Hi,

Just to make sure: This is not a hosting request. Just would like a price estimate.

How much would a server with the below specifications cost if I buy it in one time, and how much if I rent it (just an estimate for both, it is also possible you type how much you normally ask for such a configuration per month):

- Dual Intel Xeon 2 Ghz (does this exist yet, if not just read highest possible)
- 2 GB of DDR RAM
- 2 x 18 SCSI Disks
- Anything else needed to provide power to the server :D

Jacco

Purchase cost of ~3000 with raid controller, assembly, burn-in. Monthly rental of ~850 with bandwidth, space, spares.

George

you'd save yourself a lot of money just going for a AMD Athlon MP dual setup...

Either way, you'd either be doing heavy cgi or db to need more than a celeron or p3. =)

George

appro.com

PoweEdge 2650 - $4,000.00

Originally posted by RackMy.com
PoweEdge 2650 - $4,000.00

just check dell website, the server cost more than $4000.

haha, id say go get a mobo+cpu bundle (cheaper that way), get a case with a decent powersupply, add some hds and mem, and you're good to go, much cheaper

agreed ^^

DIY will be much cheaper.

This configuration costs $2788.54 at Interpromicro.com. You still get only quality parts (Supermicro) though. Interpromicro is definitely worth being checked out :)

just check dell website, the server cost more than $4000.It's about $4000.00 our cost.

Remember, cheaper is not always better :)

Wow! I was thinking of $5000 dollar so this turns out good :D
It is not the price, I rather pay more for a faster solution. It is about the quality. I know this is rare on this forum these days (no offense), but I rather pay a lot more for good quality than end up broke because of too many server downtimes of slowlyness...

Jacco

Then Dell would be a good option!

Are those Dells for Linux of does is not matter? Just what you install?

Dual Pentium 4 2.0 Ghz
2GB of Ram
2 18GB SCSI Drives

rent this for $488.00 a month!

Originally posted by Shane
Dual Pentium 4 2.0 Ghz
2GB of Ram
2 18GB SCSI Drives

rent this for $488.00 a month!

Oopsies. Bad Shane, Bad. :angry:


:cool:

George

Originally posted by tilted


Oopsies. Bad Shane, Bad. :angry:


:cool:

George

No, not bad. I asked how much a host would normally charge for such a config. So it is good!

jacco

Originally posted by Blikje
Wow! I was thinking of $5000 dollar so this turns out good :D
It is not the price, I rather pay more for a faster solution. It is about the quality. I know this is rare on this forum these days (no offense), but I rather pay a lot more for good quality than end up broke because of too many server downtimes of slowlyness...

Jacco

go for these then

http://store.sun.com/catalog/doc/BrowsePage.jhtml?cid=48598&parentId=48589

~~ OR ~~

If you lots of money then this one will also be good

http://store.sun.com/catalog/doc/BrowsePage.jhtml?catid=48619

Originally posted by mahinder


go for these then

http://store.sun.com/catalog/doc/BrowsePage.jhtml?cid=48598&parentId=48589

~~ OR ~~

If you lots of money then this one will also be good

http://store.sun.com/catalog/doc/BrowsePage.jhtml?catid=48619

I like the $621,400.00 priced one :D I will buy this, and than put it in a Cogent connected NOC :D
But to be serious, how can someone be asking $621,400.00 for a piece of fabriced sand?

You might want to check out Aberdeen: http://www.aberdeeninc.com/ I've bought MBoards/CPU's from them and I've been very happy. I'm toying with the idea of their 1U or 2U :D.

Frank

Originally posted by Blikje
But to be serious, how can someone be asking $621,400.00 for a piece of fabriced sand?

How can some ask 10 times that to play a game?

:rolleyes: baseball

dude, please dont get a dell. i cant begin to tell you about how many people who wish they hadnt.

dont get intel xenons. there pathetic. i can build you a computer for an excellent price. im not some big company, but i build cpmputer here and there and give people advice.

http://www.berkeleycomputerbuilder.********
sure its not a great website, but im not allienware or some other large computer builder, im just 1 guy. i dont even charge that much or make money doing this, i just like tinkering with computer hardware.

trust me, ive had to convert alot of my moms friends from plopling down $1500 on a dell or compaq, and have let me build them a better computer for a thousand.

