Free Advanced Web 2.0 Builder? [Archive]

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projectwebdev

01-02-2008, 05:43 AM

Jay August

01-02-2008, 08:08 AM

It's no way Dreamweaver online, but it looks very nice.

projectwebdev

01-02-2008, 08:26 AM

Why do you think it isn't like Dreamweaver on-line? I think I was able to do a lot of what I do with Dreamweaver with the webnode on-line toolbar. I was surprised at how fast it generated a web site with web 2.0 content.

I think I am trying to justify why I should use software like dreamweaver when these free web tools are just as good, if not easier to use. It would be interesting to hear your take, or another other.

Jay August

01-02-2008, 09:05 AM

I prefer Dreamweaver over this because:

DW has excellent code coloring support
DW has built in FTP/SFTP capabilities
DW has full support for a LOT of components
DW has a great intelliSense system that saves me a lot typing on code
DW is far more than just a site editor
DW is faster :)

projectwebdev

01-02-2008, 09:07 AM

Thanks for your thoughtful reply.

DW has excellent code coloring support -- ok
DW has built in FTP/SFTP capabilities -- Webnode has these also. File Manager is powerful.
DW has full support for a LOT of components -- So does webnode.
DW has a great intelliSense system that saves me a lot typing on code -- Webnode is a drag and drop builder and lets you add code
DW is far more than just a site editor -- So is webnode
DW is faster -- Webnode builds websites far faster than DW. webnode is fast, no fee, no installing software, design from anywhere in the world (all you need is access to the internet).

the_pm

01-02-2008, 10:09 AM

Just wondering if anyone else has used webnode (webnode.com)? I am reading blogs about it at the moment. Its like dreamweaver on-line.

I think it could be the most powerful free web builder on the internet.

Thanks

Happy New YearI just went into the demo. Holy Jesus - that's some of the most unsightly, bloated markup I've ever seen in my life :eek:

You only need to go five lines deep into the demo to see that the developers of this software lack the proper knowledge in front-end markup to create software like this.

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8" ?><!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd">

<html xml:lang="en" lang="en" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml">
<head>
<base href="http://cms.demo122.webnode.com/" />
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8" />^^ Emphasis added, just in case the blaring mistakes don't slap you in the face.

I'm sure it makes a fun toy, but I wouldn't take this seriously. Dreamweaver isn't great in these respects (WYSIWYG editors generally are not), but it's better than this! I'm sure the development team is brilliant on the backend - the software appears to be put together pretty nicely. But it produces garbage, and in the end, the end product is what counts.

What blogs lead you to this software? I'm interested in seeing what they have to say.

projectwebdev

01-02-2008, 10:16 AM

the blog was on adticles. just search adticles webnode.

I think what you posted isn't a major error. It will not generate any problems unless you used an XML parser for some reason. I think what you pointed out is good but in no way reduces the impact of what the site can do. It still builds advanced working web 2.0 websites.

projectwebdev

01-02-2008, 10:44 AM

amy did it produce some problem for you? what sort of problem did u get? i can't see it having any impact on what i designed.

projectwebdev

01-08-2008, 04:36 AM

Still works for me. I don't see that error either. Maybe someone is pulling my leg here.

the_pm

01-08-2008, 09:49 AM

Still works for me. I don't see that error either. Maybe someone is pulling my leg here.Well, a quick search on Google shows a Netizen by the name of "projectwebdev" copy/pasting posts about this product in every Web development forum he can find, ostensibly looking for feedback, getting rather defensive when someone doesn't agree that this is a good tool. "projectwebdev" did a big sweep this morning - one could only assume WHT was on his list of sites to update about this product.

I think when a company has to resort to either pretending it is its own user/customer or hiring shills to spam the Internet in order to get the word out, it is in a very sad thing to observe indeed. Is Webnode one of these very sad companies? I'll leave that for the readers to decide (obviously I've concluded as such).

