Ok, I think that I definately have missed something. When I first entered the ***** webpage, I thought it was nice. I went to check out their products, I said..hmm, good packages, good prices. Then I entered the Reseller section and realized that if I put enough effort into this project, I would be making lots and lots of money in the near future, if I purchased their Standard Reseller Package. Later I surf into egroups at goggle and see a bunch of people talking pure sh** about ***** and how bad they are. So far, ***** has done nothing but provided me with excellent support and answer to all of my questions. About a month ago I signed up for webhosting with them and a domain name, unfortunately my AMEX did not have signature on file and the card declined for the amount owed. They usually give you 2 weeks to pay, but they gave me 1 month!

Now, I have already purchased a domain name for my new hosting company, I am already designing the site, and I am just about to buy the Standard Reseller program from ***** for $60 startup and then $49,95 monthly. One thing that really made me choose ***** is that since I'm in this by myself, I will not need to worry about customer support, this is done absolutely by them, hell I can get my own toll free number and my clients can call this number 24/7/365 for any questions or problems they may have,and they still won't know it's ***** who's answering the phone, since all of this is done anonymously so they will always think it's my company their calling. Try to find another reseller program that gives you this!

Nevertheless, I am not arrogant, and of course I value all of you guys opinions, tell me, is ***** a good place to start as a reseller? are they reliable? do they cheat? do they rob people's money?....so basically, is becoming a reseller with them worth the trip??? Thanks !

Well you wouldn't be a reseller *really* Just put up a site, and sit back waiting for the checks to roll in. I haven't used them, so I couldn't say, but to me there something very disconcerting about allowing a total stranger to handle support issues for my customers.

There has been megabytes of pages produced about people having major issues with support with them. If this becomes a factor regarding your own company, it's *you* that will get bagged, not them. After all the customer believes it's you answering the phone right?

Were it me, I'd feel the gap between myself and my upstream would be too big, and that they wouldn't have my best interests at heart...

Greg Moore

You will see a lot of ***** bashing. Truthfully, we don't get many supporters through here, only the disgruntled for the most part. They have *beep*loads of clients and I'm sure the majority have no problems.

That said, I suggest you check out the following similar reseller plan (actually the same company with two different plans, and an additional ensim plan no listed below):

http://www.olm.com / http://www.webaxxs.net
Also see a discussion list:
http://www.topica.com/lists/olmwebaxxsusers/read

Finally, aside from all this, why not consider one of the hard working hosts that frequent this board that you can talk with and discuss various hosting issues (have some fun with)?

See: http://webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?threadid=3053

As a former ***** client, I can offer you my own experiences with them. I promise not to bash, :) only to tell you the facts.

1) I signed up for a year pre-paid as a reseller. I had the same plan as you, only I was going to do my own tech support. The fees came to about $300 for the year. Imagine my shock to find my credit card was charged $960 ~ the fees had been charged to me THREE TIMES. I e-mailed ***** twenty-two times to have it fixed. They assured me it would be taken care of on six different occasions but I never received a credit. I called them on the phone four times to collect my credit. Twice I was disconnected ("accidentally") and twice I was assured the credit would be processed "immediately." The credit never came. Nine months later I filed a complaint with the BBB and sent ***** a certified copy of the complaint. At last, a credit for $681 (the $600 plus interest) appeared 48 hours after the certified letter was received. :)

BTW, they never responded to the BBB complaint. I continue to wrestle with my credit card company (Advanta) who refuses to acknowledge my card was used fraudulently and they are still attempting to collect fees on the matter.



2) Three months after signing up with *****, I changed ISPs at home for dial-up access and e-mail. I had set up my ***** server to forward all e-mail to my home ISP account. When I moved to the new ISP, I updated all my settings immediately. On eight different occasions during a nine-month period, my e-mail settings were reverted, without warning and without reason, to my OLD ISP. The only way I would know this happen is I would stop getting e-mail. The e-mail was forwarded to a black hole I guess, never bounced, never appeared. Many customer orders were lost and many customers would get absolutely irate that I was "ignoring" them. :( ***** insisted that I changed my settings, that their system was "incapable" of doing this. When I showed them my raw access logs to show that I had not accessed that DAY, let alone at the time this happened -- surprise surprise, they had no response.

So if you don't mind magically missing e-mail, ***** is a fine choice. ;)


3) While setting up custom-branded control panels I believe, I followed their instructions to a "T" -- and then when I went through the "front door" to test the system that I had just set up, I got script errors. I repeated the process several times. More script errors. It said something "wasn't installed." I tried to install the shopping cart too, but it gave me errors about a whole script missing! I submitted support tickets and escalated them per their instructions and was told that the system "worked fine" and I must be doing something wrong.

So after going back and re-creating the issue I copied EVERYTHING and sent THAT as a reply to the ticket and ~ after four days ~ a support technician wrote to me to say he was sorry, he had installed the drivers "incorrectly" on my site but he had just re-installed them now and his test showed they should work fine.

