I thought I posted this already, but I must have gotten distracted when it was time to press the "Submit New Thread" button. I saw this banner ad in WHT:

Dedicated Servers from Saburovo.com from $145 a month
- 1300 MHz Intel Celeron processor w/256 KB L2 cache
- 1 GB (1024 MB) of RAM
- 2 x 60 GB hard disk
- Red Hat Linux
- 4.2 GBit connected datacenter
- Your choice of Ensim, Plesk or cPanel control panels
- $0 setup fee and no contract

Click here to see the details!
So I clicked to see the details:
Saburovo
Dedicated Servers

RACKSHACK 1300
- 1.3 GHz Intel Celeron processor (256 KB L2) / 1 GB RAM / 2 x 60 GB hard drives
- 400 GB/mo. of transfer
- 4.2 Gbit connected RackShack's datacenter from
$145/mo

FDC SERVERS
- 1 GHz Intel Celeron processor / 512 MB RAM / 40 GB hard drive
- Guaranteed 2 Mbps (650 GB/mo.) of transfer
- FDC datacenter with no overage transfer charge from
$129/mo
So I clicked on RACKSHACK 1300:

Saburovo.com
DEDICATED SERVERS
DEDICATED SERVERS
- All datacenters
- FDC Servers
- RackShack
- upgrades
SUPPORT
- forums
- bandwidth usage
- e-mail support

WEBMASTER
By clicking "Subscribe" link below you confirm that you understand and accept:
For servers located at RackShack data center:

RackShack's Terms of Service (TOS)
RackShack's Acceptable Use Policy (AUP)
Please allow 24 hours after you subscribe to setup your server and provide you with login and password details.
You will not be charged before you provided with the server.

CPU RAM Hard Disks Control Panel Transfer Data Center Monthly
Intel Celeron 1 GB 2x60 GB Plesk 2.5.3 400 GB RackShack $175
Intel Celeron 1 GB 2x60 GB none 400 GB RackShack $145

All servers have no setup fee and no contract.

Notice the $145 has NO Control panel, as falsely indicated in the "come on" banner. The $175 package has Plesk, but not CPanel. You have to pay extra for CPanel. The "escape word" in their sucker ad is "from" ("from" $145 a month). But to include the paragraphs under that clause regarding "your choice of Control Panels" to get you to read further is snakey.

This kind of "bait and switch" advertising should be monitored by the moderators of the forum, or whomever is in charge of advertising.

This company admits to having servers at RackShack Data Centers. I just hope they are not RackShack in disguise. If they are, I've just lost the respect I had for RackShack.

Please.

When I see an ad for the newest mac powerbook and it says "speeds up to 800Mhz" from $2499, I have enough common sense to realize that the computers start at $2499 for the lowest end model.

ALL companies do this, describe their best product and their lowest priced version's price. I haven't noticed too many companies bragging about their lowest end product along with their most expensive product's price.

There is nothing misleading about it, you just have to know how to read and understand English.

Dedicated Servers from Saburovo.com from $145 a month
- 1300 MHz Intel Celeron processor w/256 KB L2 cache
- 1 GB (1024 MB) of RAM
- 2 x 60 GB hard disk
- Red Hat Linux
- 4.2 GBit connected datacenter
- Your choice of Ensim, Plesk or cPanel control panels
- $0 setup fee and no contract

Click here to see the details!


from == starting at

hahaha
someone needs to get out more :)

If you can post a link to the ad you saw, we'll review it. That's about the best I can offer for now...

He's talking about the ads on the top of the forum.

I should know better than to tweak the tiger's tail. LOL

I don't think theres anything you can do about it subuavo = Headsurfrs friend ;)

Originally posted by dhabets


from == starting at

When a company puts a list of features along with their "starting-at" price, it's generally accepted that those features can be had for that price, with the "necessary add-ons" (like a useable amount of bandwidth, IPs, etc...) sold as extras at a premium and taking up the slack. This practice is particularly common with car ads.

I agree with the-muse - the ad is misleading, at best.

-Bob

Originally posted by edude
I don't think theres anything you can do about it subuavo = Headsurfrs friend ;)

equal rights is all i have to say

I fail to see the problem here

For Chicken:If you can post a link to the ad you saw, we'll review it. That's about the best I can offer for now...
http://www.webhostingtalk.com/adclick/adclick.php?bannerID=23&dest=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.saburovo.com%2F&ismap=

To TMX...... yep... you got it...
To Tetraboy... what makes you think I'm a "he"?
To edude...I don't think theres anything you can do about it subuavo = Headsurfrs friendyou old rebel, you... of course I can do something about it... I can look somewhere else for a dedicated server. :dunce:

I see what you are saying, and I don't 100% disagree with your concern to tell you the truth, however I don't 100% agree with it either (good points made by other members as well). My suggestion is to email Michelle at whtads@ev1.net and express your concerns, as you at least have the right to explain your position.