Lian Li pc-76 case [full tower aluminum w/ window, awesome]
2 athlon 2000 mps
giga-byte dpxdm+ dual board
2gb crucial ddr266 [4x512mb reg]
2 WD 120mb w/8mb cache [raid 0 if you want]
lite on 16 dvd
teac 40x cdrw
gf4 ti 4200 [128mb]
intel gigabit ethernet
santa cruz sound card
vantc heatsinks
tons of case fans
antec true550 watt supply
windows 2k [authentic new cd] [will update to service pack 3]
at your door shiped insured fedex home delievery for $3000 [3-5 days]

thats an awesome deal. thats the best deal for the money. for $3000 thats a great server. you wont finda better deal. i make a few bucks, but im not gouging like all the others people. thats the best for a small server -- short of moving into the scsi world.

thats 1 hell of a deal if you ask me. even if you dont order from me, you can email witih your questions. moooseboy84x@yahoo.com

The problem with that server setup is that your including a heck of alot of features that aren't needed in a server - both a dvd drive and a cd-rw? A gf4? A windowed Lian-Li case? Yes it may be a good desktop system (ok very very good as a desktop system) but as a server you'd be better off spending the money spent on the fancy case, graphics and cd-rom drives on a rackmount case and decent raid card.

The other thing with going with a company such as dell is that you know the server your going to get will be of high quality, has been tested and will work. Then you've got the support. You know that they'll be their when you need it most.

Just my £0.02p ;)

Originally posted by Blikje

- Dual Intel Xeon 2 Ghz (does this exist yet, if not just read highest possible)
- 2 GB of DDR RAM
- 2 x 18 SCSI Disks
- Anything else needed to provide power to the server :D

Jacco

$2400 :)

15k RPM on the 18GB SCSI drives.
2 GB DDR ECC Registered Memory.
2U Case.
Name Brand Mother Board.
Dual P4 2.0 GHZ.

High Speed, Dual Athlon Systems, can be done for under $2000.

Originally posted by mooseboy84
dude, please dont get a dell. i cant begin to tell you about how many people who wish they hadnt.

Maybe for desktops. I had an employer who bought dells for the whole company a few years ago. Trying to upgrade even the memory was a nightmare (it may have changed now) and put me off using Dell for a desktop.

However, when it comes to servers our experience is that they are excellent. Our Poweredges just run and run and run.......... I would be hard pushed NOT to use a Dell server unless money was tight or I was convinced that it was worth the change. Any time we've had a problem with a server it wasn't a Dell that was having it.

ugh, alot of people who have small servers use them for more than just basic server activities.
they play games on them and do other things. rackmouts are not needed for small servers.
scsi is nice to have, but to keep prices low the WD 120gb with 8mb has the performace that can rival some 10k scsi. plus, there is no 120gb scsi. the most is like 73gb, and those drives are $650 each.

i could get a dual board with 4 120s in 0+1 on a rocked raid card. you dont need the lian li case or the cdburner, but its nice to have. he could just use a $75 cheiftec fulltower case with a gf2 mx 200 32mb to cut cost or whatever.
that was just one option. if he wants to go with a $650 64bit adaptec dual u160 card i can do that. i was just showing something that i felt was a good entry server.

I have never ran 1U dell servers but I admin a few Poweredge 6300 and 2300 and I tell you they are pretty dependable. I mean REALLY dependable.. the last admin "built" his own servers which lasted about 1 1/2 years then about a year before I came here they bought the 6300's.. they run flawless.. we have alot of duals along with 2 quads.

Originally posted by vigor

High Speed, Dual Athlon Systems, can be done for under $2000.

thats true they can be had for less than $2g. but what i offered
Lian Li pc-76 case [full tower aluminum w/ window, awesome]
2 athlon 2000 mps
giga-byte dpxdm+ dual board
2gb crucial ddr266 [4x512mb reg]
2 WD 120mb w/8mb cache [raid 0 if you want]
lite on 16 dvd
teac 40x cdrw
gf4 ti 4200 [128mb]
intel gigabit ethernet
santa cruz sound card
vantc heatsinks
tons of case fans
antec true550 watt supply
windows 2k [authentic new cd] [will update to service pack 3]

is about $2600 with ca tax shiped to me from newegg.com. add a good $100 for shipping to him with insurace, and your left with $300 for me to pocket. thats a big amount but less than what others will charge. i built a dually for my friend with xp 1800s on a msi board and it was less than $2000. just depends on how muc hyou have and what you want.