The shopping cart never did work, :( but since I didn't use a shopping cart, I didn't go after them for it.


4) My site was offline for two weeks over the Christmas holiday which cost me over $12,000 in lost sales during that time. This was during the heat of the Beanie craze, I was selling Beanies, and I had well over $12K retail value stock ready to ship out. I was devastated and had to work out "special arrangements" with the bank to (a) not lose my inventory loan and (b) get coverage for the thousands of dollars I now owed TY and could not pay.


5) When I called tech support to ask when my site would be back up, they said "three hours." After 18 hours I called again and was told "about 9 more hours, we're close to a resolution." After 12 more hours I called again and received a busy signal. The busy signal went on for a week.

Tech support had taken their phones off the hook. :(



6) I abandoned my annual fees and foolishly went to AITcom. Well that's another story. I will always be thankful to AITcom for getting me back online during the most horrific time of my webhosting life. Of course that was their greatest accomplishment, it all went downhill from there.


==============

By all means if this is the level of service you want your customers to receive, please go with *****. You'll be well-rewarded for your time.

If, however, you are a perfectionist like me, :D who expects the scripts to work smoothly and without fail, who expects scripts to be well-rounded and easy to use.... who expects their website to be UP... who expects to receive tech support resolution in less than FOUR DAYS (remember, my e-mail problems were NEVER fixed, and that was a 9-month-long issue).... who expects their customers to be treated with respect and to have their problems fixed, not to be given the run-around...

To achieve these things, I must suggest:

(1) do your own tech support. Your client base is such that they will appreciate your personal touch and consideration. Besides they probably won't need much help. My clients rarely call.

(2) Go with a reputable reseller who has earned their marks by ACTIONS, not advertisements and bought ratings. I work with Ventures Online http://www.venturesonline.com and I think you'll find that their packages are very, very competitive.

***** is a master at marketing. :) I know, I was sucked in too, by their sweet-lookin' website and "great deals." You've only been there a month... just wait and see... your service will go downhill too. They make their money in new clients, not client retention. That's why they're heavy on advertising, so-called awards, etc. etc., and have historically been poor on support and performance.

You're still in the honeymoon period. Everything probably IS still fine with your site. So NOW IS THE TIME to leave, before Real Damage is done. Be careful not to get a bad name in your local area, because if a couple of clients get burned by your web host, they still think it's YOU who let them down, and word travels FAST in the local business community. Don't risk it. Invest in a good host.

Kudos to you for doing some research. It's not too late! Good luck!

:D Bailey

My experience with them was over a year ago, but I'd have serious reservations about letting *****s tech support handle my support calls. In my experience it means long waits on hold and bored, indifferent reps once you finally do get through to them. Yeah, you might get some customers out of the fact that you're advertising 24-hour phone support, but how long will you keep them if that support is substandard?

Again, I don't know what that situation might be like currently, but I wouldn't want anyone on the phone with my customers who doesn't answer to me. Hey, call me a control freak.

WoBber,

If you ask for advice, and you seem to get the same response from most people, I hope to god you take it. My tip:

You shouldn't be in the hosting biz if you are incapable of handling your own support issues. Your clients will expect you to have the knowledge required to solve their issues. If you don't, your business will not last long and your reputation will take a beating.

I have heard too many stories describing the incompetency of *****. It's up to you, but it sounds like you started off on the wrong foot already.

Originally posted by tabernack
WoBber,

If you ask for advice, and you seem to get the same response from most people, I hope to god you take it. My tip:

You shouldn't be in the hosting biz if you are incapable of handling your own support issues. Your clients will expect you to have the knowledge required to solve their issues. If you don't, your business will not last long and your reputation will take a beating.

I have heard too many stories describing the incompetency of *****. It's up to you, but it sounds like you started off on the wrong foot already.

Tabernack,

I never said I was not able to handle my support, I have years of experience with both Unix and NT. What I meant was that if ***** offers the support with the package, it will make the whole thing easier for me, since I will have more time to take care of the business and accounting part of the company. Anyways, after doing too much research on the ***** Reseller program, I have decided to NOT go with them. Although I have called them many times, and they do see extremely nice, and have always solved all my problems and having no complaint whatsoever about them, there seem to be too many people not happy with them (although I haven
t seen a single complaint from anyone of you after Dec 2000) therefore I will go with what everyone says, and not even touch them. Right now I have a normal Unix account with them, the one with 2GB of space and 20GB of bandwidth. Been there for about 2 months....not a single problem...but ok.

****
WoBber

You're right. It would be easier if someone handled my support issues. But I can't see how they could provide the level of support I feel my clients deserve when they have 50,000 + clients.

Keep up the research and I'm sure you'll find a solution to suit your needs without having to compromise anything.

Originally posted by tabernack
You're right. It would be easier if someone handled my support issues. But I can't see how they could provide the level of support I feel my clients deserve when they have 50,000 + clients.

Keep up the research and I'm sure you'll find a solution to suit your needs without having to compromise anything.

