What's the going rate for Tier 1 bandwith at a co-location facility? ATTT, Exodus, Sprint, ....

Per Mbps. I don't need more than 5Mbps. I'm not really asking for a solicitation, I'm just wondering if I am overpaying at my facility.

Thanks!

exodus bandwidth = $550/Mbps + $2500/setup (not really any volume discounts unless its some SERIOUS volume)... heh...
exodus rackspace = $800/rack/month + $600/rack/setup

heh... that much i know... :)

verio quoted me like $300/Mbps ... but they seemed quite negotiable on it... plus can find resellers of theirs that are like $90/Mbps... heh

Hey netdude,

Are the Exodus numbers retail pricing or the product of some significant negoitation?


Is the pricing for rackspace in a shared environment or in a private cage?


Also, for some of these companies, like Exodus, with lots of PoPs (Points of Presence) is the pricing the same at each facility or would pricing at one facility be higher/lower than the next?

Thanks for the info.

Also, for some of these companies, like Exodus, with lots of PoPs (Points of Presence) is the pricing the same at each facility or would pricing at one facility be higher/lower than the next?

Pricing is different between PoPs. It may be $500 for a rack in bumble **** nowhere ohio yet $1300 in NYC.

thats kinda their standard rate... they don't take well to negotiating (a bit too arrogant if u ask me)... the rackspace... shared amongst their racks... i think they also have a half rack option as well... and their damn sales team is so annoying... calling back like every day 'till you order something... if i were you, get as much info out of them asap then make sure they have the wrong number... LOL (j/k)...

the rackspace price i have there, specifically for the santa clara datacenter...

oh... and if you go over the amount of bandwidth as noted in the contract, you get charged a premium... like $600/Mbps n stuff... kinda pathetic if u ask me...

Originally posted by netdude
oh... and if you go over the amount of bandwidth as noted in the contract, you get charged a premium... like $600/Mbps n stuff... kinda pathetic if u ask me...

Don't most providers charge you for overage over the contracted amount? Or are you just saying that Exodus is especially excessive? On a side note though, as far as I know, Exodus is the only provider that does there 95/5 billing on both upstream and downstream bandwith (the combined total, not the higher of the two). Not too nice. :bawling:

What's the general consensus on who has the best facilities amongst the major companies?
Exodus, Equinix, Digex, MFN, Switch & Data?

Who is the best bang for the buck?

What's the general consensus on who has the best bandwidth amongst the major companies?

Who is the best bang for the buck?

For bandwith I can't say I'm too excited about the C&W (Exodus) network (peers seem to be going down quite often, apparently no alternate routes, and speeds don't always impress... and the myexodus portal is utter junk). Amongst the different providers we use I would have to say that Above.net (MFN) is #1 followed by Internap.


Any thoughts?

You can get better pricing from Exodus than what was posted (I got quotes from them 6 months ago from Chicago).

For about 5 Mbps direct from a "Tier 1" provider you are probably looking at about $300-800 per Mbps.

I negotiated Verio down to $1650 for 5 mbits at Verio's sterling facility for 2 cabinets. They require you to get a minimum of 2megabits per rack/cabinet.

<edit>they told me that the only way i'd get that is if i purchased both of the racks:( </edit>

I can probably get cheaper if I go along with their partner program.

best bang for the buck... peer1.net ... EXCELLENT network from what i've seen... $125/Mbps on 40Mbps commitments n stuff... peer1, although they are tier2, blow most of the guys i've seen outa the water for the buck... hehe... but best performance... exodus and internap top the list...

hmm... RackMy.com, i don't doubt what you're saying... but... i received quotes from exodus on 1Mbps, 5Mbps and 50Mbps... they kinda... umm... suck as far as negotiating excellent rates (like level3 and verio, <$150/Mbps by 100Mbps i m pretty sure)... the thing i hate about exodus (with a passion) are their insane setup fees... hmm

nrsoftware, i see you are hosted at exodus yourself... but it seems you are in one of their slightly obscure datacenters? in cali... but i've never even heard of the city... from what i know, their santa clara and washington dc datacenters are the best... it seems their atlanta operations are more merged with the c&w network than the other locations... which i dunno... i guess it could be a bad thing, i guess it could be a good thing... because it seems that the majority of the exodus peers were brought into the c&w network (and c&w passes the data onto exodus)... but then again... the exodus network itself (as far as topology, latency, routing, etc) is better than the c&w... so... hmm...