OK, I posted this above, but it just seemed to wizz by everyone. Anyone have an opinion on this one from Aberdeen (http://www.aberdeeninc.com/ABCATG/Stirling-S15.htm)?

A few less drives than the Dell, but otherwise the same config. They have a 5 year warranty, which seems pretty good.

I also have to agree with the people above. If this is for a serious web server, It needs to be in some sort of a rackable case. Putting a tower of some sort into a coloc is just too expensive.

Frank

dude, you should not get xenons. there not worth. the amd mps trample over them.
read this article
http://www.linuxhardware.org/article.pl?sid=02/07/17/0152229&mode=thread

Originally posted by mooseboy84
dude, you should not get xenons. there not worth. the amd mps trample over them.
read this article
http://www.linuxhardware.org/article.pl?sid=02/07/17/0152229&mode=thread

You shouldnt always beleive what you read. From personal expirience(25 built servers under my belt), the Xeons are much more suitable for web serving. They are built specifically for web serving and workstations. In result, their is less heat produced, more performance where it counts. When using other chips, designed for overall use, you have alot of technology into chips that is not needed at all in a server such as 3DNow, Se2 etc.

While the AMD processors are far supperior for home PC's, there is no major benefit using them in servers other then cost. When in comparisson to server model cpu's.

As for your server combination, its a good system. However there are plenty things in that system, which will have no use in a server. The servers I have built, get generic video cards, sound if any, floppy, cd-rom. None of those components are needed in high performance name brand models. Floppy drives, CD-Roms, are only used primarily from the start to install the desired OS and software. Video is only needed to provide a console.

When building a server you are primarily looking at the two most important factors which would be Hard Drive & Memory. Servers are not heavily reliant on the CPU, but better yet usable memory, and the access rate on the hard drive.

The Western Digital drives, are awesome drives. When compared to your average 10k RPM SCSI, however when compared to high performance models, the Western Digitals, fall behind.

Just some friendly advice :)

Well I did go to read the article but... The benchmarks were deleted becuase the author was not sure of the and he said he was running benchmarks for a workstation, not a server.

I'm interested in getting a box that servers up PHP and MySQL as fast as possible. That's all that matters to me.

Frank

you guys are harcore webmasters, im for the the average small website, mutli function unit. it doesnt matter. get what you feels best for you. ive built 2 servers, both of them were for websites and game servers. im not into this harcore rackmount stuff. you can still by your own rackmounts and build your own computer though.

and amd mps are still better:o

I think you can do better then dell

Supermicro 1U SuperServer 6012P-6 Dual Xeon;
Adaptec SCSI RAID Controller 2005S;
2 CPU Intel® Pentium 4 Xeon 2.0GHz 512K Cache;
2048MB DDR PC2100 ECC REG.;
SCSI HDD Seagate Cheetah 36ES 18.4GB 10kRPM SCA ST318406L
Total: $2,824.06

or
Supermicro 1U SuperServer 6012P-6 Dual Xeon;
Adaptec SCSI RAID Controller 2005S;
2 CPU Intel® Pentium 4 Xeon 2.0GHz 512K Cache;
512Mb DDR PC2100 ECC REG.;
SCSI HDD Seagate Cheetah 36ES 18.4GB 10kRPM SCA ST318406L
Total: $2,350.97

or even something like this

Supermicro SuperServer 1U 6011L Dual Pentium III;
Adaptec SCSI RAID Controller 2110S;
2 CPU Intel Pentium III 1.40GHz Server 512K Cache;
2048MB SDRAM PC133 ECC Reg.;
SCSI HDD Seagate Cheetah 36ES 18.4GB 10kRPM SCA ST318406L
Total: $2,475.63
or

Supermicro SuperServer 1U 6011H Dual Pentium III;
Adaptec SCSI RAID Controller 2005S;
2 CPU Intel Pentium III 1.40GHz Server 512K Cache;
2048MB SDRAM PC133 ECC Reg.;
SCSI HDD Seagate Cheetah 36ES 18.4GB 10kRPM SCA ST318406L
Total: $2,447.51
This model has a better board, and has raid on it.
You can probably even do better on price if u look for it

In my experience, Dell have always been rock solid on reliability and pretty good with performance.

