken as a whole). Certain contracts of a proprietary nature (e.g. tenancy agreements, agreements to buy company shares, and partnership agreements) are voidable in that a minor may repudiate them either before he comes of age or within a reasonable time thereafter. If he fails to repudiate, he becomes fully bound. All other contracts made by a minor are unenforceable unless ratified by the minor when he comes of age (see ratification) unless the Minors Contracts Act 1987 applies. This Act gives the court the right to require the transfer of property acquired by a minor under a contract when it is just and equitable to do so and improves the rights of adults contracting with minors.

A contract made by a person who is mentally disordered or drunk is voidable if the other party knows that his disorder or drunkenness will prevent him from understanding what he is doing. This means that, subject to certain limitations, he can set the contract aside by rescission.

A corporation incorporated by royal charter has full contractual capacity, but a statutory corporation has power to contract only for purposes connected with the objects for which it was incorporated. Other contracts are ultra vires and void.

There is also the fact that children can be contracting parties and under the age of 18, it just requires some legal work as well as a decent amount of money to pay for all of it.

New York law (1) provides for judicial approval of certain contracts for services of minors or "infants" under the age of 18. The provisions of the statute specifically relate to performing artists (such as actors, musicians and dancers) and professional athletes. The arduous procedure involved, however, can be expensive for the client and may prove to be a difficult gauntlet for the practitioner to run. Moreover, the probability of actually achieving court certification is discouragingly low. Many judges are wary of approving what are often incomprehensible contracts replete with the convoluted formulas and the impenetrable language of the entertainment business. It is understandable that a judge's trepidation with respect to certifying that a minor has adult responsibility for contractual obligations might be analogous to the reluctance a judge would experience when requested to declare someone judicially incompetent or insane.

As a practical matter, a proceeding for judicial approval of a minor's contract under New York's Arts and Cultural Affairs Law §35.03 is commenced by the filing of a verified petition. It can be filed by a parent, the guardian, a relative of the infant or any interested person on the infant's behalf.

The petition may be made to the Supreme Court or the Surrogate's Court in the county in which the infant resides. If a guardian has been appointed or qualified in New York then the petition should be made to the court in which the guardian was appointed or qualified. If the infant is not a resident of New York, then the petition may be filed in any county in which the infant is to be employed under the contract. In the event that the determination is made to file in the Supreme Court of a particular county, it is advisable to check with the clerk of the corresponding Surrogate's Court. The Surrogate's Court may require that special forms be completed and filed together with the petition to the Supreme Court, specifically with respect to appointment of a guardian.

A complete list of the information which must be included in the petition is set forth in Arts and Cultural Affairs Law §35.03(5)(a-k). The information required includes the name, residence and date of birth of the infant (§35.03(5)(a)) as well as whether the infant has had at any time a guardian appointed by will, deed or by a court (§35.03(5)(c)). The name and residence of any living parent, of the person who has care and custody of the infant, and the name of the person with whom the infant resides must also be set forth in the petition (§35.03(5)(b). This may be one and the same person or this may be three separate individuals. A brief statement as to the infants's employment and compensation under the contract or proposed contract is required (§35.03(5)(e). Most importantly, the petition must contain a statement that the term of the contract during which the infant is to perform or render services cannot extend for a period of more than seven years from the date of approval of the contract (§35.03(5)(f)). Despite the seven year limitation, certain covenants and conditions (e.g., re-recording restrictions) which extend beyond the seven year limitation may be approved if found to be reasonable.

The petition must also contain a statement of who, if other than the infant, is entitled to the infant's earnings and facts regarding the property and financial circumstances of the parent or parents so entitled (§35.03(5)(g)). The petition must also include a schedule showing the infant's projected "gross earnings", estimated outlays and estimated "net earnings", as such terms are defined in §35.03(3)(b) of the statute.

If no guardian of the infant has been appointed or qualified in New York, the petition must also request the appointment of a limited guardian. The petition may nominate a person to be appointed as guardian setting forth the reasons why the person nominated would be proper and suitable. A parent or other petitioner is not precluded from being appointed as limited guardian by reason of his or her interest in any part of the infant's earnings or in the contract, provided such interest is disclosed. The court also has the option to appoint a special guardian to represent the interests of the minor at any time after the petition is filed.