Dedicated Servers from Saburovo.com from $145 a month
- 1300 MHz Intel Celeron processor w/256 KB L2 cache
- 1 GB (1024 MB) of RAM
- 2 x 60 GB hard disk
- Red Hat Linux
- 4.2 GBit connected datacenter
- Your choice of Ensim, Plesk or cPanel control panels
- $0 setup fee and no contract

Click here to see the details!
Yup, I would have to agree with the others that the above is misleading advertising.

For those that think the Control Panel is an obvious "add-on" and requires more money, why would you think that. Why wouldn't you think the OS or hard drive is also an "add-on" and requires more money? It's also false in the sense that there "is" a contract! Two of them apparently:
WEBMASTER
By clicking "Subscribe" link below you confirm that you understand and accept:
For servers located at RackShack data center:

RackShack's Terms of Service (TOS)
RackShack's Acceptable Use Policy (AUP)
I'm not sure what a "Subscribe" link has to do with obtaining a Server nor, if the connection between Saburovo.com & RackShack is ever explained -- never visited the site in detail. If I wanted a Server from RackShack then I would go to RackShack and deal directly.

I would also agree that the Marketing or Legal Dept. (not a Moderator, although a Moderator should bring it to their attention), needs to review and enforce the WHT policies & procedures to make sure Advertising is on the up & up. Wouldn't want to see "paid advertising" for Unlimited Web Space or Data Transfer now, would we? :D

If I saw an ad that said:

Mazda Miata from $19,995!
- A/C
- AM/FM Radio
- up to 210 horsepower
etc.

I expect that the cars costing as low as $19.995 better have A/C and an AM/FM radio. The ad is misleading.

I am sorry to hear you feel you were misled by our advertisement. Please write to me directly and suggest what changes do you think we should have in the ad in order for you feel comfortable with it.

I am always amazed to find again and again what helpful and friendly people WebHostingTalk readers are.

My e-mail is sales@saburovo.com

Only a few changes would be needed:
Dedicated Servers from Saburovo.com
As low as USD $145 per month and includes the following:
- 1300 MHz Intel Celeron processor w/256 KB L2 cache
- 1 GB (1024 MB) of RAM
- 2 x 60 GB hard disk
- Red Hat Linux
- 4.2 GBit connected datacenter
- $0 setup fee and no monthly contract

Various Control Panels, Server Upgrades, and other add-ons, seperately available.
Click here to see the details!
As you can see, I changed the first line and the last few lines. Makes quite the difference in expectations.

But, if someone can't figure out that "from" means "as low as" or "prices begin at;" I'm not sure I would want them for a customer anyways.

There is nothing at all mis-leading about the ad as written.


[Edit]

Well, now that I have read the ad, over and over and over and . . . then clicked on it; I understand how some may feel it misleading. Because, I too, would expect to find that server with those features for that price.

Ambiguity -- is a terrible thing. ;)

As was said, you have to be careful about listing specific features and giving the price. Car companies handle this in a way that seems acceptable...

Obviously when you see a car on the commercial, it is loaded with the sports package and wheels, etc., and the base models don't look like the car on the commercial. They do say, "From $16,999" but they also add a line, "As shown $18,500" This way you know that the basic car goes for a certina price, however the one with all the bells starts higher.

I don't think the intent was to mislead anyone, rather to cover both what the base servers start at, and what other features are offered. There's probably a slightly better way of expressing this so that it isn't as confusing (to those who feel it is).

To me, I'd expect the features listed for the "from" price, and the ability to get bigger and better than what is listed for an additional charge.

You can see its been changed now:

Dedicated Servers from Saburovo.com from $145 a month
- 1300 MHz Intel Celeron processor w/256 KB L2 cache
- 1 GB (1024 MB) of RAM
- 2 x 60 GB hard disk
- Red Hat Linux
- 5.2 GBit connected datacenter
- Your choice of Ensim, Plesk or cPanel control panels (for additional fee)
- $0 setup fee and no contract

I think that ad is fair. I have never seen an ad that says: Here are the specs for our low-end product and the price for our high end product. People act on price, much like you did.

You were 2 clicks from buying a server - pretty good marketing I would say!