I've been researching quite a lot actually...and so far, the host that I find most useful to do my reseller on is http://www.hosting24-7.com , the only bad thing with them is that they charge quarterly, so you can't have a month to month plan :( But they offer 24/7 phone support to their resellers, so that in case you can't answer questions to your clients yourself, you have them backing you up. What do you think? And are there any other reseller plans that anyone would want to recommend?? I aim to have big packages 200MB-300MB with unlimited bandwidth, I'm not really that interested in 10 MB reseller accounts...Thanks !

Hi WoBber,

OUCH!! You used the U word!! I think if you look around this forum you will find A LOT of comments about companies that offer Unlimited Bandwidth. The truth is this:

If a company offers Unlimited Bandwidth, they are liars, plain and simple!

It's impossible to offer Unlimited bandwidth and you will find this out the hard way unless you do your research now. I can prove it too. Sign up with any company you find that offers Unlimited bandwidth and try using 20GB+. I can guarantee they will shut you down within a few weeks. Bandwidth costs money, it's not free, and as much as I would LOVE to have unlimited bandwidth myself, it's not a reality.

Originally posted by tabernack
Hi WoBber,

OUCH!! You used the U word!! I think if you look around this forum you will find A LOT of comments about companies that offer Unlimited Bandwidth. The truth is this:

If a company offers Unlimited Bandwidth, they are liars, plain and simple!

It's impossible to offer Unlimited bandwidth and you will find this out the hard way unless you do your research now. I can prove it too. Sign up with any company you find that offers Unlimited bandwidth and try using 20GB+. I can guarantee they will shut you down within a few weeks. Bandwidth costs money, it's not free, and as much as I would LOVE to have unlimited bandwidth myself, it's not a reality.

Trust me, that is exactly what I thought. But I called their support and I talked to them (excellent support btw) and I asked them if I could even use 100GB if I wanted to and they said YES and NO there will not be any charges, and I could even press charges against them if they did not comply with what they said. Thing is, I believe that unlimited bandwidth is possible with some companies AS long as they DO NOT offer unlimited space. For example, these guys offer 200 MB of space, and if you want 100 MB extra it costs you 17 dollars extra/month. I mean, since they put the storage limit to 200 MB, they can control how much bandwidth you use, and therefore the "unlimited" would not be the same as the "unlimited" if you would use a 600 MB account. So yeah, it really is unlimited, and if they charge me or shut me down for using 50GB per month....then I can press charges against them...
What is your opinion on this??

Originally posted by WoBber
I can press charges against them...
What is your opinion on this?? Well, for one thing, you couldn't "press charges against them." There'd be no criminal action in their shutting you down, and lying isn't against the law; your only legal course would be civil. They'd be being more accurate if they told you that you could sue them.

Typically, and I don't know if it's the case here, hosts that claim to offer "unlimited" bandwidth include a couple of loopholes for themselves. One, as you point it, is the limit on diskspace which makes it unlikely that you'd be able to use astronomical amounts of bandwidth without going over the space limit.

Another is to state that if your site's cpu usage is excessive, they can cancel your account. And of course there's no way for you to know if it is, and they typically don't state how they'd define "excessive."

Another is to restrict what you can use the site for: very often you'll read in Terms of Service documents that you can't use your "unlimited" bandwidth for such things as image galleries or sound files, only for html pages. That is, they limit your ablility to use a lot of bandwidth by not allowing you to do anything that would use a lot of bandwidth.

And, typically, they get to decide unilaterally what is excessive cpu usage, and what is a violation of the policies on the types of files being served.

If any host that claims to offer unlimited bandwidth uses these restrictions to control your bandwidth usage, they're technically not lying. In my opinion, they're still being deceptive.

"Sites with picture galleries (This is any site where 50% of the files transferred is graphics)"

This is one restriction they list where a violation could get you kicked off at their discretion.

Since web page graphics (<img src= ...) are separate files and individually transferred it would appear that if you average more than one such graphic on each page you have hit the 50% mark.

Gary

Depending upon who your clients are, this might be a significant issue.

I own a specialty gift shop and have a comprehensive online catalog & ordering system for our #1 stationery line. For each .html page, I might have anywhere from 2-36 small product images on it, plus 2-36 "Add to Cart" buttons, plus navigational images on it.

Altogether my disk space on the shop's site is about 18 MB.

Thank heavens my site is not popular. I have never transferred >400 MB in bandwidth in a single month. And I have signed up on a 10 GB transfer plan, so I still have room to grow, and my transfer levels are very "safe." Also due to the nature of the traffic, I don't have to worry about spikes or huge hogs (like extensive cgi's or multimedia).

The simple point being, if you cater to retail business online, they are likely to have far more images than .html pages.

Then, in contrast, I consider one of my resold accounts, which is a family-operated catering business. The only images are navigational, and three product pictures. Everything else is html pages. Much different balance.

Conclusion: "know thy customer" I guess. :)

Just a couple of thoughts. ;) Good luck in your search.

:D Bailey