but c&w has fiber going between like 90% of the major cities in the US... :) so no bouncing around cities to get to the destination... :) (and no, they are not just hiding hops in between... hehehehe)

http://www.globalcompass.com :)

Good rates

but globalcompass ain't tier1... somehow waddles into tier2 but generally speaking tier3... hehehe... ?

heh besides they have their pricing on their site.. which tier1 provider does this?

they all want you to haggle with their sales force, and their sales force wants to haggle with you to get as big of a commission as possible

Originally posted by netdude
best bang for the buck... peer1.net ... EXCELLENT network from what i've seen... $125/Mbps on 40Mbps commitments n stuff... peer1, although they are tier2, blow most of the guys i've seen outa the water for the buck... hehe... but best performance... exodus and internap top the list...

I've used peer1.net here in Toronto, and they are a little bit more expensive in their Toronto facility than their Vancouver facility. Eiher way, they have a mighty fine network. If you only require a small amount of bandwidth they can be a little bit on the expensive side.

Their network quality is great, although latency has been really high for me, (at some times) but most of the time they're great.

All in all I recomend them. :agree:

oh, sorry... wasn't clear... peer1 price i mentioned, that was for chicago... vancouver is probably more expensive than toronto actually (we're gettin' scr*wed i know... $5CND/GB... ~ $1500CND/Mbps... $1000USD/Mbps... ouch, eh? but thats not in volume... in volume probably more like $600-700USD... lol...)

primus canada here in vancouver is roughly $400USD/Mbps... but... hmm...

Originally posted by netdude
but globalcompass ain't tier1... somehow waddles into tier2 but generally speaking tier3... hehehe... ?

Hello,

Depends which package you go with...

I Call UUNET / InterNAP / Level3 tier 1 bandwidth providers....

Originally posted by netdude
oh, sorry... wasn't clear... peer1 price i mentioned, that was for chicago... vancouver is probably more expensive than toronto actually (we're gettin' scr*wed i know... $5CND/GB... ~ $1500CND/Mbps... $1000USD/Mbps... ouch, eh? but thats not in volume... in volume probably more like $600-700USD... lol...)

primus canada here in vancouver is roughly $400USD/Mbps... but... hmm...

Actually, Vancouver is where you could buy the cheapest bandwidth (from peer1). That's where their headquartered. Toronto is just a little bit more expensive than Vancouver. Montreal has around the same pricing as Toronto.

net-dude - What rates did you get at Exodus for the 1Mbps and 5Mpbs?

Also, at Exodus, they used to sell 1/4 rack and 1/2 rack and of course a full rack. Now, they start out at 1/2 rack. I think the 1/2 rack is about $500.

The 1/2 rack and full racks are in a large common cage.

Originally posted by anantatman
I negotiated Verio down to $1650 for 5 mbits at Verio's sterling facility for 2 cabinets. They require you to get a minimum of 2megabits per rack/cabinet.

<edit>they told me that the only way i'd get that is if i purchased both of the racks:( </edit>

I can probably get cheaper if I go along with their partner program.

Anantaman

That's a fantastic deal. Where is the Sterling facility? What is the partner program and how much of a better deal do you think you could get?

Originally posted by netdude
nrsoftware, i see you are hosted at exodus yourself... but it seems you are in one of their slightly obscure datacenters? in cali... but i've never even heard of the city

Netdude

Our actual website is hosted in Exodus' Los Angeles facility (El Segundo to be more exact). I think the network was much better before the C&W acquisition, not too many good things to say about it now. We have been with Exodus for about five years and since the deal with C&W things have gone downhill. I was appalled to see (as bj4001 mentioned) they were offering shared colo in common cages. I have nothing against the concept, per se, but this is never anything Exodus would even consider in the past. Unless you walked in the door with a check for a minimum of $4k a month they wouldn't even waste their time laughing at you. Definitely snobish, but hey these guys were supposed to be the Rolls Royce of Data Centers.