This Webnode product doesn't even come close to replacing professional development tools or professional knowledge. Its build is faulty, and it is bloated in ways one would expect such a tool to be. If you're not affiliated with the tool, then you'll have no problem with this - you asked for feedback and you got it. If you are affiliated with this tool, shame on you for trying to mislead the various communities in which you've been posting.

the blog was on adticles. just search adticles webnode.
"Adticles

Advertising Articles"

You weren't reading a blog. You were reading an advertisement disguised as a blog. It says so right at the top of the page. Oh, the sadness...

silverboltz

01-08-2008, 11:46 AM

I've played around with it a bit. I dable in web design and sometimes customers want something easy they can do themselves and I might suggest this to them. Still trying out all the features though.

Jay August

01-08-2008, 11:53 AM

amy did it produce some problem for you? what sort of problem did u get? i can't see it having any impact on what i designed.

It's 'amygdela' thank you very much. It did impact what I designed, mainly because I lost full control over my codings. I NEVER EVER use a WYSIWYG editor, because they all just plain suck and run away with my code, to return it into one big mess.

Well, a quick search on Google shows a Netizen by the name of "projectwebdev" copy/pasting posts about this product in every Web development forum he can find, ostensibly looking for feedback, getting rather defensive when someone doesn't agree that this is a good tool. "projectwebdev" did a big sweep this morning - one could only assume WHT was on his list of sites to update about this product.

I think when a company has to resort to either pretending it is its own user/customer or hiring shills to spam the Internet in order to get the word out, it is in a very sad thing to observe indeed. Is Webnode one of these very sad companies? I'll leave that for the readers to decide (obviously I've concluded as such).

This Webnode product doesn't even come close to replacing professional development tools or professional knowledge. Its build is faulty, and it is bloated in ways one would expect such a tool to be. If you're not affiliated with the tool, then you'll have no problem with this - you asked for feedback and you got it. If you are affiliated with this tool, shame on you for trying to mislead the various communities in which you've been posting.

"Adticles

Advertising Articles"

You weren't reading a blog. You were reading an advertisement disguised as a blog. It says so right at the top of the page. Oh, the sadness...

The sadness indeed... But isn't this blatant advertising then?

the_pm

01-08-2008, 11:59 AM

The sadness indeed... But isn't this blatant advertising then?Assuming I'm correct, yes. Let's see what OP thinks...

Jay August

01-08-2008, 12:39 PM

http://www.google.com/search?q=projectwebdev&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a

He must have a very, very good reason to clarify this ;)

the_pm

01-08-2008, 03:16 PM

BEWARE!

From their TOS:
4.3 You acknowledge that by posting materials on the webnode site You grant to Us and Our licensors and assigns an irrevocable, perpetual, royalty free, worldwide licence to use the materials both within the webnode site and in any other manner. The licence extends to copying, distributing, broadcasting, and otherwise transmitting, and adapting and editing the materials.Anything you publish using Webnode becomes property of Webnode! :eek: There's no policy regarding the use or sale of private information either. The application cannot be downloaded or used off the Webnode site. If you attach your own URL to your site, Webnode is still your host, and the information you publish still becomes their property. I have no way of confirming this, but it would appear the underlying purpose of Webnode is to harvest data. Get a couple million sites going, and you'd have a treasure trove of images, content, contact information etc. signed off to you on a silver platter, ready for marketing, selling, whatever they want to do with it.

I can't think of any other reason the host would claim ownership of the materials its customers host with it.

I created an account to see how the system works. It is not a Web site builder, at least not in the same vein as WYSIWYG editors like Dreamweaver. You choose a template, and you can make minimal adjustments to it. You can switch between general layouts (one, two, three, four columns), and you can add new content areas. I couldn't find any way to change the size of individual elements, swap out main graphics, change the size of the page (or make it fluid), and there doesn't seem to be any way to control the pages at a code level. If you add too many items to the navigation, it craps out. It even appears various content areas are completely predefined! If you choose a certain template and layout, that box on the left is going to be a contact box, whether you like it or not!

The interface is very slick, but in terms of its usefulness, it's about on-par with 20 Minute Web Sites (http://www.20minutewebsites.com/), a low-cost Web builder that a developer local to me launched six or seven years ago. At least Webnode's results look nicer. But this tool can't be compared to Dreamweaver (I don't like Dreamweaver, but I recognize it for what it is). They're not even the same type or class of tool. Webnode is a fun Web toy wrapped up in a dangerous TOS!