A complete copy of the proposed contract to be approved by the court must be annexed to the petition. Additional documents that should accompany the petition include written consent of the infant (if over the age of 14) and affidavits from the parents and guardian which consent to the petition, support the facts, and designate the clerk of the respective court as a person upon whom service of process may be made. In certain situations, it might be advisable for the attorneys who negotiated a particularly complicated contract to submit affidavits stipulating as to the substance of particular provisions of the contract. Furthermore, if a guardian is or has been appointed for the particular proceeding, a document known as a "Report of Guardian AdLitem" must also be filed with the petition.

Under the New York law, at least eight days before the time at which the petition is noticed to be heard, the following persons (other than the petitioner and anyone who has joined in the petition) must be served with an order to show cause why the petition should not be granted: (1) the infant; (2) the parents of the infant; (3) the infant's guardian(s); (4) each party to the contract; (5) any person having the care and custody of the infant; (6) the person with whom the infant resides; and, (7) the infant's spouse.

An order granting judicial approval of a contract for the services of a minor will rarely be granted on the papers alone.

A hearing will be commenced in which the infant, the parent(s) and the various other interested parties may be questioned by the judge regarding the contract. Oftentimes the court will also designate its own "experts" (usually lawyers not involved in the proceeding)

to review and analyze the terms and provisions of the contract. The cost of such court appointed lawyers is chargeable to the petitioner.

In the course of the proceeding, the court will also decide what portion of the net earnings of the infant are to be set aside. In fixing the amount to be set aside, the court will consider the financial circumstances of the parents entitled to the infant's earnings, the needs of the parents' other children and the needs of the infant's spouse, if married. Such amounts as are set aside are to be saved for the infant under guardianship until the minor becomes 18 years old.

As noted earlier, judges are often reluctant to approve contracts for the employment of a minor. Once the action is commenced, it could take anywhere from several weeks to several months for a decision to be reached. Numerous hearings may be required before the judge is satisfied that the contract should be approved.

In a recent proceeding which I handled in Supreme Court in Duchess County, New York, for approval of a personal management contact and a production agreement, the judge required three separate hearings. Despite affidavits from the attorney's who negotiated the contracts, he appointed an independent counsel as a court "expert" to review the provisions of the contracts. The proceedings extended over a period of eight months before approval was granted.

Once the court does grant approval, an order will be issued which will, in effect, declare the infant an adult for purposes of fulfilling his or her contractual obligations.

Keep in mind, however, that even after judicial approval of a contract, subsequent review may be made pursuant to an application made by the infant, a parent or the guardian. If the court determines after a hearing that the well-being of the infant is being impaired by the performance of the contract, it may at any time during the term of the contract order a modification of the contract or revoke its approval of the contract.


California

The California's applicable statute (2) sets forth procedures concerning judicial approval of minors' contract for artistic or creative services. The details of what is required by the court, similar to the information required under New York law, is set forth in detail therein. It is worthwhile to note that, under California law there is no limitation on the length of the term of a minor's contract and there is no requirement that a limited guardian be appointed. Although, as in New York, a hearing is usually required under California law, the only parties required for the proceeding in California are the employer and the employee. Moreover, under California law a maximum of only 50% of net earnings will be set aside until the infant becomes 18 years old, whereas New York has no limit on what portion the court can direct to be set aside.

California courts would have jurisdiction over the action if the minor either resides or is employed in California, or if any party to the contract has its principal office in that state. Accordingly, if jurisdiction is available, a practitioner would be well advised to weigh the relevant pros and cons of having the proceeding commenced in California as opposed to New York.

Nashville

Although Tennessee does not have a specific statute setting forth a procedure for court approval of contracts relating specifically to the services of minors, Nashville practitioners should be aware of several statutes which may be applicable to such contracts.

One of Tennessee's statutes (3), deals with Guardianships and Conservatorship. As a preliminary matter, application should be made for appointment of a fiduciary or "Guardian Ad Litem" for those deemed incompetent by their infancy.

One section of the Tennessee Code (4) provides for application to the chancery court, for and on behalf of infants, for judicial consent to any "sale of property". Another section of the Code (5) provides that no property of a minor may be sold without prior court approval. These provisions would presumably be applicable to recording agreements and publishing agreements which provide for the transfer of intellectual property rights.

With respect to appointment of a guardian, the Tennessee Code (6) sets a legal threshold for the disposition of funds of a minor which do not exceed $10,000; the court may order that such funds be delivered to the minor, the minors natural guardian(s) or the person with whom the minor resides without appointment of a fiduciary to the minor. By implication, transfers of funds in excess of $10,000 would require court appointment of such a fiduciary. It should be assumed that these provisions would be applicable to management contracts, recording agreements and any other arrangement where the income or advance is estimated to exceed $10,000.