DIY solutions are great for home use but not many will come with, Hot Swap Redundant Power Supplies, Hot Swap drives/drive bays, 1U Case (obviously possible tho - as JBIZ has shown).

One often overlooked but quite important point - make sure the server you buy will fit in your providers racks - Dell's tend to be deeper than most rackmounts and the latest ones we've got were delivered with even longer rackmounts than normal.

I agree with vigor - Xeons are a completely different ballgame for multiprocessor servers - especially db servers.

I would also say that you will get better performance & reliability from a Dell over a "white box". Dell spends a lot of money on R&D and it shows

Originally posted by mooseboy84
you guys are harcore webmasters, im for the the average small website, mutli function unit. it doesnt matter. get what you feels best for you. ive built 2 servers, both of them were for websites and game servers. im not into this harcore rackmount stuff. you can still by your own rackmounts and build your own computer though.

and amd mps are still better:o

The reason for using rackmounts Mooseboy84 is because when you buy rackspace in a datacentre you buy it in 'U's, with 1U being the smallest amount you can buy (usually). Therefore if the average desktop box is say 3 U and it isn't rackmount you are going to use 3U for the server and 1U for a shelf and you are then paying for 3U that you don't really need. Thats why most server manufacturers now do 1U rackmount servers and it is pretty much the standard until you need more drivespace or processors than you can fit in a 1U box.

Originally posted by RackMy.com
I would also say that you will get better performance & reliability from a Dell over a "white box". Dell spends a lot of money on R&D and it shows

They also spend a whole lot of money on putting a goofy looking dude on TV telling people to buy their products. :D

But we do have a good number of Dells here... And they work just as well as the other smattering of servers here... Supermicros, Netras, Gateways, Xserves, HPs, Compaqs... Properly configured and well written software, pretty much any box will do well. We'll use whatever our client asks us to use, but Supermicro is a pretty good bang for the buck.

George

Properly configured and well written software, pretty much any box will do well.I would disagree with that. We also have a large number of Dell servers and We have had a bad RAID controller and a couple of failed drives. That is it!

I wish I could say that for other boxes. The custom build 1Us are the ones that always seem to have the most problems :(

I would like to add that none of the systems i mentioned are white boxes.

Supermicro is a very solid hardware company. I just wanted to point that out so people do not get confused.

Originally posted by mooseboy84
and amd mps are still better:o

I am not going to argue with you on this one. I completely agree, with my last post, you might have thought I was thinking the AMD's are not a good choice. When they are really good CPU's. But when compared with the server/workstation geared Xeons, they fall behind. I would chose the MP's over any processor in the server field except the Xeon. The MP's are just as good, if not better than the tualtalin p3(512k). Xeons, however are quite expensive, that is why I usually do not suggest using them, unless the person usually demands them.


FFeingol, for serving php & mySQL swiftly. I would recommend something along the lines.

1 or 2U Case (2u is usually better for cooling purposes)
Dual P3/MP (2GHZ+)
SeaGate 15k RPM - 18.4GB - 160MB/Sec Transfer - 3.7 MS Seek
2GB DDR Registered Memory.
3Com Network Card
Basic video, sound, floppy, cdrom etc

For a system like this, it would run you $1800-$2200. Depending on the builder.

Mike,

My fault... OK... I'll be perfectly sober soon. Communicating thoughts well has been a task tonight. :) This is what happens when you have a big refrigerator and a grill in the parking lot at the data center. I should have had a sober nocmonkey write today's posts. :)

Anyway, the part you quoted was a run-on response to a previous post about which server would be most powerful for an application. Using equivalent systems from different manufacturers will yield relatively similar performance unless under extreme load. Regarding reliability, we haven't experienced any different number of problems with home-built systems over well recognized brands... If anything, there's a particular Gateway here that needs kicks regularly, and has had a few drives replaced. We also have a colo Dell that seems to be a lemon, failing drives here and there. We have a few cabinets of Supermicro-built systems, and they've been fine except for one DOA motherboard and a power supply that fried after almost a year in service. Then again, we also have a client with a cabinet and a half of chenbro+tyan/supermicro who has had a myriad of problems, not to mention assembly headaches. Let's not even mention a half-cab of Cpq 1850s. Ugh. What a pain in the butt those are. :uzi:

George

Well overall that states George that any hardware you buy whether direct and custom built or through a major retail chain like Dell or Compaq, can have problems.