A couple of months ago, we needed to buy a couple of more racks from them and got some decent price quotes. So as we came to our new racks, lo and behold, they had taken a 32 rack cage and made it into shared colo space. The cage was a mess and they didn't even have a security guard with us to watch and make sure nothing happened to the other customers' machines. I got sick to my stomach and woke up our sales rep at 3AM to yell at him. He basically threw us in a playpen with a bunch of other kids, locked the door behind us and said "have fun!" (Again, to reiterate.... this is not a problem in general, I just never expected these shenanigans from Exodus). Further souring the situation is the fact in a couple on months we will not be able to bring in any new carriers as they will only be allowing C&W bandwdith. Also, their 95/5 billing method is dissapointing. Do any of you know of another company that takes both the upstream and downstream bandiwth and combines them to get the total?

Unfrotunatley, Above.net had to pull out of the LA market (only had about 20 customers in an awesome Data Center) and they were better than Exodus by far (definitely in bandwidth and also in facility).



I would be curious to find out what the best deals on rack/bandwidth pricing people have gotten from the likes of UUNet/Internap/Sprint/Qwest/Equinix/etc.


Sorry about the rant... just brought up some bad memories.... felt I had to share.

Go with peer1.com they are absolutely awesome! I have a contact their his name is evan, you can reach him at egillman@peer1.net

Ben Wilcox
intelliweb, Inc
888-301-7206

I believe their partner program require's you to post up their logo on your proposals, etc.. as well as your website stating that you're a Verio partner.

I don't see anything bad about it, heck, If they give cheaper pricing why not?

The sterling facility is their so called "Premier" data center on the east coast. (The other one is in san jose)

I've been there many times and I was definately impressed with what they had there as far as redundancy, security, research, etc..

I'm also interested in the prices that others are paying for their tier 1 colo's.

Do you think Verio has the same quality as Exodus? The price that anant... got was quite good especially with all the rack space.

I got a quote for $225 Mbps from Level 1 for 5 Mpbs + $500 for rack space. $1500 for setup fees. It is through some provider that uses Level 1. Is this comparable to Exodus quality? The price is much better than Exodus.

It was for Level 3 with 1/2 rack - above post.

www.internetpulse.com ... done by the same guys as boardwatch ... although these figures don't really mean much, they do give a relative representation of network quality... c&w always comes in first pretty much... then qwest... verio is always last... heh

as exodus is integrating with c&w, i think it might get a bit better... cuz yeah, they had brought most of their direct peers on the exodus network to c&w and just increased connectivity between exodus & c&w... but with the integration, fibers between most cities, helps along quite a bit... :) note: worldcom also has fibers between most major cities... :)

i think verio's value is in its asian network.. after NTT bought them out , they're pretty much the biggest provider to asia.

citrus, ya sure vancouver is the cheapest? hmm... although my price is a little old, vancouver bandwidth in general is bloody expensive from what i've experienced... i stop colocatin' here like 4 years ago... lol...

Originally posted by bj4001
I'm also interested in the prices that others are paying for their tier 1 colo's.

Do you think Verio has the same quality as Exodus? The price that anant... got was quite good especially with all the rack space.

I got a quote for $225 Mbps from Level 1 for 5 Mpbs + $500 for rack space. $1500 for setup fees. It is through some provider that uses Level 1. Is this comparable to Exodus quality? The price is much better than Exodus.


$500 for a half rack in a non-carrier neutral facility seems a bit pricey... Although the $225 Mbps is pretty good for a "Tier 1" provider with only a 5Mbps commitment.

As far as the Verio/Exodus comparison I can only speak to the Data Centers I have seen in California. In Los Angeles, both providers are very subpar as far as their facilities are concerned, but at least Exodus has its own Data Center not just a couple of square feet in an office building like Verio has. In Northern California, Exodus is slightly better but the facilities are comparable. Neither of them can hold a candle to UUNet or Equinix or to a lesser extent MFN for that matter. The Verio sales department definitely does not have the pretentious feel some of the other guys do (especially since the NTT deal) and they will do what it takes to earn your business.