Mike

Of course, the intention was to mislead, just like car companies do. Does that make it right? No.

Originally posted by chrisb
Of course, the intention was to misleadI am again sorry to anyone who thought to be mislead by the ad. There were no intention to mislead. We changed the ad as soon as I saw the complains.

We are not interested to mislead the customers. Due to not charging setup fees we are insterested in long-term relationship, and will actually lose money if the customer leaves soon after they subscribe to our service.

A well known, and little understood fact: "Marketing is not the same as Selling".

Marketing is to entice people into the door with appealing and sometimes, provocative advertising.
Sales must then follow the path set by Marketing and convince people why they should buy the product/service -- today.

All too often, Marketing will make claims that Sales either, cannot provide, or must explain why, the potential customer mis-understood what was advertised. Not good.

In looking at the original Advertisement, I looked at what was presented to what was provided. There was confusion -- as far as whether it was done on purpose or not, don't know, don't care.


Although the Advertising is now presented in a more "truthful" manner, I still see there is mention of "no contracts" which is not correct. This is not just this company though and is a bain among people when dealing with any company. Similar to presenting Hosting packages with "Unlimited" something, then explaining somewhere else why "Unlimited" has limitations.

Don't know why, it is so difficult for companies (in many areas) to specifically state what type of contracts/agreements are included. When I first looked at what was provided -- by going to the site and looking -- I noticed the statement of "must agree to a TOS and AUP". These are agreements, No? The only difference between a "Contract" and an "Agreement" is in the pronunciation.

Both can be; broken, abused, bent, whatever. In the "spirit" of good business, they are both meant to be followed and are part of the basis, for doing good business.

Maybe it's just me (has been known to happen before ;)), but when someone says, "there is no 'X'", then that is what I expect.

Originally posted by Website Rob
there is mention of "no contracts" which is not correctThe phrase "no contract" is widely accepted among the service industry as the reference to the fact that the buyer is not required to commit themselves to stay with the service provider for 6 or 12 months or any other period of time to get the stated services.

This phrase is also widely used and accepted in hosting industry. I just searched Google for "hosting" and "no contract", and there are some 15,200 sites, which use those phrases, like:

- "domain hosting with no contract"
- "as always no contract is required for standard web hosting packages"
- "web hosting plan at the industry standard price $19.95/mo + a one time $19.95 setup fee, with no contract"
- "No Contract, No Setup Fee Business Card Hosting"

etc.

The phrase "no contract" does not automatically mean that the buyer is not obliged to comply with sellers' AUP & TOS, and actually all those examples mentioned above require you to comply with their terms in order to get the services. I did not check all 15,200 sites, but I have a feeling it is pretty much the case for the rest of them.

Please let me know if this clears the confusion you are referring to.

"Widely accepted" does mean something is true or correct. Something every Parent learns when, at one time or another, their child is upset because "all their friends" are doing it, going there, whatever, and you've told them No. ;)

I hadn't realized that stating "no monthly contract" would be such a strain.

Please re-read my above post about the difference between "Marketing" and "Sales". You'll see I'm not confused at all.

Just a thought: perhaps something like "month-to-month contract" would make everyone happy?

Peter

Originally posted by ckpeter
perhaps something like "month-to-month contract" would make everyone happy?Too late: requested to change to "no monthly contract" to make Mr. Website Rob happy ;)

Tis not me that made any request. Just discussions on wording and clarification. I'm sure the Sales dept. will be happy though, when they can spend more time on selling than on explaining Marketing.

Personally, I think it's a good thing when there is no ambiguity. Cannot always be done -- without lengthy explainations best done by voice -- but the more of us that work to eliminate ambiguity in our Marketing, the better it is for everyone. Good move, dabystru. :D

BTW, feel free to take "me" to task for any Marking I do, that you feel leaves room for ambiguity. :eek2:

Originally posted by dabystru
Too late: requested to change to "no monthly contract" to make Mr. Website Rob happy ;)

Huh? I think you missed the point. It's NOT to make Website Rob happy, it's to make your company more forthright. IOW, it's to help your OWN company, more than helping others, and for THAT you should be grateful to Website Rob.

I think that's probably what dabystru means. :)

Peter

lol

I agree, I'd consider it false advertising. Always be clear about what you're trying to pitch, and if the visitor deems the ad to be misleading, him/her will more than likely direct the business else where.

Eeek!
Looks I forgot to read a few pages hehe. Seems you've already contemplated the issue and it's been resolved. A thousand and one aplogies :lol:

I suppose I should just lock this up so that others don't make the same mistake...