It appears that, for Nashville practitioners, as a practical matter, the more court involvement, on whatever level, the less chance of disaffirmance by the minor.

Summary

Beyond procedural issues, it is useful to note that in all three states there is some case law which provides that, although disaffirmance by a minor is a shield, it cannot be used as a sword. The minor cannot disaffirm the contract and at the same time reap the benefits gained thereunder. (7) The party who contracted with the minor would be entitled to just compensation for the performance which had been rendered pursuant to that contract (e.g., management commissions on records sold) prior to disaffirmance.

(c) Wallace Collins, Esq.

1. New York Arts and Cultural Affairs Law §35.03, et seq.

2. California Civil Code §36(a)2, et seq.

3. Tennessee Code Annotated, Title 34

4. T.C.A. §34-3-206

5. T.C.A. §34-11-116

6. T.C.A. §34-11-104

7. See,e.g., Eden Mgt. v. Kavovit, 149 Misc 2d 262 (N.Y. 1990)

One more thing. You shoud not be discussing this here.

Please leave this to us. We know the law, and we know exactly what we are doing here. We have researched this matter completely.

And I realise this matter shouldn't be discussed here, but this message was started to get other peoples stories so this case can be taken further. This post is not about legal issues, or for people to display their legal knowledge, or for people to put forth their opionions on Tim.

I ask if we can leave it at that, and I will get back to everyone with a follow up on what happens further down the track.

Thank you.

And to follow-up in a true Timmah manner:

MODS! CLOSE THIS THREAD!

:cartman:

Well said time... but before that happens.. get it on judge judy :stickout:

till now i thought the stuff on judge judy was just a drama sort of thing? dang its real stuff..

well when you sue him, sue him on my behalf for the server that i never got.... :cool:

Originally posted by FloHost



Who said that he has any concept of business and/or webhosting now? It appears to me that he knows absolutely nothing of good business. When I was a customer of Tim's I got to know him pretty well and he always calls other people and asks them the questions that he does not know which is a lot. He does not even know how to install cPanel.

I can vouch for timmy calling others for help.... oh god, yes i certainly can...

*shudders*

Just a legal question, could you say that he was simply buying something from you? Because, from what I understand, that's what he's doing.

Then you don't have to mess around with infant stuff, unless I'm wrong... (which is likely).

Finally he gets what he deservers, sorry to say this, but I hope he DOESNT pay you within the 48 hours, just so you can bring him to court, and actually teach him a lesson for once..

I want to play Judge Judy, pleaseeeeee!!

Whats going on with this?

Originally posted by AdamTuttle
Whats going on with this?

Perhaps people stopped posting becuase there was nothing more to discuss. Perhaps the counrts are not the fastest thing known to man (unless you get tossed in an expdited track aka fast track, but that is very unliekly given the circumstances) and everone is going to wait until something happens.

It is very likely that Tim hasnt even been servered yet. (I used to serve, people will do anything to dodge them.) In which case nothing has happened, by the time an answer is sent back in response to the S&C, it will be a while, than possibly some arbitration, maybe a few other things. It takes time.

and 110% he never will....WHT is known for its all talk...no action :D

Tim's parents are going to be angry.

if they even care.

A question in fact that shows my newbie-ness.. who is this infamous Tim? I think I can scarecely read ANY thread without seeing his name in one capacity or another.

I did try a search but he is SO talked about and shows up in places which have nothing to do with him. ("what should we do with this broken server? we should throw it at Timmy!".. okay that's not an actual example ^_^ but my point is that his name is mentioned a lot) So anyway I haven't been able to isolate the original threads of incident.

I have gotten the impression this guy is a scammer.. but.. could I have the details just to satisfy my morbid curiousity?

thanks!:wavey:

Originally posted by aethel
I have gotten the impression this guy is a scammer.. but.. could I have the details just to satisfy my morbid curiousity?They are all here, just do a search on see if you can find topics related to "Paradise Design(s)" or "Earhost" for example (Tims companies) ... he mentioned in other threads A LOT yeah ... that's his own fault. ..

So? the time is up, what are you going to do?

how do you sue tim when he's under 18?