The internetpulse.com app is interesting but it doesn't reflect what we have experienced in our facilities. For us, Above.net has been the most reliable and the quickest, followed by Qwest, then UUNet, then C&W. We no longer have Geniuity or Sprint (bad experiences) but they were pretty deplorable when we were with them. I would be interested to find out how they are doing now, along with AT&T (I've heard good things about them). I know some companies in Level 3 that aren't too pleased with the service but can't complain about the pricing.

If price is the only concern Epoch will sell you their mother to get your business. Just name your price and they will bite. Although, I don't know how finnancially stable they are (I wish MFN never had to file Chapter 11).

Probably the worst of them all is Winstar (not Tier 1). Avoid them like the plague.

Hey NRsoftware, at least tell me they weren't racks in the exodus data center that they were locked cabinets with all sides secured :D, i'd hate to think if it was just bare racks, locking cabinets wouldn't be too bad though (i do agree though, i who doesen't prefer private space?)

Originally posted by porcupine
Hey NRsoftware, at least tell me they weren't racks in the exodus data center that they were locked cabinets with all sides secured :D, i'd hate to think if it was just bare racks, locking cabinets wouldn't be too bad though (i do agree though, i who doesen't prefer private space?)

Porcupine

That's why I was in tears when I saw what Exodus was doing. Never in all my years had I seen something like this (I confirmed that this was something relatively recent with one of the techs) from Exodus. They were (still are) using 2 post open Chatwsorth racks that random customers shoved their junk into and had wires messily strewn all over the place. People even had equipment hanging from the rack. You could easliy bump into someone elses equipment or trip over their cabling. And if you were actually malicious the possibilities are endless. Also, like I said earlier, no security guard was there with us. Exodus has really gone downhill since we first started with them. There is no way any company could "brag" about being in Exodus if they purchased some of that shared space (kind of defeats part of the purpose of being in an Exodus).... don't even think of giving customers a tour of the facility with that setup.... really embarassing. I didn't think there was such as concept as mom & pop colo, but these guys come pretty damn close.


As bad as Verio's setup is at least they seperate customers from each other (private cages, or 1/2 and 1/4 rack cabinets).

Wow!

Thats something i'd expect to see from a data center like our own suite, where we are the only ones who have access to it, we give short tours at most, just a kind of "yes, this is the equipment, yes, we are legitimate" type of tour for those who enquire, not as a way to show off, just to make the customers feel secure if need be, i would definatly not expect that in resold space where private access was granted.

At first i thought you were at least talking about cabinets (because frankly i was going to call you snobbish if you said it was such a problem with locking cabinets), but thats just terrible to hear, what did they do to make it better? anything? did you walk out on the contract as a result, or what, i can easily imagine having servers in a place like that, but not basing a company out of it, and DEFINATLY not at the rates exodus wants :eek2:.

Originally posted by porcupine
Wow!

Thats something i'd expect to see from a data center like our own suite, where we are the only ones who have access to it....

At first i thought you were at least talking about cabinets (because frankly i was going to call you snobbish if you said it was such a problem with locking cabinets), but thats just terrible to hear, what did they do to make it better? anything? did you walk out on the contract as a result, or what, i can easily imagine having servers in a place like that, but not basing a company out of it, and DEFINATLY not at the rates exodus wants :eek2:.


Oh don't get me wrong. If its your own data suite (you are the only one who has access) or your own cage then who cares about cabinets? As long as there is some form of physical security making sure the appropriate people have access to the machines and everyone else does not then there is nothing to fret about.