My personal preferences with servers are both IBM and Supermicro. Second Choice Dell.

My overall total preference is supermicro based on price to hardware ratio.

Originally posted by JBIZ718
Well overall that states George that any hardware you buy whether direct and custom built or through a major retail chain like Dell or Compaq, can have problems.


I was attempting to communicate that point. Another reason for why we don't release servers on the same day they're ordered... I want to see it run flawlessly for 2-3 days until we release it.


My overall total preference is supermicro based on price to hardware ratio.

Agreed, as stated in a previous post. The bang for the buck, and the ease of final assembly, really makes Supermicro one of our favorites. Now if only they could make themselves look less cheap, that would really rock.

George

Originally posted by vigor


I am not going to argue with you on this one. I completely agree, with my last post, you might have thought I was thinking the AMD's are not a good choice. When they are really good CPU's. But when compared with the server/workstation geared Xeons, they fall behind. I would chose the MP's over any processor in the server field except the Xeon. The MP's are just as good, if not better than the tualtalin p3(512k). Xeons, however are quite expensive, that is why I usually do not suggest using them, unless the person usually demands them.


FFeingol, for serving php & mySQL swiftly. I would recommend something along the lines.

1 or 2U Case (2u is usually better for cooling purposes)
Dual P3/MP (2GHZ+)
SeaGate 15k RPM - 18.4GB - 160MB/Sec Transfer - 3.7 MS Seek
2GB DDR Registered Memory.
3Com Network Card
Basic video, sound, floppy, cdrom etc

For a system like this, it would run you $1800-$2200. Depending on the builder.

Where can you get that server for that price?

Originally posted by Matrix


Where can you get that server for that price?

I build computers/servers, and that is usually what I charge for such a system. All components are also covered by warranty :)

Vigor,

Check out this article from anandtech.com (http://www.anandtech.com/IT/showdoc.html?i=1606&p=1). They ran a database server benchmark with AMD Athlon MP's vs. Intel Xeon's. That's a much more useful comparison for me.

Frank

Originally posted by ffeingol
Vigor,

Check out this article from anandtech.com (http://www.anandtech.com/IT/showdoc.html?i=1606&p=1). They ran a database server benchmark with AMD Athlon MP's vs. Intel Xeon's. That's a much more useful comparison for me.

Frank

Thats a solid review, I will give you that. However I do not base my opinions on what other people think, I base them on personal expirience. When buying a car, you read reviews, that will bring you to the car dealership, however you would not buy a car just based on reviews, you would want to test drive and look it over before buying. I have test drove both a dual xeon (550mhz 1mbcache system), also p4 xeon systems, and a dual athlon MP system. Some areas, the athlon notches out the xeons and vice versa. However considering all the area's of server applications, the Xeon slightly notches out the MP's. While the MP systems give you the most bang for the buck, their is concerns with heat, and thermal death. A server application relies on reliability, say an inproperly installed heatsink looses contact, unless your motherboard has intergrated thermal protection. You CPU is fried, and your server is at a loss. IMO both systems are great, either are a valid choice.

It was just nice to actually find a DB benchmark, since that is primarly what I'll be using it for. They also had a good mix of DB applications which is useful.

Frank

vigor:

Someone on these forums pointed me to:

http://www.qsol.com

I have not used them, but am contemplating buying one from them. They also allow you to do leasing of the hardware, which means it would run you about $65 a month for 48 months! Put that with colocation, and your spending $150 or so a month, whereas you would be spending $800 a month if you were going to get a dedicated setup of the same caliber!

For that price, grab two and get a personal SQL server going as well ;)

Anyone know of any benchmarks like the AnAndTech one, but for PHP, Cold Fusion, CGI, or ASP? I've been interested for some time to see both how different server setups compare as well as how PHP compares to ASP or Cold Fusion for serving up dynamic content.