Server with Tim is down once again, I mean honestly how mnay free months can he give me to make up for all this downtime, I hate it when my clients are mad

Originally posted by vibehosts
Server with Tim is down once again, I mean honestly how mnay free months can he give me to make up for all this downtime, I hate it when my clients are mad

Unlimited? ;)

Server with Tim is down once again, I mean honestly how mnay free months can he give me to make up for all this downtime, I hate it when my clients are mad

If your worried about your clients being mad, then why would you host with somebody like Timmy anyways?

Hes been fine with me except recently, I've been with him since April

Tim recently told me its down to a server problem but I expected him to be lying, and well I caught him

KyleWuo37: hello I was wondering if you could tell me if camaro.nocservers.net is down due to the same problem as before
BurstNET: yes

BurstNET: I -doubt- the server will be up tonight
KyleWuo37: I see
BurstNET: his has a huge debt over here

Last time he didn't pay the bill so this is the third time

Latest picture of Timmy attached.

everyones (should) be smart enough to realize that all these talks of lawsuits are like throwing out the baby with the bath water....it will never happen

what do you mean wolf?

Is the thread starter a fake, he hasn't replied and its been well after tim's deadline

what i mean is ever since the internet came to life, its alot easier typing something then actually doing it.

When you hear of lawsuits etc....specially on the internet, 99.999999999999999999% guaretted it will never happen. Its all talk, and WHT has more talk then the average....

The thread starter started out strong, alot of talk....but you will never see the results. he will eat his losses and move on.

i think wolf is right . I dont think anyone is going to get sued . I know if i was going to take someone to court , last thing i would do is be writting on a public forum , letting the person im going to sue gather information in thier defence . Also , if you wanted to let people know that you were sueing this other person , i think you could have done it with more class , and it could have been put in a more professional format .

Must of been a fake, hes a gone now, but God I wish someone would sue Tim for being such a jerk and bad person (he thinks he does everything correct also, like hes more superior)

Maybe he is busy filing the suit? I mean, he can't devote his ENTIRE life to making sure you guys are up to date :rolleyes:

:laugh: hahahahhahahhhahahahhahahahahahaha

Interesting.. :eek:

how many times have you seen the words lawsuit thrown around on the net. to many times for me to count, thats for sure

this guy is all talk, the only lawsuit he would likely file is in small claims, in which he would have to carry his but to wherever timmy boy is and go to small claims....

Originally posted by AlaskanWolf
:laugh: hahahahhahahhhahahahhahahahahahaha


Was that extremely rude reply directed at me? If so, I demand an apology :angry:

no i wont :angry:

lmao@Timmy's pimp.

Wolf is right and that is why these scumbags keep ripping people off there is no consequences for their deeds. It's expensive to sue and most of these cases don't involve a lot of money. I doubt an attorney would even be interested in a lawsuit worth a few hundred dollars.

Originally posted by arpmn
Wolf is right and that is why these scumbags keep ripping people off there is no consequences for their deeds. It's expensive to sue and most of these cases don't involve a lot of money. I doubt an attorney would even be interested in a lawsuit worth a few hundred dollars.

Fees to file a Summons and Complaint cost more than double the $99 a month you pay at RS, lett alone paying for a lawyer and stuff like that.

I seriously doubt anyone sues anyone over $100 in court. The only thing one could do that is fincially efficient, is small claims court, which is a lot harder to do as Tim is a minor and it was a business transaction. They will probably bump you up to the big leagues.

Someone should take his www.hostinglounge.com in trade. Nice site, decent name - I'm surprised he hasn't sold it (to 4 or 5 different people).

that seemed to be a failure

Tim is only 14. I used to work for the hosting co he has his reseller plan through. I told my supervisor about him but they said they didn't care. I would sue them or his parents.

Mort

Originally posted by acameron
Tim is only 14. I used to work for the hosting co he has his reseller plan through. I told my supervisor about him but they said they didn't care. I would sue them or his parents.

Mort

That's like saying if you get hit by a drunk driver, sue not only the driver, but Ford as well.

That seems smart. :rolleyes:

If Ford handed the KEYS TO A MINOR then yup sue ford.

Originally posted by acameron
If Ford handed the KEYS TO A MINOR then yup sue ford.

Ford can hand keys to anyone they want. There are no laws prohibitng that. It is the parents job as custodians of the child to make sure they don't drive.

Just like there are no laws prohibitng the renting of servers to minors either. There isnt even an age restriction on owning webservers.

Ummm gee yea its called liability tim. Try asking a grown up.

Originally posted by acameron
Ummm gee yea its called liability tim. Try asking a grown up.