It was a pretty big fiasco... We never knew they even had such a setup so when we agreed upon the numbers we figured it was the standard locked cabinet (which I must admit are pretty good, better than most other cabinets) or a half VDC (2 rack private cage). They dropped us off in front of what seems to be a standard 32 rack private cage. We thought a (one) customer was already in it so we asked the tech guy what was up? Why are we going into someone else's cage? We thought it was just a mixup. Then the tech tells us that its a shared cage. You can't imagine the look of horror on our faces when we hear this. We raised holy hell and the only thing they did for us was tell us they could upsell us into a VDC. Needless to say we were not too happy, but we had a government contract that was set to go live in 2 days and we were stuck between a rock and a hard place (we were already there with our servers fresh out of the dev environment). So we ended up purchasing some locked 46U cabinets instead.

We are not basing our company out of Exodus, our website happens to be there, but we are in a number of Data Centers across the country. We were in Exodus before this incident we just didn't know that the shared setup existed. The client requested that the servers be housed in Exodus so we didn't have much choice.

The exodus shared racks are just that. A bunch of equipment in a common rack with no separate cabinets.

Here is another thing that needs to be mentioned with Exodus. If you are in the shared cage area and do not have a full rack, then you also share the power strips with your rack buddy.

What do you think is the lowest rate per Mbps I can get from Exodus. I need about 4Mbps. What did/are you guys paying?

Ahh, yes, makes sense, i wasn't implying any offense to that, i have the same feeling, noone aside from my staff can get into our space, so it's never been an issue for us.

We're possibly getting space in a newly lit cogent dc sometime soon, unlike our current setup (over 250sqft of private suite space), this would be in a higher priced facility, with locking cabinets, i have to say i'd agree, if there wasn't cabinets that locked, i dont think i would have even considered it.

Maybe i should write a review when im done, i'm schedueling a tour of the 151 front data center in toronto, specifically the bell nexxia colocation space :D, all i can say is, theres some very ambitious people that we're working with on this (including bell i must say) and i hope everything goes well, its too bad bell wants soo much for their bandwidth (approx 575 usd/mbps at 10mbps commitment), but it's carrier neutral, so what the heck (the poor bell tech wanted to know what customers though they needed to do to compete with the changing market... man that was a hard answer to get across, "stop selling a $1 candy bar for $10!" :laugh: ).

I'm at the Exodus facility in El Segundo and I am definately overpaying. I've been there for a bit. I need to renegotiate the contract or take off. So I'm trying to find out how low I can go. Thanks!

Originally posted by bj4001
The exodus shared racks are just that. A bunch of equipment in a common rack with no separate cabinets.

Here is another thing that needs to be mentioned with Exodus. If you are in the shared cage area and do not have a full rack, then you also share the power strips with your rack buddy.

What do you think is the lowest rate per Mbps I can get from Exodus. I need about 4Mbps. What did/are you guys paying?

Good to see someone else in the El Segundo facility. In case you are in the shared area, I didn't mean to imply that it is a bad situation, just that something I never would have expected from Exodus (they are used to dealing with clientele that pay significantly higher MRCs). As far as pricing, I think you could get them under $450/Mbps if you negotiate with them.

BTW: bj4001 - Where are you situated in the Data Center (if you are in the shared cage I asume all the way in the back right corner behind the sliding doors. If not, do you have cabinets? I am particulary impressed by the size and quality of their cabinets and RPCs. Send me PM if you want to talk about this further.

You have over 250sq feet in private office space and you want to move to rent out overpriced racks!? You sure could fit a lot of machines in that space :stickout why the change?

ryce... think about it... why would anybody want to colocate in a datacenter when they can just stack the servers in the corner of their office... hmm

netdude: actually, our space is in the digiport miami building in florida, its not a office building :)

and ryce, quality of services means a lot to me, priority colocation isn't my business, it's my baby, and since i refused to fight with the bottom of the barel by going "yea, 900 gigs of transfer for 99/mo!" people want to see some quality, i've added quality services, but this extra push should give the complete solution for the more serious customers, which is who i want to target a little more.

that and the people providing our current bandwidth broke 2 agrements, and are behind on their bgp4 upgrades, my customers want service, i shall deliver, simple as that, even if it does negate most of my profit margin in the process.

porcupine, hehe... i know i was trying to be sarcastic in my post... :)

Netdude: having 250sqft in a private suite is far better then cabinets that are 5x the cost in another facility, but i've got plenty of reasons its worthwhile for us.