Paul-M

01-08-2008, 03:56 PM

You're basically comparing a online, flash version of paint, with something like Photoshop. It might be a good tool, but don't even compare it to Dreamweaver (I dont' love it either, but it saves some time, and it is what it is).

projectwebdev

01-14-2008, 05:12 AM

Thanks for the response. Yes I am posting to other web sites. I don't think that is a crime. I believe in a free world where I can post anywhere I like.

I want to get as much feedback as I can. Some of those web sites didn't produce any feedback. Some did. I did like the feedback I got, even here, but the conspiracy angle the_pm has is a bit overboard.

Tin-foil hats next?

I really believe the site is as good as bloggers are saying (which is where the_pm got the info on the terms and conditions from)but obviously pointing out some things like I read here is why I posted in the first place.

The 20 minutes web site you posted costs money. Webnode is free.

projectwebdev

01-14-2008, 06:31 AM

BTW, this was the link I found out about it. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=webnode.com

Hundreds of bloggers wrote about it. I just used this website to see if anyone had any input after search through some posts. I think that is reason enough to be here talking about it.

the_pm

01-14-2008, 11:17 AM

but the conspiracy angle the_pm has is a bit overboard.Really? How so?

According to Webnode's terms and conditions, they own everything you post to their servers. Period. That's not a conspiracy. That's an observation. What they're going to do with it is anyone's guess, and that's exactly the point. You hand over your information, bequest ownership to someone else, and you have no idea what they're going to do with it.

You'd have to be absolutely nuts to do that! But it hardly matters. It;'s not a viable tool anyway - certainly not a replacement for professional software or hand-coding. It's basically a prefabricated template editor with a very slick interface - fun to play with and easily forgotten.

the_pm

01-14-2008, 05:59 PM

Yes I am posting to other web sites. I don't think that is a crime. I believe in a free world where I can post anywhere I like.So long as you're within the rules of the communities in which you're posting, you are correct, you're free to do so. Since we're in a free world and we're allowed to post what we like, I'll do exactly that! Check this out...

Apparently you're not very patient when looking for feedback:

01-02-2008, 04:43 AM - WHT
01-02-2008, 04:56 AM - Dev Hunters
01-02-2008, 05:28 AM - Webmaster-Talk
01-02-2008, 05:41 AM - NamePros
01-02-2008, 09:32 AM - Web Design Forum (recommend signing up, yet you're trying to evaluate the software?)
01-02-2008, 10:00 AM - Estetica Design
01-02-2008, 10:46 AM - CSS Chat
01-02-2008, 10:52 AM - Accessify Forum
01-02-2008, 12:58 PM - Coded FX

In every single case, you signed up solely to "ask" about this software, and they're all copy/paste posts.

But we know you're shilling for Webnode.com because of this:
I asked: What blogs lead you to this software?
You said: the blog was on adticles. just search adticles webnode.

One little problem. You were posting about this software on Dec. 21
Posted by: projectwebdev Dec 21 2007, 10:33 - WebDesignerForum.co.uk
2007-12-21 06:00:19| Web Design Forums.net

Yet, the Adticles advertisement was published on December 22!

Amazing - you managed to post a link to this software before you actually discovered it!

At a certain point, you just have to say "ok, I wasn't using good judgment. I shouldn't be pretending I'm a third party. I just wanted people to try my software," instead of continuing on with this farce. You're only hurting yourself here. You've already had a few of your make-believe reviews removed from other sites (Web Dev Forums and Killersites nuked your posts, to name two), and you've been called out repeatedly for shilling on a number of communities. As I said, you're really doing your product a disservice continuing to pretend you're a third party. Whether you're the actual software developer or employed by them to spread the word, people don't like to be deceived in the manner you've been doing across the Web.