No, they are not held liable for it. Just like Ford isn't.

And here is some more news, if you slip while bending over to tighten the bolts on your tires, you can't sue Craftsman.

Also, if you are taking a picture with a camcorder and don't watch whhere you are going, you can't sue Sony for walking into the wall. Nor can you sue the people who built the wall.

Also, if you are late for work one day, you can't sue Sleepy's for making a great matress. Nor can you sue Casio for forgetting to set your alarm clock.

You are held liable for you own actions. It's a scary thought, isn't it. You know.... responsibility.

And for the record, I am a grown up.

I am not a sue happy guy and for instance I am completely against those crazy fat people suing McDonalds. Hey I want to McDonalds 2 a day when I worked near them of course I gained 60lbs and new why. But it was my fault for being to lazy to drive down to subway and buy a sub.

Letting a minor run a potentially liable business is not illegal but it does leave the service provider liable if they know the person is a minor. And just to be doubly sure I called my lawyers and asked. You know what they told me? "Do not provide reselling services to a minor as you could be held liable for their misuse of said services"

Originally posted by acameron
I am not a sue happy guy and for instance I am completely against those crazy fat people suing McDonalds. Hey I want to McDonalds 2 a day when I worked near them of course I gained 60lbs and new why. But it was my fault for being to lazy to drive down to subway and buy a sub.

Letting a minor run a potentially liable business is not illegal but it does leave the service provider liable if they know the person is a minor. And just to be doubly sure I called my lawyers and asked. You know what they told me? "Do not provide reselling services to a minor as you could be held liable for their misuse of said services"

Techincaly it's illegal in the USA, hence the fact they can't sign legal documents;).

Originally posted by interactive


Techincaly it's illegal in the USA, hence the fact they can't sign legal documents;).

This one I can not argue with;)

As long as nothing illegal is being done on their servers (IE kiddie porn, gambling in certain areas, money laudering, fraud, etc) they are not responsible for what people do. What if Tim was older, a legit business, and was doing great, was making $300k a year, but suddenly went bankrupt. Would you still say sue the host?

Of course not. The host is not responsible for one's business failing (unless the host is screwing up, which in this instance is not the issue, it is Tim). the host is not liable for a business (legit or not) making money and what the owner of the owner does.

And as already mentioned, Tim is a minor and therefore everything must have been done in the name of a person "of the majority" and they can be gone after as they asume responsiblity, and his parents as they are responsible for him until Tim himself is of the majority.

Ahh but the whole point is people are complaining tim is being a fraud!

Originally posted by acameron
Ahh but the whole point is people are complaining tim is being a fraud!

Fraud? How so? I am talking fraud as in fraudulent electronic fincial transactions. If his host was aware of those, they are obligated to be whistle blowers. If Tim was a poor businessman (and I ahte to use the word poor as it is much wrose than that) they don't have any right (nor grounds) to go cry wolf.

Ok this is my last post in this article because I can see you and I are going argue this one till we are both blue in the face.

1)I fully believe Tim's guardian can be held liable for his actions.

2)I fully believe the service provider should share some liability for knowingly allow a minor to operate in such a fashion as they do. (off topic: His provider allows a LOT of unscrupulous things)

These are just my opinions and my opinions are supported by my attorney. But since I am not suing him nor being sued my opinions and those of my lawyers don't mean to much;)

1) Agreed.
2) IF all they know is that hes not the nicest most honest guy... No. If they know something as you say, than yes, they are held aliable (percentage most likly to be determined in an arbitration forum).

ummm , you dont sue tim , or his parents . You sue the business . This is a civil matter , not a criminal case . This post should be closed , as we can all see , the poster seems to have "lost" interest .

Case, with all that has gone on, I am sure they can find SOME criminal charges in there as well.

The issue is that there is no businesss. It was a kid operating out of his parent's house.

If you want to talk to the guy who started this thread, he's on AIM right now (AAAgainstAll), just to let you know.

How can it not be criminal matter? Sure, they can sue him in the civil court over bills, but what Tim has been doing to people is fraud.
Is it possible to have AIM conversations as part of evidence? Would they be accepted just like ICQ history?

this thread is dead, it was 100% hoaxes lets drop it

Originally posted by DarktidesNET
Anyways, some places I think you can sue 17 year olds, either way, he's his parent/guardians responsibility and you can hold them responsible for fraud and all of his actions, regardless of his age.

...but you can get the death penalty in the Commonwealth of Virginia and many other states after the age of 16! :O)