BillBrown

01-14-2008, 06:17 PM

Eclipse is freaking amazing. You can get module plug-ins for java, PHP, Python, SVN and a lot more. Did I mention it's free? Fandiggity.

projectwebdev

01-15-2008, 05:24 AM

The_PM, Yes your right. Some of my posts got nuked and others did not. That is the way it goes when you discuss a web link or software on forums.

However, I have done absolutely nothing wrong by asking people what they think of this software and to suggest that I am in some way trying to deceive people by asking them what they think of it means that I am trying to make you or anyone else believe something that is not true. I just think these free web sites are very powerful in what they can do and that it probably challanges traditional web developing software.

I am simply asking about FREE web sites and what people think of them. You are the one talking about paid $$$$ Solutions to the same thing.

Blogs where up around christmas time 2007 from what I remember. I am really not going to go around playing net detective. We can all data mine and push/select evidence to make a claim while omitting that blogs are up in the thousands and plenty of people are talking about webnode.

If you think it's bad news to learn about a free web builder, then so be it. I don't and neither did those bloggers.

I just wanted to know if people used that website to create free webs. It's FREE stuff i am asking about.

If you think there is a conspiracy then so be it. I will put on my tin-foil hat and join you in reading from my crystal ball. I didn't expect this topic to turn into drama but so be it, lol.

projectwebdev

01-15-2008, 05:47 AM

the_pm

01-15-2008, 10:44 AM

By the way the policy you quoted from the blogger who posted it back in late 2007/2008 was changed after the blogger noted it.

So you got that from the blogger and not from the WebNode website and continue to assert that it is still there when it isn't.Nice try, but no. the policy was changed within the last five days. My observation was made prior to its removal, and was made after I read it on Webnode.com directly. The screenshot will clear this up.

Just so you understand, the issue here isn't the quality of the tool. The issue is your integrity, in your efforts to spread the word about your application pretending to have no connection to it. Threads don't get removed for no reason. I'll bet the reason for the removal has something to do with your IP.

See, Webnode.com is registered to Westcom.cz, located in Brno, Czech Republic. Tell us - does this town sound familiar? What is Westcom.cz's IP range? I'm guessing you know exactly what it is. See, this is the type of information that gets posts removed from communities and gets members banned from communities where moderators do their due diligence. I noticed a couple more have dropped over the past few days. I suppose people are starting to catch on.

Don't bother changing the whois information for your domain. Just like looking up your TOS, there are caches available that show historical whois info as well.

The Webnode.com tool is what it is - whatever. But the person who is pushing it around the Internet is perpetuating a huge lie about himself and his connection to the product. That speaks to the integrity of the product. We would be doing you a really big favor by removing this thread (technically, this thread is against WHT rules because members are not allowed to shill on WHT), but it may serve the community's interests better to leave it in sight. This isn't the first thread you started on WHT, is it? What was the reason the previous one was deleted?

This would be a really good time to come clean, for the sake of you and your product's integrity. You're making a somewhat weak but still promising product look really bad right now...

I am really not going to go around playing net detective.Of course not. It won't work out very well for you. There's nothing selective about asking you where you heard about the product and then discovering you were posting about before you heard about it. That's just bad math on your part. You should have chosen to "discover" this product from a blog that doesn't conflict with your posting history. That might have corroborated your story enough to stop me from matching your IP information to your site's whois.

By the way, you're correct about one thing. Your tool is light years ahead of 20 Minute Websites. They are the same type of tool, but yours is much better. I was even kind of impressed at how well your tool handled some baic usability tests, like font resizing and user style sheets. The markup is still bloated, and still shows a fundamental lack of understanding regarding how the Web works. But the end result is better than many template editors I've seen. It's just shame it's being promoted in such a deceitful manner.

the_pm

01-15-2008, 03:40 PM

Well, you've been reading and reviewing this thread thread for the past five hours with no response, and at this point I can't see any justification to allow you to continue with this self promotion. So the thread is now closed.

If you're concerned this thread will adversely affect your product, feel free to contact the help desk to discuss its contents - I recommend full and complete honesty if you desire a favorable outcome.

WHT does not allow shilling or other unethical posting behavior, and Webnode is not exempted from this rule.